I LOST my COBRA!!!

[ezplans]

I just bought a spf licensed in CO as a 67 ford convertible worth 6k. I'm about to run the California gauntlet, will pay all the taxes, register it as specialty vehicle and pass the 67 smog regs with my 1967 block 427 sideoiler. Crate motors and small block owners better get the hell out of CA. 500 sb-100's won't cut it.

[Robert Helmer]

What about street rods.

[tpiini]

You know, maybe I ought to offer up my '66 289 in trade to a poor Californian who could buy me a new 331!

[CowtownCobra]

Lets just hope that what happens in California...STAYS in California!!!

[ezplans]

Robert - my limited short time here understanding is that street rods are in the same boat as cobra replicas. SB-100, old engine or death.

[Ron61]

Ezplans,

You are exactly correct. Right now their aim is to get rid of the Cobras and then go full bore after the street rods, but they have already pulled some street rod titles that I know of. As for the Big Blocks having an advantage, don't get to excited. Per the BAR Referee here there is something in the works to change it some way because so many of them had multiple carbs it is impossible to make them meet any emissions. So look for some whacky law to limit the size or something as inane as that. He couldn't prove that a particular 427 came with one four barell instead of two. Best bet is a pre 65 engine of any kind and then use it until you can get a SB-100 number if they haven't done away with that by then. This state is really messed up and no two places will do the cars the same.

Ron

[ezplans]

Ron - Now I'm scared. Pleading for inside info on BAR referees. I also started the California gauntlet string. Thanks.

[Excaliber]

Ron my 1968 block, 427 side oiler, has ZERO numbers on it. Well, other than the "standard" numbers found on all 427 side oiler blocks. Like 352 on the front and 427 cast in a couple of different places. I've heard the 427 numbers (like the 352) were also used on 390 blocks and others, so it DOES NOT designate that blokc as a "427". There are no hard core "serial or casting" numbers to speak off. Nothing that could nail down the year of build, or even say conclusively it IS a 427!

So how do I know it's a 1968 427 side oiler? Process of elimination. It was cast to use either solids or hydrualics, that alone means it's after '67. The bore is correct for a 427. It has screw in freeze plugs (GOTTA be 427 now), and it has the side oiler galley feed. I figure 68. Were they still making them in '69? If so, possible '69! OH, it also has the "extra strength" ribs cast into the side of the block that only the late model blocks had. I like to think the "ribbing" is to increase the pleasure!

The heads and intake are what I suspect a "BAR" guy might go with. Those are OEM Ford C4AE parts, 1964!

[fxbill]

.

[Excaliber]

Every state has different laws, sounds like Oregon (my home state) is doing you just fine! Hawaii also is very very easy.

[jdog]

Ron,
You have posted on other threads, that the BAR office near you was 'not friendly' toward Cobras. We should poll people and keep a data-base (off line) of Cobra friendly BAR referee's. There seems to be some latitude for an individual BAR referee. That could be their 'Achilles heel'!

jdog

[SnakeHerder]

On the question of service blocks, I have a service short block in my GT500. The block has no numbers, has ribs on the outside of the lower block, and has a date code next to the oil filter adapter. It was a 1973 date, though I can't recall just what. a "3" with a couple of dots cast under it, a letter, and two digits. The dots are apparently what lets you know it isn't a '63.

Hope that helps. I've lived in Calif for years. With the original car, the smog isn't an issue, but I keep hearing they want to reverse that. The car is 100% stock, but I don't doubt that the state will figure a way to get past that.

As far as the governor goes, Der Governator hasn't really accomplished much, but after five years of Gray-out Davis, that's almost a relief. We'd probably be better off if all the Pols would just go talk themselves to death. Or as a friend asked, "If we stop voting for them, do you think they'll go away?"

You know, my Shelby driven maybe a couple of thousand miles a year to the odd local car show, is far less of a pollution problem (despite smelling like gasoline as you watch the unburnt hydrocarbons drip from the drains in the exhaust collector) than is the college kid's mid-'80s smogmobile that he drives to the bars at night, and the river every warm weekend, and the snow every cold weekend. If the state really wants to make a difference in pollution (and I'm not going to go too far down that road), they'd make the "Historical Vehicle" plates like I have available to the owners of specialty cars, too, and use that or another means to differentiate between the hobbyists and the folks who drive ancient, ill-maintained cars as transportation.

Don't know how to deal with it, really. In Singapore they sell you a "COE," or Certificate Of Entitlement, to own a car at all. If you can't pony up a few bucks (okay, more like SG$20k-30k) every ten years, you're on the bus. (I was on the bus a lot in Singapore.)

