Watch out for the subpoenas....

[silverprl1]

I don't know who else here is a member of FFCOBRA.com, but people need to be warned. I have a long-standing problem with FFR myself, and maybe that is why I have been targeted, but I received a subpoena for a deposition in the case of Shelby v FFR. I am personally involved in a Class Action suit against FFR with just over 200 other dissatisfied people signing to certify the class, and maybe that is why too? Anyhow, if you are a poster on the FFCOBRA message board, or have anything to do with them, I bet you are going to get one too. It's not that big of a deal, just a lot of questions. If you answer straight, no need for an attorney. If you are stuck in the middle, I suggest getting an attorney to write your response, otherwise you might say something that comes back to bite you in the ass.

Some of you know that I was kicked off the FFCOBRA board for simply talking about all the failed parts, doa parts, missing parts, bad welding, missing powder coating, etc etc... But my suit isn't against the board. Shelby is suing them, and they are in a lot of trouble. Basically, FFR was told by the courts to cease and desist from all Shelby names in 2002. Before the ruling the was even signed, they started the FFCOBRA message board (2 weeks before in fact) and now they are going to be ruined for flippantly subverting the ruling. My lawyer thinks the original suit and subsequent agreement is going to be thrown out because Dave Smith was acting in bad faith and obviously negotiating with the intent to subvert the judgement before the ink was wet, let alone dry. If the owner of FFCOBRA was used by Dave Smith, this is going to suck most for him, and I will feel bad for him. If he was in cahoots from the beginning for a free kit or something, he un-knowingly threw himself to the wolves in Dave Smiths name, and I won't feel as bad then.

Anyhow, sorry for this as a first post on here, but I figure there have to be some people on here who are also unhappy with Cult going on over there, and wanted to give a heads up. If you want to contact me.... hit me up here:

wolverine (at) factory5gtm.com.

If you want my entire story, and to see the 5 written promises to replace my kit, my responses asking to have that happen, and then Dave Smith acting as though he never offered, rinse, repeat.... a year later, same problems, same promises, same first kit, with ruined parts, rusted parts, backordered replacements, and a file 2 boxes full of correspondences... A great way to ruin a hobby I love.

I will keep future posts to the cars. You can reach me about this topic at the address above, and I will get you any info you want... PRIVATELY.

Be well, build fast, and drive it like you stole it.

[tool time George]

How come this thread isn't FFR Bashing? Bash David Smith maybe?
i feel tricked into reading about "subpoenas" then to discover it's all about,a complaint about FFR.
silverprl1, your story maybe be totaly valid and if so i feel for you.But using a deceptive thread title to get out a message really concerns me.
I really hope your problem with your kit does come to a positive resolution.

[TButtrick]

What are the details of the class action suit?

[Steve Cassani]

I don't read the post as 'FFR bashing.' Wolverine cites his dissatisfaction with the kit he received and how the management of FFR replied to his requests that he be treated responsibly, having paid for the kit under terms that apply to any purchaser: parts free of rust, all parts delivered, sound workmanship. This information is pertinent to his subject: Why he has been required to provide the court a deposition. The information he provides, especially the history of his dispute being "long standing" and his having carried on part of the dispute on a public forum all this time, helps towards understanding why he was picked to offer testimony. Shelby's attorneys are fishing.

If the point to be shown in court has to do with who gave the web site Ffcobra its name, and was his action subject to the agreement, then Wolverine's hard time doing business with Factory Five is beside the point. Still, him making his complaints public also makes Wolverine attractive as someone willing to provide information that may substantiate a point Shelby raises in his complaint. If Shelby can show the management of FFR responded to Wolverine and so used the site or information they could have learned only from reading it in conducting business, the court may be pursuaded that the use of the name 'Cobra' as part of the name of the web site continued a pattern of misrepresentation FFR had agreed to cease.

