my first disgusted spectator - Page 6

IndyCobra · #**101** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

..... I have a stake in the reputation these cars generate, good or bad.......When you stray to far from the basic recipe you hurt the hobby, the perception of the hobby, you hurt MY reputation as an owner.

As a fairly new person to this hobby, let me suggest that you folks sure are a buzz-kill to the hobby.

lovehamr · #**102** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrickt

Ehhh, I don't know about that. At least with a Windsor you have the right manufacturer, just the wrong size. With a BBC, you kind of have the right size, just the wrong manufacturer. But if you insist on lumping Windsors in 427 cars in to the same dung hole as bow ties in Cobras, then I'll end up agreeing with you long before I take issue with you.

I have a stroked 428 in mine and though it would have been much easier to have put a small block in it, it just wouldn't have been right for me. My next Cobra may get a small block, though it will definitely be a Ford. It's also worth noting that there are some very hi profile Cobra people who believe the 9.5" small block engine is perfect for a "427" Cobra and that includes Bob Bondurant.

Steve

Jerry Clayton · #**103** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 07:44 AM

Ernie

don't forget that there was Olds and Buick aluminum engines back then

patrickt · #**104** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lovehamr

I have a stroked 428 in mine and though it would have been much easier to have put a small block in it, it just wouldn't have been right for me. My next Cobra may get a small block, though it will definitely be a Ford. It's also worth noting that there are some very hi profile Cobra people who believe the 9.5" small block engine is perfect for a "427" Cobra and that includes Bob Bondurant.

It is written that once you have built a reasonably correct Cobra, then, and only then, are you entitled to substantially deviate from the norm. The fact that you originally went the "extra distance" with your 428PI, coupled with your avatar, now permits you to build a subsequent 427 car with a small block, or similar faux pas. Of course, this "license to deviate" is non-transferable, thus it is only of value to subsequent purchasers of your car who, themselves, have previously built reasonably accurate cars.

Excaliber · #**105** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 08:27 AM

Jerry, Hersch mentioned the Lotus 7 as a possible player back in the day, with the Buick nail head. When was that little 215 Buick alloy block available? Now THAT would have been a great combo! It might have come out to late though, by 1960 or so Shelby's new project was taking shape and under way. It seems to me the 215 V8 wasn't around until '62 or so?

"Buzz kill" works for me, to many replicas on the scene all ready as far as I'm concerned. They have lost some of their exclusivity. In Hawaii, when they were only a handful, the owners group was tight, it was special, unique. Now there are so many replicas there it's almost an "also ran". One guy actually sold his replica Cobra for that reason, just to many on the street. He bought a Coupe (without the GM E-Rod motor).

Ron61 · #**106** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 08:38 AM

I have seen everything from MOPARS, V-10 Triton Truck Engines and Chevys in Cobra Replicas and it doesn't bother me at all. I would prefer a Ford engine in them, but the person builds the car for himself, not me or anyone else. One guy here put a $10K sound system in his along with remote start, and everything he could think of. I believe he told me he had over $160K in the car. Personally I didn't care for it, but he built it for himself, not me and I only complimented him on the work as it was well done. Mine was no where close to original and I didn't want it to be. Only one person ever made any negative comment about it and he just wanted to know why I had a 94" wheel base instead of the 90". When I told him because it handled better he said that makes sense and complimented me on the rest of the car. The non original roll bad and side pipes he thought were a good idea. To many people complain about a replica not being exactly correct and they had 700 horse motors and 500 cubic inches. Show me an original that came with that.

Ron

Excaliber · #**107** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 08:48 AM

SAAC-35 organizers have said they will retain the right to NOT let you run the track if in their opinion your "mega motor" puts out more horse power than the original design of your car was intended for. Apparently this is something the insurance companies have been looking at lately. While 500 horse may be acceptable, perhaps 800 is not? I don't know where or how they would draw the line. Maybe it's like porn, you just know it when you see it.