The other end of it is the SUV panic. My SUV runs clean. If I don't mind a $70 fill-up, what's the difference? But the Calif parking lots have all been re-striped over the past 10-15 years so you can't park a half-ton truck or an SUV in most lots without going to the back of the lot, and taking a couple of spaces. I live in farm country. The rice growers aren't going to trade in their pickups for Civic Hybrids. I've got a 6' son and a daughter that's heading there. I'm 6'5". I'm not going to trade in my "bus" for a Civic Hybrid.

Rant rant rant

[Excaliber]

Nice tip TIM! I have my block right here in the living room with me. Isn't that where everybody keeps them?

By golly there are numbers under that oil filter adaptor. I have no clue what they mean. "66 427" cast on the rear of the block, covered by the flywheel, and "427" cast in lifter valley area. No dots,,, hmmmmmm.

[Turk]

You guys really think the BAR people in California will look long and hard in your car and see if they can read the numbers that are buried deep in the engine compartment, numbers hidden behind the flywheel?

I bet half the people in here couldn't decipher what those numbers men and what a date code is. You expect the BAR guy to know enough about an FE engine , a service block etc? Good luck.

The direction this thing is going is not to find ways to pass your car, it is going the direction of finding a excuse why you shouldn't have the cars..
For those of you siting in others states, especially in Arizona real smug and giggling.....Your days are numbered too.

Don't confuse California with Las Vegas. What happens in California does NOT necessarily stay in California.

We're all messed up, we are gonna mess you up too!!

It would have been money well spent if Shelby FFR and SPF were spending their millions a few years ago to combat this mess rather than spending them in courts with lawyers. Today they would be benefiting from the outcome.

Now that the lawsuits are settled, does not matter who won. They ALL lost!!
They can kiss California good bye as one of their most lucrative markets!!


TURK

[Ron61]

Ernie,

Are you sure that your side oiler wasn't a service block? That was a question that I asked in another post as I am trying to find out just how replacement blocks may be designated. You are right about the 352 casting. That was on every FE engine that I have ever looked at. The 1964 /427 Tunnel Port that I had, had the regular castings on it showing the year and date. That is why I got to wondering just hhow they stamped a service block as they have no way of knowing what car it may go into. I fear this may all turn to a non issue if they get their way anyway. No Cobras in Calif. unless they are original. Crap, go buy a regular car out of this dam state and see what you have to go through to register it. As I said check and find the best DMV and referee to work with. Some are car people and will help.

Jdog,

I agree with you. I already have a short list of BAR and DMVs that are car friendly. However Turk has laid it out the way it is going to go down. The only way to be sure is to get a pre 64 block and then this referee up here said he would decide what HE thought should be the limits for it. I believe that anyone with some time and money could stop that as the state sets the limits not individuals with a hard on against cars. So far the best referees that I have found out about and also the best DMV people all seem to be around the Sac, Bay Area. Not surprising there.

Snake Herder,

Since your car is over the 30 year old mark amd with the historic plates on top of that you should have no problem. Their main goal is to get all Cobras and street rods off the highways in Calif.so they can then sell the exagerated amount of pollution the calculate they wouild have created to the mills that don't have to meed any standards. Example is Kanuf here. Never has meet their standards so every year they figure out how many cars need to be removed from the highway to compensate for their pollution, and then turn around and sell Kanuf the right to up their levels. That is not going to clean up the air by selling them the right to triple theirs every year based on the amount of cars they can get of the road. Kanuf has had their right to dump crap tripled and have applied to have thet amount tripled as quote, "The air scrubbers are getting full and it would cost to much to replacethem." States answer, Kanuf is doing something good for the state and cars aren't." MY answer at the meeting, "Then move the dam plant to Sacramento and set ut up on the capital grounds and let them breath this brown crap."

Ron

[Jim Barnett]

You guys are ALL GREAT!!! I have been in a sad state of dispare since Monday when I took "Blue" back to the guys who sold her to me!! I have ALSO been trying to figure out ways to circumvent California's ridiculous stand on cars like the cobra replicas. I have made the decision that I WANT ANOTHER COBRA - (No BRAINER - that was made after I first drove the one I lost), BUT I don't know what avenue to take yet. Maybe I'll just get lucky.

What I do know is that people like us should ALL BAND TOGETHER and FIGHT this atrocity - somehow. I am probably going to write Arnie a NICE LETTER!! Just because HE has a gadzillion dollars and can afford to buy anything he wants, doesn't mean that I shouldn't be able to get what I want and can afford!! I think he is a real "down to earth kind of guy" and probably has NO IDEA that this kind of thing is happening (I could be wrong here). There has got to be an acceptable solution to this dumb mess. BIG BROTHER is getting TOO BIG around here. Are we a government run by THE PEOPLE or NOT?? Seems to me that there usually aren't enough people who will stand up and fight for changes (complacency runs rampant ALL OVER THIS COUNTRY, not just in this godforsaken state). Wonder how much $$$s (kickbacks) the politicians are getting outta this to further line their pockets?? IMO!!!

