Classic Roadsters

starwolf56 · #1 (**permalink**) 11-28-2002, 09:18 AM

Whats up with Classic Roadsters?I'll try to make this post short and to the point.I bought the kit in October of 01 ,with the agreement that I would take delivery after 6 months.I ended up requesting delivery in august 02. After numerous phone calls and false ship dates/excuses, I was told the kit would ship on 11-19-02,however there were still some items on backorder.I was happy;after all this has been a four year dream of mine!I was looking forward to getting started.On 11-22-02 the truck arrives,a big truck,48 feet plus a king size sleeper !!!!I live in the country,and the roads are not small,but this truck could not turn into my street!!!!!Now I had a irritated truck driver to deal with.He wanted to take the load back to Fargo.I convinced him to park in the fire house parking lot a couple of miles from my house and wait while I rented a trailer to unload the kit in the parking lot.A few hours later we had the kit loaded on a double axle trailer.The truck driver was confused why he was not told by anyone at classic roadsters that it was a residential delivery,he would have used a smaller truck as there was only one other kit on the truck.Well that was the delivery fun,here's where it gets interesting!I ordered the following :Phase I,II, and III.In addition, options B,C,D,E,F,H,I,J,L,N,O,P and R. I received the body and frame and partial components of some of the options,nothing complete! Can't even build the frame, no front end springs etc.. Packaging was poor,items just put in box.i.e tail lights damaged because metal brackets in same box with no packing material! Other items were damaged as well do to packaging.I received two and a half pages of back ordered parts!!!!It is not accurate,a few items listed were received and some items not received are not on the list.What a mess!!!!!I don't know how this ever will get corrected. I have called Classic Roadsters several times and left messages with Pete Johnson,no call backs. They have had my order for a year,more than enough time! Needless to say,I''m one unhappy customer!

RAZOR · #2 (**permalink**) 11-28-2002, 09:39 AM

Man that sucks, what should be a great moment turns into a nightmare, I really hate to hear this has happened to you. I suppose you know that Classic has new investors and is going through some reorganizing, Don Scott or DV that post here are probably the ones that would have more info on the status of the company. I know its a big let down, but I'm sure that you will get the rest of the parts but it sucks that your wait will be longer. Please keep us informed about the outcome of this.

Double Venom · #3 (**permalink**) 11-28-2002, 10:24 AM

Starwolf...
This story is really, really ugly! I have no idea what I can do, but I assure you Don and I will certainly do what we can!

Take photo's of all the damaged parts! Take pictures of the extra parts, confirm the parts that you are missing. Make copy's of every picture. Put all the above information in a letter form, with photographs, send it certified/return receipt. Do it tomorrow.

Keep us posted!
DV...it will get straightened out! The reoganization is a good thing.

petek · #4 (**permalink**) 11-28-2002, 11:26 AM

Years later and the story is the same (sigh).

On the up-side the CR Cobra is well engineered and one fine ride.

I've got some spares (springs, dash, and some other stuff, not a lot of stuff but some). Let me know if you need anything to start your build and I'll let you have what I've got for just the cost of shipping.

Jack21 · #5 (**permalink**) 11-28-2002, 02:41 PM

Sounds like '90 - '91 all over again.

The only way to insure that this doesn't happen is to go to Fargo, inspect all the pieces, load it on a truck or trailer, and drive it home yourself. If all the pieces aren't there to be loaded, refuse to accept it.

And while in Fargo, should you go home empty handed, bring home a phone book to look up attorneys.

This not returning phone calls or e-mail is just poor business practices.

And it's really unfortunate that once you go through all the trials and tribulations of getting all your parts from CR, and getting all the correct parts to build it with (not the CR shopping guide parts), it's a solid, and well made car that won't rattle itself apart in a year or so. It has the plushist interior, and most comfortable factory seats going.

Stories like this need to get to the new ownership and see if something gets done about it.

Find out where Don Vancleave is, and hire him back. Don used to fix or prevent these kinds of things, and you could call him at home on weekends with problems.

Art Burtt · #6 (**permalink**) 11-28-2002, 09:14 PM

In the same boat ordered kit in July was promised Set.1 delivery
date,got kit on Oct. 5. Truck that delivered mine was 80' long.
Fortuneately I have a buddy with a rack body truck so we just unloaded it in a local business parking lot and trucked to my house. 1 1/2 pages of back ordered stuff and still waiting!!If I only had side pipes,heater and wiper motor bracket I could at least put body on frame. The other thing that us frustrating is their highly touted manual. It's 10 years out of date!!!

Jack21 · #7 (**permalink**) 11-29-2002, 08:21 AM

Art,

You don't need the sidepipes until you're on final assembly after the car is painted. The stock CR pipes you'll be cutting off at the muffler to weld glasspacks on. The body cutout dimensions for the J pipe exit we can give you.

The heater now is an aftermarket unit made by Vintage Air.

The wiper motor bracket you can make yourself, or someone has an extra one laying around the shop.

