AC 289 Original

[AC289UK]

hey,littlecobra

THE COLOR IS LIKE IN THE GOOD OLD DAYS PRINCESS BLUE

KEEEEEPPPPP THINKING.....

[Trevor Legate]

Last time I saw that car I was hanging out the upstairs window of the office in Frimley with my Hasselblad......

so it cannot be, in any way, shape or form or dictionary definition an 'ORIGINAL' AC 289. It can be a brand new 2003 AC 289FIA. Just my humble UK-based observation that I assume the guys at the factory will support (OK Mark?)

And by the way, nobody currently employed at Frimley ever worked at Thames Ditton. Nit-picking, I know, but so is the whole of the Cobra history these days, since battered egos still love stirring the old pot. Can't be too careful, you know. In fact, to be totally accurate, the guys who hammered out that car are no longer there either, but maybe that's too much information......time to go.

[AC289UK]

Thank you Mr. Legate

For clarifying the different matters in discussion.

At least a couple of points were made clear:

It is a brand new AC 289 FIA....

Handcrafted in Frimley, UK....

It is a piece of history...

since one the oldest british car manufacturer closed ....

by the way Congratulations for your last book.. I recommended to everyone. I do not know if it for sale in the U.S.

Kind regards,

Gabriel

[AC289UK]

Look what I found

[Power Surge]

Someone recently said to me about the new Shelbys being built today - "it IS a genuine Shelby, but not an ORIGINAL Shelby". I think the same wording applies to this car. It is a genuine AC 289 Cobra, but not an "original" AC 289 Cobra. I don't think it's fair to sell this car advertised as an original, because it's not. Original implies it's a 60s car, and it's not. But it is a real genuine AC. So I think the selling title should no read original, but something like "Real AC 289 FIA" or "Genuine AC 289". Just my 2 cents.

[Trevor Legate]

The use of the 'AC Original' badge was not a smart move on the part of the company. They decided to use it to identify that the car was not a 'plastic kit', although why they considered such a move necessary is beyond me. The decision came from the top so everyone had to agree it was a neat badge.....but as I say, not a smart move.

The use of the word 'Original' in any context immediately places the car into the realms of Thames Ditton-built cars from the period 1962 to 1968. Such confusion should be avoided at all costs.

Which is not to suggest that the cars built subsequently by either AC Cars or Shelby American/Automotive are not entitled to use the name Cobra, or be considered as Cobras, but the arguments will go on indefinately despite the publication of legal documents that sought to clarify the matter during the 1990's. (Which is in agreement with your comments, Power Surge!)

[pk]

I'm sure the upper management thought they were being very "clever-clever" as you chaps say

It seems to be a rather cheap shot from a company one would expect more from.

They really don't have any need to do this sort of thing, but I've said the same about a certain well regarded company here

pk

[AC289UK]

Hi everyone

In order to avoid more controversy, I just changed the wording of the Post.

So from now on it its an AC 289 FIA For Sale

[Excaliber]

I always cringe a little bit when someone "points out" how the COBRAS were "really" made in England and all that was done here was to "drop in a motor and trans".

What was "done here" was considerably more than what AC could manage to do. It took Carol Shelbys "team" to figure out how to make the car a winner. Substantial up-grades across the board were incorporated by AC at SHELBYS DIRECTION.

Now how does this sound coming from an American directed at our English friends:

"AC was little more than a group of craftsman who under Shelbys direction made cars for him. LOTS of people can make cars, only a few can make successful RACE CARS. AC was not one of these people."

When someone "points out" that the "real" Cobras were made in England by AC as an American, I take offense.

Some statements while "accurate" are not "true". Stated in such a way as to deceive, exagerate or lead to one to a wrongful conclusion of the facts.

The history of Cobras is full of such statements. "All Shebly did was drop in the motor and trans." Accurate, but hardly true! "A real AC Cobra for sale." NOT the first time I've heard that and won't be the last.

Call me prejudice and I'm sure some will disagree, but my conclusion on the matter is there are NO COBRAS now or ever produced in England. There are uniquely American. Those cars produced for sale in England or elsewhere (COB or COX) may be "called" Cobras by some, an "accurate" but in my opinion, NOT TRUE statement.

The name and the car would never have existed were it not for Carrol Shelby.

[Serendip]

I bought a Shelby 40th anniv 289 because I wanted a real Shelby. Inevitably, people will ask "Is it real?" and if I answer a simple yes, they will usually assume it is also an original. On one hand, I don't want people to think they are looking at an original 289; other hand, the simple answer to the specific question "is it real" is yes, and any further comment about real but not original generates more conversation than a stoplight stop can accomodate. I am interested to see how history will treat the Shelby produced reproductions.