[Excaliber]

Ron, I would guess it is a service block as it has no meaningful numbers. But I'm not sure what a "service block" is. I would also guess the BAR guys (at least some) would know enough to spot a number like "C4AE" and know that IS the year 1964.

The C4AE by itself doesn't mean much more than the year. It's the numbers AFTER that which specify what kind of part like, head, block, crank, rods, etc. And the last letter (usually a letter) that specifies the type of part, Cobra Jet, 390, etc.

Turk is right, there is no way the BAR guy is going to crawl all over the engine to verify numbers which may or may not even be there! In my case they aren't. If my motor had Edelbrock heads and intake it would be impossible to establish the year.

I think that makes a strong case for "original" parts, especially in Calif! But I prefer to keep it "real" and would not want "after market" parts when original parts are available, no matter where I was living.

Barnett,
There is one other option for a Cobra replica, an EXCALIBUR. They were only "modern" replica built with FULL Federal and State approval. There are in fact a "real car", like any other Ford or Chev or whatever. Only about 150 were made, they are hard to find and sell anywhere from $25 to $35K typically. They are listed in the Kelley Blue Book and as such can be financed and insured just about like any other "real" car. Typical unit has 302, 5 speed, soft top, many have air conditioning and all have twin catalytic converters and smog pump. Not a "fast" replica but very well built and nicely done.

[Ron61]

Ernie,

Service blocks were what the dealers got to replace a blown engine if it was under warranty. Like we had a 390 that broke a rod and they had to replace the engine, so no way is Ford going to make a new block with the codes for that car. The C4AE-XXX will break down into 1964, whatever car the engine originally was in, and the E specifies Ford engineering or something along those lines. The rest is for the Ford engineers to use if they have to look at stuff. Also on FE blocks, the heads that come on an engine will have the date code stamped inside them about middle ways under the rocker arms. You have to take the valve covers off to check those. I have books here that break down darn near every part in the motor but never look at anything except the block code. I think the service blocks just have the date code as they have no way of knowing what they may be used in. Fortunately a few years ago we had the breakdown as this guy here was going to make one of the guys smog his to a pickup, as they had something different and was harder to get the stuff for. We showed him the breakdown right to where it said the engine had came in a Galaxie and he finally had to accept that. And no, they won't tear the engine apart, but this guy did make one person pull his starter because he couldn't read the code with it in. Also the new blocks such as the Genesis will absolutely get you screwed up here. If there is no date code, then it is unacceptable period.

Ron

[Jack21]

I live in Virginia, and I hate to tell you what a hassle it was getting my car titled as a pre-'74 Specially Constructed Vehicle, but with perserverience (and biting my lip a lot), I got through it.

There are tougher places on the East coast to register these cars. NY, NJ, Conn, just for openers.

Seems to me though, admitting my stupidity, that an organization like SEMA (Specialty Equipment Manufacturers Association), is the big looser if they don't get busy getting legislature through the system in California. Cobras are a drop in the bucket compared to hundreds of thousands of specialty vehicles (and manufacturers)in CA. Time to start flooding your elected representatives with mail.

Slow process, perhaps, but it does work. Virginia is one of 36 "Shall Issue" States for a permit to carry a concealed weapon. There is a group called Virginia Citizens Defense League, now numbering about 120,000 people, who are most pro-active in lobbying State firearms legislation.

Sounds like CA hot rodders, street rodders, Cobra owners, and manufacturers ought to get politically organized, or get more involved with an organization already doing this (SEMA?) to straighten out bad motor vehicle registration laws.

[Excaliber]

When this started happening to the replica Cobra owners, SEMA blew it off. When it started happening to the Hot Rodders, SEMA is suddenly involved. To little to late may be the problem now.

I saw a similiar thing happen here in Hawaii. "We", the local replica Cobra owners, set out to get a law that would allow us to legally register our cars. Before this law there was NO WAY at all to register. The Hot Rodders had a law and figured WE were just making waves and might up-set their sweet little deal. They actually fought us at first!! Toward the end they realized it would be a good thing for them to, but by then our "bill" was almost dead. At least they stopped fighting us, but I couldn't say they joined us!

Last year we got our "Cobra Bill" passed into law, no thanks to the 32 Deuce Coupe crowd!