All of this sounds petty but it is not. It is the sort of problem that arises when a businessman trades on a history and a reputation he did not establish. As platforms for airing grievances Ffcobra and Club Cobra are passive. If Shelby can show management of FFR used the site to further their objectives, as opposed to advertising which simply makes information available to an interested audience, he may have grounds for damages under the terms of the agreement. I recall FFR stopped using the name 'Cobra' in advertisments in Road & Track and similar publications when they signed the agreement. They refer instead to a 'history made in the early sixties.' Fair enough. Connect 'Cobra' and 'Factory Five Racing' as the does the name given the web site and use the site or what management learned from it to resolve an issue with a customer and the situation changes to one of underwriting the site in the company's name.

[TButtrick]

Originally Posted by silverprl1

If you want my entire story, and to see the 5 written promises to replace my kit, my responses asking to have that happen, and then Dave Smith acting as though he never offered, rinse, repeat.... a year later, same problems, same promises, same first kit, with ruined parts, rusted parts, backordered replacements, and a file 2 boxes full of correspondences... A great way to ruin a hobby I love.

I will keep future posts to the cars. You can reach me about this topic at the address above, and I will get you any info you want... PRIVATELY.

Be well, build fast, and drive it like you stole it.

If you really want us to understand your situation. Let us read the past posts on FFCobra, your request for satisfaction and the responses from Dave Smith.

[patrickt]

... and here I thought we were going to get a primer on how to deal with out-of-state subpoenas and that "jursidictional" thing that goes along with it.

[JKleiner]

Hmmm...?
A quick search reveals that "silverpearl" was indeed banned from FFCobra, however is not a purchaser of a FFR roadster or coupe. Seems odd that Shelby might have any interest in their customers of other products.
Hmmm...?
First I've heard of a class action suit involving "over 200" others.
Hmmm...?

Jeff

[RedEsprit]

The plot thickens. Additional info and pics at www.factory5gtm.com

[mrmustang]

Again, I will not start or be part of another US vs THEM thread as it does noting for the hobbiest (which is the majority of the end users here) community as a whole.

I do find it strange that you set up your web page the day after you got banned from ffcobra. Also find it strange that most if not all of the current files on your web server have a date of 2/3/09 on them. Where are the 200+ disenfranchised owners? Where is the data you must have documented between then and now? Where is the basis for your potential lawsuit other than a few items that may or may not have left the factory in the condition in which you now show (and in tiny little pictures with no real detail). You remind me of a fellow on another forum who just posted this past week about selling a 68 Shelby with 16 miles on it...Oh yeah, he does not have the information available yet, but is taking email addresses with a limit of 400 einfopackets to be sent out and less than 179 spaces left open. No substance to be had in his thread or this one, if you are going to make allegations, perhaps putting it on line for all to see before a post like this would have been the educated thing to do.

I've not made up my mind on this, but for now let's just say the skeptic in me is wary.

Bill S.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by mrmustang

I will not start or be part of another US vs THEM thread as it does noting for the hobbiest (which is the majority of the end users here) community as a whole.

Ahh c'mon Bill, it's February -- most of us can't even drive our cars. Let's start an "us v. them" -- and you can be on either side. Tell you what, you can be on both sides. How does that sound?

[Hexnut72]

I need a fact check. Was FFCobra.com started by FFR or by Bill?

I was always lead to believe (actually I have been a member of that board for a long time and I specifically recall) that it was a separate board that Bill built and once FFR saw what an asset it had become they started advertising on it and paid to become the official sponsor of the board. I remember at one time they started to branch it out as more of a generic roadster board and it was about that time that Bill changed the format and said that FFR had paid to be the sole kit maker represented on the board.

I understand that you have problems with Factory Five but I think that your post is full of misinformation. Please let me know if I am wrong.

[computerworks]

In the spirit of our disposition of similar recent threads, ClubCobra declines to be involved as a medium for any aspects of any ongoing legal disputes.

We'll leave Wolverine's contact info up, if anyone wants to discuss his issues directly.

thanks
ron
ClubCobra Moderator