[relaxinrob]

I agree with you Ernie, but this all gets a little too high-brow for the average Cobra owner that just loves the styling, performance, and thrill of driving a "representative" of a legendary car created by Carroll Shelby to win races. I could afford to go out and buy an original if I wanted, but I just love to drive them...........that's what it's all about for myself and 95% of the other guys and gals involved in this wonderful lifestyle we call "Cobra"


Rob Burton

[Excaliber]

If I had a "continuation" Cobra made by Carol Shelby, 4000, 7000, 8000 series for instance, I would have no problem saying it was "real" at a stop light or similiar encounter.

In such matters further discussion may be warranted, please pull up a chair and lets talk!

I certainly don't want to be "high brow" about it, nor do I wish to offend in any way our English friends. Just trying to find some balance.......

[Serendip]

Continuation.....that sounds much better than reproduction. Thanks, I'll use that term in future descriptives.

[Mark IV]

..may not be an "original" 1960's car but it is a GREAT value. Trust me, at this price Gabriel is taking a BIG hit!

More pictures in my gallery..

And it may be one of the last cars to come from AC after Lubinsky gets done with the company..

Rick

[AC289UK]

Besides the controversy, like Rick said, it is a very well made car, and yes one of the last ones made in the UK.

[What'saCobra?]

Good grief! What an old chestnut and here i am rising to the bait.

All 289 Cobras were AC Cobras.

Per SA, AC, FIA, FORD, data plates, shipping documents, brochures, pamphlets, instruction manuals, parts manuals, registrations, certifications, insurance policies (OK, a few of these said FORD Cobra, which everyone will agree is really wacko), etc., IN THE DAY.

Nearly all 427/8, 390, and later Cobras were Shelby Cobras (or even Shelby American Cobras.)

Why is this so difficult to grasp or remember? (Why am i writing this again?)

It has nothing to do with national pride for what our American Shelby did, then or now.

It has only to do with the name of the cars at the time. The truth is not misleading. Get nuanced! (Don't you love it?)

Please, let revisionist history remain the provence of our democratic brothers as they try and explain away Kerry's responsibility for taring all our returning VN veterans with evilness and disrepute in order to end the war. Let them explain how Kerry's 120 days of questionable duty in VN makes up for the thousands of vets that suffered as much in coming home to the USA as they suffered fighting with honor in VN.

[Trevor Legate]

ALL 289 COBRAS WERE AC COBRAS (good title for a book!)

Hi Mr. Whats.......

Thank you. Seems like I'm another bait-riser.

At least you saved me the tiresome job of stating the simple bald bloody facts AS THEY WERE IN THE 1960'S. Not the facts as we know them now. I was THERE at the AC factory AT THE TIME and I talked to Alan Turner, Keith Judd, Derek Hurlock and they made, developed and modified the cars according to the information and requests that came back from Shelby American who, unlike AC, were blessed with substantial Ford money that allowed them to go racing. AC did not (as a rule) race cos THEY BUILT THE CARS.
Actually the one race car they built themselves really annoyed SA as it was so fast straight out of the box so they, in modern parlance, 'dissed' it and still do. In fact the AC Coupe, A98, is still regarded as a road going Cobra whenever the subject of their one quick blast up the M1 crops up. I recently tried to put the record straight in our national press and it seems that half the population was driving along the M1 at 4.30am that one day in June 1964, as everyone saw it go by (at over 200mph). What they saw was really an Aston Martin as the factory was just a short drive from our only motorway. But, like the AC/Shelby two-step, the myth is better than the truth.

By the way, going WAY back to an old thread, I have just had a very pleasant drive in 427 over our South Downs near the coast, courtesy of its owner Joe Eagle and I have to say, it was a great drive simply becasue it was a proper unadulterated 427 without a roll-bar, side pipes or even a hood scoop. Just a proper 427. Nice. Maybe I have changed my mind about 427s - a little.

Having said that, I was exposed today to a Caterham R500. Now that is a TRULY fast car and NO 7-litre Shelby would even see which way it went (below 120 mph). But as if that was not manic enough, they now make the R500evo which is faster again......

Enough from me since, like you WaC, I have posted enough info on the AC topic in the past. Let people believe what they will. I give up.

Cheers!

[wilf leek]

Trevor - I saw your Daily Telegraph piece. Made me smile.

Things will never change - here in the Uk these cars are and always will be known as "AC Cobras", in the 'States they are "Shelby Cobras".

Vive La Difference! (thank the Lord they were never "Panhard Cobras").

[Allan A]

Ron,
Who sells the lights? I am going to add to 7034.

Allan

[computerworks]

Paula has them...Finishline (FL.)
http://www.cobraaccessories.com/cata...roducts_id=431