Contemporary Cobra Watts Linkage

[mickmate]

It's all good discussion and sharing of info/resources. There are a few threads on the bolts breaking on watts set ups. If a bolt is breaking it is obviously because it is stressed. I didn't like the positions I saw for mounting points as they showed bind on my CAD drawing and had uneven radius rod lengths. I was trying to find the pictures of another guys CCX who moved his mounts to similar positions to what I've used to correct the bolt breaking problem he had. If I can run that up and down by hand that easily there is obviously no bind. The most resistance came from the swaybar bushings which is nothin! The set up I've shown uses 4 of 3/8 bolts to hold the mount, a 5/8 bolt through the top of that and a 1/2" at both ends.

[azfordman]

Thanks for the feedback. I figured I would throw that question out here and have the info on the forum. It really does look like an interesting set up. Hey Mick...have you got it on the road yet?

[mickmate]

Almost, have you got a test pilot available?

[PDUB]

Nick, Are you sure that the Jag hub carriers are capable of handling the stress associated with carrying this newloading? I'm not saying they won't take the punishment, just wondering about it.

Otherwise, it looks GREAT!

[mickmate]

Good question the top is a conical shape very sound casting with 3/8 wall. The bolts are screwed into steel inserts in that. I'll be testing it confidently ;-)

[67JET]

Thanks for the heads up about this thread mickmate. I am interested in the set-up you have created. I ended up with the bar that goes from the frame to the front of the lower arm on the rearend. I got it from CWI. It helped alot but i know we can make it better/stronger/faster. It just takes money and time.

[RICK LAKE]

Mike mate Duanne has a link setup for ERA's with basicly the same Idea as yours. He has a shock setup like the older mustangs for upper and lower control. This was for the solid axle cars. Rapup was so bad and the guys where breaking rears like crazy if you drag raced. The problem I saw was the angle the shock was on and how much control it realy had laying at a 70 degree angle? Rick L.

[mickmate]

As you know Rick shock angle makes a lot of difference. I saw his set up and see the theory but to me it's like a steering damper where you're damping but still allowing movement. In this case it's a movement and direction you don't want. The steering dampers have also been accused of masking other problems.

[Ralphy]

Rick the name is Guldstrand. Is this the setup you saw? This is designed for a C3.

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

azfordman What Mic Has redesigned may work very well. The problem is what are the limits of the setup. 10 years ago ONLY a few cars where making real 400 HP at the rear wheels. Today I have to include myself in this group. The vette people had the same rap up problem in the vettes. Gulstrand ( I have the name spelled wrong and can't find the article at this time) designed a 4 link with high low bars to the outter support housing. It kept the wheels in location but had a binding issue around turns at high "g". Wheel hop seams to be the biggest problem with cobras and IRS setups. Rick L. Ps the failures of the contemp system was the pivot bolt snapping off at the pivot arm and in the middle of an event at 100 mph in turns. All that was needed was a larger shoulder bolt or a high grade.

[RICK LAKE]

Ralphy That's it. It does work very well. All new vettes used this basic setup for rearends. No pivot, just straight arms to the rearend. I know it changes the rear alignment a little but unless you are a PRO racer and driver you will never know. Rick L. Ps custom shocks where also used over the stock setup ones, Koni's.

[decooney]

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

Mike mate Duanne has a link setup for ERA's with basicly the same Idea as yours. He has a shock setup like the older mustangs for upper and lower control. This was for the solid axle cars. Rapup was so bad and the guys where breaking rears like crazy if you drag raced. The problem I saw was the angle the shock was on and how much control it realy had laying at a 70 degree angle? Rick L.

Rick,
I found those last two sets and the install zert kit I had stored away, BTW. I was in my attic moving some stuff around from my former WSCB event bins, low and behold there was the box with the last two kits in it for the ERA. I had forgotten I brought it to the last WSCB to show a few people who wanted to see it and it was trapped in the bottom of one of those old bins!. As for ongoing use of this kit, my final assessment over the years of use with my car is the setup definitely helps, but it has not completely eliminated wheel hop under any type of situation if I just jump on it full on. I just don't do that. However, as compared to before the kit - I CAN get on it much harder now and it does put the power to the ground much better with more confidence than without it. The only thing I would change with my existing setup would be to go to a tad stiffer shock if I changed anything. Duane

[RICK LAKE]

Decooney Duane still want the kit. Send a private e-mail with info and how to get it. Rick L.

[Dazecars]

Not to reinvent the wheel but here is an idea...


First of all I want to be completely honest, I do not have a Cobra, I have a Mustang, but I am putting a Jag IRS in it so this post is very interesting to me.


Second, mickmate, the system you have created is slick and I may be very interested in buying one and adapting it to your application. However while thinking about it and upper watts link in general, what if a person used newer hubs??


I have a set of X308 hubs that I am not using for my Mustang but have for a different application g because I want the outboard disc brakes for that project. What if a person took a set of these hubs, ditched the brake parts, and used them with the inboard disc brakes and then used the caliper mounting tabs and the ABS sensor hole as a mounting location for the upper watts bracket??



The hubs are interchangable as long as you use newer half shafts so it would be a fairly simple swap. thoughts???

[1985 CCX]

Great job Nick!

[cobrarkc]

Originally Posted by Dazecars

The hubs are interchangable as long as you use newer half shafts so it would be a fairly simple swap. thoughts???

This is not true, the hub shafts are a different diameter so you either have to put a bushing in the wishbone or put different bearings in the hub with a shim around the bearing and a spacer under it to make it work. I just completed this project.
You can use the stock brakes but I upgraded to 12.19" Wilwood That is bracket I made to mount the Wilwoodcaliper in the middle picture along with the bearing, shim and spacer.

[Danielg]

Hi, where did you find or did you make the billet lower arms, that's exactly what I have been trying to find.
Any help would be great, Thanks
Daniel

[cobrarkc]

Originally Posted by Danielg

Hi, where did you find or did you make the billet lower arms, that's exactly what I have been trying to find.
Any help would be great, Thanks
Daniel

www.cobraracing.com George Petrus

[Dazecars]

Originally Posted by cobrarkc

This is not true, the hub shafts are a different diameter so you either have to put a bushing in the wishbone or put different bearings in the hub with a shim around the bearing and a spacer under it to make it work. I just completed this project.
You can use the stock brakes but I upgraded to 12.19" Wilwood That is bracket I made to mount the Wilwoodcaliper in the middle picture along with the bearing, shim and spacer.

Good point, I was aware of the shaft size difference. More than anything, I was thinking of it as another option to have a solid mount for an upper watts with out having to drill in to the hubs, and wondered what others thought.

[badrich]

A few years ago I added the Contemporary Watts Linkages in the stock location. I had to mill the billet hub carriers a little since they rubbed and needed a little more clearance. Everything seems to work just fine, but all I have done is autocross my machine. In a couple of weeks I will be doing a little drag racing at SAAC-35 and will test my setup a little more. I will be using street tires, so I presume the stress won't be as nasty as if I were to use drag slicks. Wish me luck. Rich

[Ralphy]

Daze nice to see you here! Try using the search feature for more info. Lotta Stang guys here also.

Ralphy