600ci Ford FE

[fordracing65]

Does anyone have a 600ci FE in there cobra, gt40, coupe. With the compact graphite iron block, stroked and bored, it can be achieved. If so what are your power numbers.

[RICK LAKE]

fordracing65 Jay is the guy to talk to. He is working on a couple of project. Your problem will be a dry block. Might have to run alcohol to drive this or E-85 fuel for starting. The question is why?? FE block is a 4.440 on center bore line. You can buyild off set cylinders with alot of money for boring out a block. Everything will be custom. Motor could cost in the 30-40K range. Why not build a Cammer for a GT-40 from a 527 shelby block. Believe me you will have more power that your car can handle. FI system or even go blown or turbo system if you are looking for top end power. Kirkham can mill you a custom block for 600 cubes, Problem may be heads lining up with wide bores. If you want a large motor, go GM with a 572 or 640 motor. They are built on 5.0" bores and up. Rick L.

[lovehamr]

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

If you want a large motor, go GM .

Heresy!


Really, in that vein there are 600+ ci 385 series motors as well but the weight of those and the gimmics (GMCs) would be killer wouldn't it?

I second talking to Jay as well, he always has something cool FE going on. His book on FE intakes is quite eye opening as well.

FR65, sorry I didn't have an answer for you, I just had to yank Rick's chain.

[Barry_R]

I am not aware of any 600 inchers. I think Jay's big Cammer is around 580 using offset located cylinder liners and a pretty big crank. I have a big stroker Cammer coming together here - 4.750 stroke will fit but requires custom everything including buckets of money. Hard to get that much stroke into a normal wedge FE becaue you bump into the camshaft...

[fordracing65]

I just saw that it was possible and wondered if anyone has done it, Im happy with 482ci myself.

[blykins]

Robert Pond's compacted graphite blocks can go up to a 4.600" bore. With a 4.500" stroke, you're at 598 cubes. However, as Barry pointed out, it would take some custom parts and some custom bank accounts.

[Jerry Clayton]

the best running Nascar back in the day were destroked to 396 or somewhere near there with the shorter cranks but the 427 bore---

[Keithc8]

You are not going to do a 4.600 bore on a block that has 4.640 bore center. You would have a wopping .040 between the cylinders and it would last no time. You can move the sleeves out in an aluminum block but then you have heads that are not centered on the bores, piston not centered because the crank is made for 4.640 bore.
This would be one big as problem pain in the ass. Why do it when you can uch better with less cubic inches or go to a 485 series 460 engine. If you go much longer then a 4.500 stroke you get crappy rod angle, short compression distance pistons and more problems.
I even feel that the 580 C.I. engine is not worth the money or trouble and you could make more power with a smaller better designed engine. It amazing how many FE gurus there are suppose to be but how many have made over 900HP with a normal aspirated wedge head FE engine, not many. with the parts that are out now you should be able to make 1000HP with the right normally aspirated FE engine but how many want to pay not many.
Till you get a block, crank, heads and all done with a wider bore spacing you are just pissing in the wind on anything much over 540C.I on an FE engine and I would not go that big if I was buidiong the best HP combination. ENOUGH MONEY YOU CAN DO ANYTHING. You also take some of these guys that have money and they think they can, but it takes a combination of money and know how.
You will find that there are engine gurus every where. I know I talk with them ever day and they have not made the first chip or machined ****. They bolted some parts together.

Good luck, Keith Craft

[blykins]

Nobody said standard FE parts could be used.

I haven't seen one of those blocks in person. I would have to say that they're on a different bore center, but then again, compacted graphite is known for its strength which allows the cylinder walls to be thinner....so who knows.

That's why it was noted that it's basically a completely custom engine....and sometimes guys want that. Hence the $50000 FE Cammers that make the same/less horsepower than a stroked 385 series engine.

[Barry_R]

I have to agree with Keith. The available wedge FE heads will not adequately support 600 cubes in any case, and the package would be pretty near to impossible with OE bore spacing.

The only reason I am doing the 4.75 stroke deal is because the customer wanted to do it. It's a very unusual combination with custom rods and everything else. No idea how its gonna run - the EMC stuff has taught me not to make strong comments about what will or will not work. Damn motors cannot read.

I do not think Robert has made any of the CGI blocks yet - although Keith is far better positioned than I am to report on that.

I have been directly involved in exactly ONE FE wedge engine that has gone over 900 horsepower. I think my 527 Cammer would go there pretty easily - it cleared 870 at 7000 RPM on a short dyno session with only basic tuning - but that's a Cammer with a ton of work.

[blykins]

I wasn't trying to be argumentative, but was just throwing out some brainstorming information. It's nice to think outside the box every now and again.

I'll be talking to Robert today, maybe I'll pick his brain about what he had in mind with the graphite block and the 4.600" bore.

[Jerry Clayton]

I think the bore in the last high hp na engine I did was 4.780 on a 5 in spacing

[Keithc8]

Barry I do not know if you get to deal with as many engine gurus as I do. It just gets old sometimes and evrybody wants to build engines. Use your equipment and machines and then they assembled an engine that you did all the machine work on and want to brag they did the complete engine. I have taught so many people to do stuff only to have them compete against me out of their garage and use others equipment.
I have done heads for customerrs to only have them copy them else where and then brag it is their head. Like I said before people like you and I invest a ,ot of money and then compete against people that advertise on the internet and more than likely work out of their garage. It is one way to keep over head done for sure and make it hard on people like you and I that are involved in everything.
I wish I could sell my deal to some of these engine gurus and let them have at it since they know so much. That is my venting for the day. I have to go dyno an engine on my own dyno that own now.

Thanks, Keith Craft

[Barry_R]

I hear ya'

I've been using a buddy's dyno for quite a while (a boat racer that does not build motors - but with enough scratch that he purchased a dyno 'cuz he thought it'd be cool to own one..). Finally just finishing up the install on my in house DTS. Just pulled the trigger on a new SV-10

[blykins]

Well, all the wadded up panties were for naught...

Robert said that he hasn't made a CG block and he has no plans to. No one will do the casting for him.

He did say that 4.600" bores were designed to be possible with a standard FE bore spacing. Cylinders were siamese. Block was light, cylinder walls were thin.

Now, back to your normally scheduled programming.

[fordracing65]

CSI Kentucky, Blykins is on the case, nice work.