And it's a lot easier to put the drivetrain, suspension, brake lines, and fuel lines on the frame before you put the body on.

The assembly guide isn't bad. The electrical schematics leave a lot to be desired from the standpoint that very few people will biuld a car like this with a stock '74 Ford ignition. Among others.

The shopping guide is another matter. Don't spend a dime, I mean not a dime on suspension, drivetrain, brakes, nothing! until you check in on the Don Scott & DV thread first.

One does not build a $45K sportscar with junkyard parts. A block core, and differential core for rebuilding should be the extent of your junkyard shopping.

Meantime, find a good hardware store near you that carries a goodly supply of fastners. Most True Value stores have this. You'll be in there at least weekly, and sometimes daily. Take it as a complement if they offer you a job because you know the place better than the salesclerks do.

petek · #8 (**permalink**) 11-29-2002, 09:22 AM

Listen to Jack21, DV, and Don Scott!

If you need some pictures of a CR build: http://www.birch.net/~petek/cobra

dscott · #9 (**permalink**) 11-29-2002, 01:52 PM

Starwolf, I'm really sorry to hear about the problems with CR. It's frustrating to purchase something and then wait. The only good thing is that you will get the parts. I know we have been through this before but the new ownership is a positive note although it will take a little time to get back to "normal". One of the problems with backorders has been internal. I have communicated with the new President just this week and he is fully aware of the problem and the fix. I went to one of their suppliers who is close to me and confirmed that the steel parts are on order (trunk, hood hinge, etc.). He is working through the holiday weekend to make sure the parts are finished and delivered to Classic the first part of next week. All I can say is please be patient. I have also addressed the problem of trucking companies that deliver the kits. It's silly to send semi's to a residential home. I truly believe in their product but it's time to s*** or get off the pot. I know they had a great boat show recently and sold lots of boats so money is not an issue. It's time to get the internal problems fixed.

Art, I've looked through my stock to see if I have anything you can use to continue with your build. I have a few things I'll be sending out Monday.
Don

Jim Downard · #10 (**permalink**) 11-29-2002, 02:32 PM

Isn't it nice to know that there is stability in the world and that some things don't change. Man, ten years later and it's the same o' same o'. I'd seriously like to build another cobra or GT 40, and now that I know what to look for in the Classic Roadsters package I think it would be much easier, but this is exactly why I will not buy another CR Cobra. I think I'll spend my new money elsewhere.

Jim Downard

Jack21 · #11 (**permalink**) 11-30-2002, 12:16 PM

Thank you for the insiders update Don. We appreciate the info. The new senior leadership at CR must understand that this is Sh!t or get off the pot time. There are just too many other competent kitbuilders on the market, and consumers just will not tolerate this BS anymore.

Jack21 · #12 (**permalink**) 12-06-2002, 05:33 PM

Encouraging update.

Got a phonecall today from Pete Johnson at CR. Couple of months ago, I ordered a replacement fuel tank pickup, and sending unit. They were on backorder. (Yeah, right. Been there, done that.) He just received a shipment of them, and did I still need one? He's sending me one.

First phonecall returned by Pete, or Tammy. Mark this date on your calendar.

As a left handed thank you, he mentioned the cardboard mock-ups he has on his desk (that I sent him) of the frame to motor mount brackets to use late Ford OEM or Energy Suspension motor mounts to bolt a 351W in instead of the obsolete Mustang II. Apparently, they're now in production.

Asked him how things are going under the "New" management. Good, he said. Gary Rutherford is still President, but finances are improving, and the back-order situation is turning around. Not where it needs to be, but getting there.

Thought I'd share this with you.

Don, DV, please give us an update on meeting with CR management when you get a chance.

Double Venom · #13 (**permalink**) 12-06-2002, 06:51 PM

Jack,
Funny you should mention that. Don and I were talking about that very thing this afternoon.
We'll let you know.
DV

4RE KLR · #14 (**permalink**) 12-17-2002, 06:02 PM

All I can say is I ordered My Classic Roadsters kit, and when I was told it would be shipped I told them I was on my way. Yes I drove from Texas to Fargo. I did get most of the parts but some did take an awful long time to get. I had problems with the passenger door fit that i won't go into, BUT Classic Roadsters did step up to the plate and finish delivery and they made good on my door situation. I will say that that I did get frustrated and DV and Jay Nordstrom and Don Scott help me alot. Tammy and Pete were instrumental in me getting my problems resolved. Many thanks to all who helped me.

I recently sold my Classic Roadsters (Ferrari Killer). I enjoyed it while I had it and it was on the cover of Kit Car magazine ( Nov 01). It just goes to show that good things can come from rough beginnings.

Be patient and keep Ed Combs (DV) and Don Scott informed of every move for they are the ones that will help you.