RodKnock · #**108** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lovehamr

It's also worth noting that there are some very hi profile Cobra people who believe the 9.5" small block engine is perfect for a "427" Cobra and that includes Bob Bondurant.Steve

I want a list of these "high profile" Cobra people. All I know is that I better be on this list.

CobraEd · #**109** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I want a list of these "high profile" Cobra people. All I know is that I better be on this list.

I used to be a high profile person, . . but I got sick !!!

.

Ron61 · #**110** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 10:33 AM

Ernie,

I am not sure now what Thunder Hill would consider as to much power. Back when I had mine, the 530 horse was ok, but they inspected the suspension and everything closely to be sure it would stand that power. I know there have been some changes in the rules in the past few years but since I haven't been there for some time I don't know exactly what they may be now. I do know that mine would have been to loud now for me to run it there as they have set noise limits. I remember people racing there with open exhausts when I used to go. And I am sure that some of the other tracks may have rules that vary some depending on where they are and such.

Ron

rustyBob · #**111** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 10:43 AM

the SAAC-35 organizers might as well shut the gates and go home i bet there isnt one Cobra out there thats anywhere close to the "original horsepower rateing" of any Cobra produced......are they going to dyno every Cobra that shows up ?????
thats the whole fun of raceing......you always lie about how much horsepower you have.
my 390 has 10,000 horsepower......on pump gas of cource....
ooops i guess that means i cant run at SAAC-35......BOOO HOOOO.........

Excaliber · #**112** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 10:57 AM

I think the SAAC officials will be more than fair and not looking to oust anyone. They rightfully have the right to deny entry to uncompleted cars, cars that are obviously unsafe and hopefully cars with GM motors (OK, just kidding on that last part

). If "we" don't police ourselves at these kind of gatherings someone else will step in. All it's gonna take is for someone to have a serious incident on the track and it may change things forever. Like insurance requirements for a particular group being so high it effectively kills a gathering of the clan.

IndyCobra · #**113** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:09 AM

Sometimes, it's hard to spot the difference between the guy who insulted the car of the member who started this thread, and the "expert" members of this forum!

I guess I'll just have to enjoy my inaccurate replica without the approval of the forum because I have a square steel frame, fiberglass body, 94" wheelbase, dual roll bar, 17" wheels, low-profile tires, not painted Blue with a White stripe, SB Ford engine, no puke tank, no turkey pan, custom seats, leather interior, radio, non-standard gauges in non-standard locations, non-standard switches, non-standard battery, cup holders, no oil leaks, not found on side of the road dead, etc.......

rustyBob · #**114** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:12 AM

I would think that the "loose nut "behind the wheel would have more of an impact on their decision as to who gets to run and who dosent.....in most cases its not the car but the driver that has the problem.....

Ron61 · #**115** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

I think the SAAC officials will be more than fair and not looking to oust anyone. They rightfully have the right to deny entry to uncompleted cars, cars that are obviously unsafe and hopefully cars with GM motors (OK, just kidding on that last part

). If "we" don't police ourselves at these kind of gatherings someone else will step in. All it's gonna take is for someone to have a serious incident on the track and it may change things forever. Like insurance requirements for a particular group being so high it effectively kills a gathering of the clan.

That statement pretty well sums up everything. A few years ago one of the members nearly got killed at Thunder Hill on turn 9 I believe it is. They started tightening some of the rules after that. He had no experience and went into an experienced group and was trying to run with them. The turn is at the top of a hill where all you see is the sky and just as you crest the top, the track turns and he was going way to fast and went off into the desert completely destroying the car. They got him to Sacramento in time to save his life but I think he was going to be limping from then on. And when I was talking to one of the track officials, she said the insurance was really starting to look closely at everything.

Ron

Excaliber · #**116** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:15 AM

Here's the difference. While I or "we" may not agree with your personal choice of options for your replica, I and hopefully "we" won't be all in your face about it at a public cruise in event.

