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06-08-2011, 11:31 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Jose CA,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF_R_/BRG/FRBoss302/327CI/FordEFI/Under_Car_Exh/
Posts: 2,523
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Not Ranked
Taps for flat tappets -
Thought I would write a missive on the state of oils in the 21st century.
the state is bad, even with ZDDP, and break in oils we are seeing camshaft failures at 2000-2500 miles. --
we have had 2 FEs come to us with wiped lobes in the last 30 days *WITH* approved treatments in the oils.
Comp cams has even included a printed document with each flat tappet cam they sell.
http://www.compcams.com/Base/pdf/Fla...chBulletin.pdf
-- we now have a source for a FE roller cam (hyd roller) that works well and we have a grind that is a rollerized C8AX design, with some modifications for the larger engines of today.
hope this helps , will post pics as they come up.
Steve
__________________
Steve SPF 2734 MK3 / Brock Coupe #54- panavia.com
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Advertising
06-08-2011, 12:58 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Louisville,
KY
Cobra Make, Engine: I'm Cobra-less!
Posts: 9,417
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Not Ranked
I've got access to some nice FE hydraulic roller lifters as well.....they're under $400. Can get either Morel or Howards. No reason to not run a roller cam...unless someone gives you a free flat tappet stick...
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06-08-2011, 01:46 PM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by blykins
...unless someone gives you a free flat tappet stick...
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Now c'mon, who around here would be dumb enough to do that?  |
06-08-2011, 02:34 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Cobra Make, Engine: KMP 539, a Ton of Aluminum
Posts: 9,591
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by blykins
unless someone gives you a free flat tappet stick...
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"Free" is debatable. |
06-15-2011, 06:09 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Jose CA,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF_R_/BRG/FRBoss302/327CI/FordEFI/Under_Car_Exh/
Posts: 2,523
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Not Ranked
Mustang Ranch is now pleased to announce with the partnership of COMP Cams a the Release of a Standard Roller Hydraulic Tappet FE camshaft for Cobra / Mustang V8 "FE" engines from 390, to 428 CI.
the camshaft is a rollerazation of the C8AX Ford Racing "Muscle-Parts" grind from the 1960s.
It is meant to be paired with Edelbrock Performer RPM FE heads, and the COMP CAMS Roller rocker system.
with our precision engine builders attention to detail, we can build an FE that can survive modern oils, and be reliable.
Steve
__________________
Steve SPF 2734 MK3 / Brock Coupe #54- panavia.com
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06-15-2011, 06:48 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Louisville,
KY
Cobra Make, Engine: I'm Cobra-less!
Posts: 9,417
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Not Ranked
Steve, what exactly is the difference in the ones that you're advertising? Comp has had FE hydraulic roller camshafts available to us for years. You can also pick through their lobe catalog and have any combination of lobes ground on an FE cam blank.
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06-16-2011, 12:55 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: West Bloomfield,
MI
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 717
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Not Ranked
Been doing these for at least a couple weeks now...
So far we've had a grand total of three flat tappet failures in the past five years on engines we've assembled. Only one on an engine we dyno'd after assembly. That one was literally full of gasoline in the oil pan when it returned for repair - a very likely contributing factor. Perhaps three others on cams we've sold.
While even one failure is not good, the rate is really modest considering the hundreds of cams that have passed through the business.
__________________
Survival Motorsports
"I can do that....."
Engine Masters Challenge Entries
91 octane - single 4bbl - mufflers
2008 - 429 cid FE HR - 675HP
2007 - 429 cid FE MR - 659HP
2006 - 434 cid FE MR - 678HP
2005 - 505 cid FE MR - 752HP
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06-25-2011, 09:14 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Mesa,
AZ
Cobra Make, Engine: Contemporary Classic, 428 FE CCX 3069
Posts: 7,506
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Not Ranked
Blykins, Drop me a PM and let me know where I can buy a set of Morel rollers.. please.
Thanks,
__________________
Dan in Arizona
CCX3209
"It's a great car and I love it, but it doesn't do 'SLOW' very well."
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06-25-2011, 09:18 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Louisville,
KY
Cobra Make, Engine: I'm Cobra-less!
Posts: 9,417
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Not Ranked
You can get the Howards or Morels both from me. Give me a buzz, if anything, just to chew the fat. 502.759.1431
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06-26-2011, 12:07 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Arkadelphia, AR,
AR
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham 427 brushed aluminum with Keith Craft 527C.I. all aluminum FE
Posts: 992
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Not Ranked
I think this is all about 5 year old news. Had FE hydraulic rollers around for years now and the oil deal has been a problem for at least that long. Use the correct break in oil and procedure with the flat tappet and then the correct oil after you install in the car and you will be fine. Like Barry says done right the flat tappet will be fine.
There have been several companies making hydraulic roller lifters for FE s now for several years. We have seen a few problems with al of them but we handle a lot of parts. We use the Morel lifters mostly now. Had used the Cranes till they went under and now they are back up running. It seems that with this engine stuff you can get a bad part at any time and that is what gives us the most problems, a bad part.
Like Brent says you can get about any kind of hydraulic roller lobe you want but you better know what you plan on doing with the engine, the weight of the valve train, spring used, rpms desired and so on or you can get yourself in troubler.
Good luck, Keith Craft
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Keith C
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06-26-2011, 03:54 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: West Bloomfield,
MI
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 717
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Not Ranked
Same drill here on the parts - I've had the hydraulic rollers available for several years now. Went through a few sources before figuring out what the FE wanted for cams and lifters. Had some noisy ones early on, then ran into RPM limitations on the more agressive lobes. Currently have a few patterns that play pretty nice with the rest of our combinations - as Keith noted - its definitely a combination and not just a collection of parts.
Still a definite place out there for flat tappets - just need to be religious about break in and lube. We used to "get away" with stuff - but that won't slide anymore.
__________________
Survival Motorsports
"I can do that....."
Engine Masters Challenge Entries
91 octane - single 4bbl - mufflers
2008 - 429 cid FE HR - 675HP
2007 - 429 cid FE MR - 659HP
2006 - 434 cid FE MR - 678HP
2005 - 505 cid FE MR - 752HP
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06-27-2011, 05:56 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Fairfield,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: HM-2027 / 427 SO
Posts: 815
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Not Ranked
Which C8AX cam profile the hyd C or mech D?
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08-28-2011, 04:28 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chicago,
IL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 454 S.O.
Posts: 1,684
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Not Ranked
Morel makes lifters for the followwing companies, they are a private labeller.
BAE Brad Anderson Enterprises
Bullet Cams
Cam Motion
Crow Cams
Custom Cams
CV Products
Doug Herbert Performance
Erson Cams
Howards Cams
Kavanagh Motorsports
Lunati Cams LLC
Nickels Performance
PBM Performance
Predator Cams
Valve Train Systems
__________________
Jeff
“If you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough horsepower.”
Mark Donahue
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