Ferrari Killer
Steve Parks

starwolf56 · #15 (**permalink**) 02-02-2003, 08:30 AM

My patience with Classic Roadsters has run out.Enough of the lies and excuses.I've been told of illnesses,parts are there but they have no shipper,parts are shipped.The list goes on.Pete and Gene don't return calls.When I do get them on the phone,they say that they will look into it and call me back.Pete and Gene never do!I ordered this kit long ago,how long should it take for them to get parts in stock?I have sent Pete and Gene e-mails,letters and pictures;stating what was wrong with the original shipment in November.I made my position clear again this week with Gene.I want the body replaced(damaged),and a delivery date of the missing parts. The back order list is still about two pages.I want a full refund if Classic Roadsters cannot deliver what I bought.Gene was to call me this friday after talking to "the powers at be".What a surprise NO CALL! This is way beyond reason.This company doesn't seem to care how they conduct business or treat customers. How does Classic Roadsters stay in business?
Charlie Robbins

J. T. Toad · #16 (**permalink**) 02-03-2003, 04:02 PM

Ditto... ditto.... ditto.... ditto.... yep, same.... yep lies....

Jim Voss, lied about delivery
Tammi lied about delivery
Rutherford never returned my written request to make me feel better by apologizing for the conduct of his employees, promising to expedite delivery of b/o items, and to not let it happen again.
Pete, well everything is just two weeks away, (which was over a month ago, six months ago)
I put my deposit on a kit in Feb. of 02' they forced me to take the 'complete' kit in May of '02

I am still waiting....

and please see the other post about being burned by Classic Roadsters' recommended represenative Customs of California, Jerry Zavada.

Double Venom · #17 (**permalink**) 02-03-2003, 06:09 PM

I will not run, I will not hide, I will NOT lie! All lof you know or should know that Don and I don't have a thing invested in CR's other than an insurmountable amount of time, money, tears and blood.

We have tried and tried. Bottom line is, we're still trying. Don was in my shop today after a long, long trip from Mn. We discussed the problems, the inefiency, the non productivity, the broken promises, the lies.

Forget Rutherford, it aint gonna happen. Going to the basement, they are in the middle of re-organization. They are trying to get out of the hole that the previous administration put them in.

Personnally I think the new owners are now just really finding out about a few skelitons that were left in the closet.

I can promise you one thing, things will change! One way or the other they will change, and the changes are in the making!

Damn it! They are one darn good kit!

DV... 90/92 been there, done that and it sucked!

Excaliber · #18 (**permalink**) 02-03-2003, 08:17 PM

small quiet voice in the back says,,,,,,,,I still want one,,,,,,

Ernie

decooney · #19 (**permalink**) 02-03-2003, 08:36 PM

DV,

maybe you can show these people at CR this thread. I've been watching this thread for a while as a bystander... and got to tell ya, its hard for me to recommend their cars to someone looking for a longer weelbase car now after seeing this drag on. At least one friend passed on them already after hearing about this.

Things can change, if they new people act fast:
The one thing in common that I've found about Unique, ERA, or any business that has been successful, is the people are honest. It seems to me, if they were straight with people (even if they say it was going to take 90 days or 180 days) then people would know what to expect and could plan accordingly or differently...

It sounds like the new crew is coming on, but they need to formally address the CR public (on ClubCobra) and let their customers know what's going on. Take out loans, whatever, just do what it takes! If not, its a guaratnee CR will wind up with no future customers, law suits, and be forced into bankruptcy. Now we don't want that to happen do we?

Note to CR:
Hey Classic Roadsters, the CUSTOMER IS YOUR BUSINESS. Withouth them giving good referrals, you are DONE! Take care of your existing customers first before doing anything else. All of us on CubCobra feel bad for these guys that are getting the shaft right now by CR. Talk to them and be honest; and take care of them. If you do, word will get out fast; meaning more sales for you in the future. Everybody is watching your next move.

dscott · #20 (**permalink**) 02-05-2003, 08:39 AM

I have been around and around about this for so long that I'm getting sick. I bet people are so sick of me saying how things will change and it seems nothing ever happens. I have gone as far as telling the new president I will come to the factory and fix what needs fixin! I wouldn't even charge them! In my former life I used to do just that, bring companies back from the dead. It's a simple solution, just takes a little time and money. I'm sure most of you wonder why DV and I don't just move on. There's lots of companies and just as much business elsewhere. The reason for me is I believe in their product! I also believe that they will turn around and become what they should be. After driving almost all Mfg's cars the Classic is still the best driving and riding car around. It is solid and well built. It's my personal preference. I don't have a personal stake in the company other than the 75 cars I have built for my customers. I need to be here for them and all the new customers. If I didn't think the company was worth the effort I wouldn't do it. I spend almost 2 hours each day on the phone with Classic customers helping them through questions and parts locating. I don't make a dime from this, in fact it costs me money because I have to pay for all toll free calls. I will continue to do this because if I can help and have the knowledge to do so, I will. After my meeting with DV I understand he does the same. So bottom line, somethings changing @ Classic. Can't say what, can't say when, but when it does, look out!
Don