Now, as friends or members of a hobby group outside of a public venue, can we talk? Are we free to express our opinion or we will be written off as radicals?

I like some options, others I don't care for. I'm not afraid to state my opinion, you can take it or leave it. I'll try to do it gently, but sometimes the truth hurts and theres not a lot you can do about it. But I won't do that at a local cruise in or car show or gathering of the clan, there is a time and place for a discussion such as this.

rustyBob · #**117** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:39 AM

opinions are like turds.....everyone is different.....like i said before i can appreciate all the time and work that goes into someones project.....it may not be my thing but it is to someone..........

IndyCobra · #**118** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

Here's the difference. While I or "we" may not agree with your personal choice of options for your replica, I and hopefully "we" won't be all in your face about it at a public cruise in event.

Point taken and a good one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

Now, as friends or members of a hobby group outside of a public venue, can we talk? Are we free to express our opinion or we will be written off as radicals?

Sure, but do "we" have to denegrate other builder/owners in the process? Do 'we" not have a responsibility to encourage and support those who share our same passion? It sure seems that there is a very thin line with many of the heavy posters on this site that if your car doesn't fit a specific definition, then we're not "worthy" of calling ourselves a cobra. That's what seems unpleasant to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excaliber

I like some options, others I don't care for. I'm not afraid to state my opinion, you can take it or leave it. I'll try to do it gently, but sometimes the truth hurts and theres not a lot you can do about it. But I won't do that at a local cruise in or car show or gathering of the clan, there is a time and place for a discussion such as this.

I feel the same as you. Although I have not been a member of the forum as long as others, I am not afraid to speak out regarding what I see and hear. Trust me that I don't lose sleep over whether anyone thinks my car is accurate, a 'replica', it isn't "real", etc. I built it to meet my needs and I've never tried to pass it off as a true copy and could care less about the opinions of others. My only suggestion, and this wasn't meant to be directed solely at you, is that many newcomers to this forum are turned off by a few of the zealots.

I've been through the "Is it real or is it a continuation or is it a replica" threads as well as the "color" threads, the FE threads, etc. Different opinions are fine and we shouldn't all agree, but when this is expressed in a manner that causes others to disengage from the discussion, then we hurt the hobby much more than we help it. I came to this forum looking for help and a common appreciation for the hobby.

I appreciate your willingness to respond and your point about the proper time and place is spot on and I missed that. Thank you.

patrickt · #**119** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndyCobra

Sure, but do "we" have to denegrate other builder/owners in the process? Do 'we" not have a responsibility to encourage and support those who share our same passion? It sure seems that there is a very thin line with many of the heavy posters on this site that if your car doesn't fit a specific definition, then we're not "worthy" of calling ourselves a cobra. That's what seems unpleasant to me.

I couldn't agree more. That rat RodKnock is always busting my chops over my two roll bars. I even removed them and that wasn't good enough.

I would much rather him encourage and support me instead. In fact, if he would pay my kids' tuition, that would make it all better.

Excaliber · #**120** (**permalink**) 05-25-2010, 11:53 AM

You know,us guys that are passionate about the details and specifications of the original Cobras get slammed a lot as well as those who could care less.

In fact, I've seen the trend move more and more AWAY from original specs are "cool" to "modern" is the way to go. I don't want to apologize for my side oiler, with original spec heads and intake (date coded mind you). Or my flat tappet cam when all the lastest rage is a hydraulic roller and we hear about how great that is to the point where I'm tired of hearing it!!!

I prefer a solid lifter, I like adjusting my own valves, I don't want a hydraulic cam, of any kind. When I was growing up there was only one group of people who ran a hydraulic cam in their hot rod, "whimps". OK, so this is new age, so are metro sexuals, if thats your thing, fine. It aint my cup of tea, so don't denigrate MY choices that lean to originality, which is still a very worthy goal and should be applauded by all within the hobby. Without those who stand up for the "old school values" we will loose sight of the foundation of this hobby.