428 starter drags when hot

[deckofficer]

How many of you are having the "click, click" no starter spin when hot are also running an aluminum flywheel? Have you tried putting it in gear and nudge the engine rotation a couple of degrees then try again. Chances are good you will need to shim your starter to compensate for the increased expansion of aluminum. The bendix drive is set up so the starter will not grind the flywheel by spinning (energizing) the starter motor till right before gear engagement. If an aluminum flywheel has expanded to the point of gear contact before the set travel has been met, then no energizing of starter, hence, "click, click".

[Dominik]

How about starting a few turns without ignition and then switch ignition to "ON".
Needs minor rewiring.

[Tom Wells]

Fascinating discussion.

I have two 460s (a 521 and a 557) with exactly the same click-click problem.

I have tried direct wiring to the starter from the battery, small Ford starters, geared starters - two different kinds - and no joy. Same problem.

I now know that if I try it enough times - say 10 - it will turn over just fine and start up.

One interesting sidelight: just after I install a different starter (and it doesn't appear to matter what kind just as long as it is new) the problem goes away for a while. Maybe a week, maybe three months. Then it comes back. I presently use the small Ford F-350 truck starters.

If anyone has a real diagnosis for this I'd be grateful. Maybe enough to send a bottle of really good single malt!

I've thought it was limited to the 460 engine family, but from the discussion above it isn't.

BTW both engines use automatics so no aluminum flywheels.

For the present, misery loves company

Tom

[Dominik]

Hello Tom!

The strange thing is that your new units work for a bit, then fail.

Let me ask the obvious:
How are your connectors and cables? Did you try a second source of power in parallel (jumper cables from your other car)?

Did you do the voltage drop test?

What happes if you take the new starter out and fit it back in?

Dom

[Dwight]

Is the ground cable from battery to frame large enough? Do you have a large ground from frame to motor?

Dwight

paint cleaned off frame before ground is attached?

[Tom Wells]

Dom et al,

I have received several suggestions on the 460 and Big Block Ford web sites that I'm going to try - well, at least two of them.

1) Add a separate solenoid away from the headers on the firewall. Here are a couple of links to give the wiring: Adding a Remote Starter Solenoid to your Chevy, My Way

(Ignore the mention of the Ch3^, it uses the Ford part) and Starter goes click-click when hot - 460 Ford Forum

Still not sure why the solenoid helps, but several knowledgeable folks have endorsed that approach.

2.) I think I'll try a heat shield along with it for good measure.

A friend once said about my approach to a problem was "when you see a problem, you just start throwin' hammers" LOL

Tom

[Bringstone]

Hello - had the same problem with my HiPo FE and did all the tricks shielding etc with little success. Old timer at the truck wrecking yard said "Use a bloody big battery".

Fitted said Bloody Big Battery - never had a problem since - many years now.

Regards
Wayne

[windsor 351]

what kind of compression you running? If over 10-1 you should be using a high torque, gear reduction starter.
I had the same issue with my stroker 347.

[FUNFER2]

As far as conductivity, is there a difference between regular steel or stainless bolts/hardware ?

[John S Peterson]

I've been reading these posts and unless I'm missing something I've yet to read someone say that they are running a negative battery cable from the negative terminal all the way to the engine block and then to the frame. The basic HP books on Electrical Systems even say to do this to prevent any possible voltage drops that "could" occur. This is considered best practice, and I know everyone that hasn't had these problems are saying I just run a short cable from the neg terminal to the frame and then the frame to engine...There is no rhime or reason why some work that way and some don't. It's just electrics. Unless you have 25 feet of leads on your voltmeter there is no way your going to reach from the negative terminal to lets say your engine block while your cranking the motor to see what your voltage drop is from begining to end.......Voltage should be consumed by the device, not the resistance in the circuit. Batteries need to be charged properly. Do not let the alternator try to charge the battery if you had to jump start or used a jumper box. It is not it's job and will not do it completely. Have battery tested the right way as well and you might be surprised that the battery might have been weak to begin with...
just some thoughts...
JP