FE rocker arm positions

[kdavies3]

Hi FE experts.
I'm nearing the end of my 445 FE build and I just got a set of Comp Cams rocker arms.
They are handed left and right 8 of each.
Is there an official position for these?
BTW I have Edelbrock heads.
I realise that I need to centralise the push rod positions in their bores.
Or do I just put them where they give the best push rod positions?
I was going to build using the standard rocker posts and springs between the arms but having read some of the other posts on here now I'm wondering about end stands and spacers etc?
Are they really necessary?
This is road car not a racer.
Also I have a new Comp Cam and hydro lifters, two of the lifters seem very hard compared to the other fourteen which are quite springy. will they sort themselves under oil pressure or is there a deeper issue?

All help and advise gratefully received.

[kdavies3]

No replies huh?
I thought this might be an easy one?
I've read many threads on the web but can find nothing to indicate where (on which valves) the left and right handed rockers should go.

[Tom Cimino]

The rocker arm assemblies will fit on either head. There is no actual left or right. I'm not familiar with Comp Cam's rocker arms, but it is likely the rockers will have to be shimmed, so the roller tip is centered on the valve stem. This is more important than the pushrod being centered in the bore. You will still have to check for clearance in the pushrod bore. Sometimes they will rub. Here's instructions from Comp Cams

http://www.compcams.com/Instructions/Files/128.pdf

[kdavies3]

Tom, thanks for the link.
By blowing up the picture I can see which are the left and right handed rockers.
I'm still wondering if I should go the whole hog and invest in end stands and spacers etc.
Also any thoughts on the hydraulic tappets?
Two of them are quite hard the rest are springy and unpumped as you'd expect from unrun tappets.

[philminotti]

The fact that some of your lifters are filled with oil is not a problem per se. However, IMO, it is impossible to set preload if the lifter won't bleed down. Adding the typical 1/2 to 1 turn from zero lash could actually open the valve, rather than preload the lifter. I had exactly this problem with my Crane hydro roller lifters. I made a little jig and slowly bled them in my bench vise. Slowly. Worked very well, and I was able to set my preload. I strongly discourage you from soaking your lifters in oil for a prolonged period of time prior to installation as they will fill with oil and end up non-compressible. It was not fun pulling a freshly installed intake so I could bleed my lifters.

It does beg the question as to what happens under dynamic running conditions. I would guess that the lifters behave properly, otherwise valves would constantly be hanging open and you'd be bleeding compression. Or worse.

phil

[kdavies3]

Thanks for your thoughts Phil.
I know what you mean about pulling the manifold.
I'm hoping that I can bleed them out somehow.
I didn't soak them but I gave them a good rub with oil and cam lube.

[Danr55]

Official position is on the outer side of the valve head, in the proximity of the valve stems and adjacent to the push rod passages.

Most important part of the installation is to be sure the oiling port in the rocker arm shaft is pointed down and that the rollers are spaced directly over the valves with no room to move sideways.

[philminotti]

If your intake is already installed, you could try leaving the affected lifters at max lift overnight and hope your springs bleed them down. Didn't work for me. I made a fixture that consisted of a piece of 2x4 with a half inch deep hole in it for the cam side of the lifter. Then i got some 1/4" brass npt tube threaded on each end, about an inch long. Amazing what you can find at home depot ....one end received an end cap. Brass is softer than the lifter, and the endcap nestled nicely in the pushrod end of the lifter. I then clamped the whole mess in my bench vice and started pressing out the oil. Nice and slow. Had to repeat twice for each lifter, but each lifter went from essentially a noncompressible solid to nice and springy. This is standard practice for me now, whenever i pull the intake. Frankly, it's probably ok if you don't bother doing this, and just add a half to full turn from zero lash. If the valve opens a bit, I'm sure it'll assume it's normal operating parameters under running conditions. It is annoying though, to clearly be opening a valve when you're supposed to be setting lifter preload. I've brought this issue up several times in the past, but it's never really generate d much interest from the gurus. Oh well....

Oh, do not prime your oil system prior to setting preload. You'll have an engine full of solid lifters.
And use end stands.

[RICK LAKE]

kdavies3 Kev Couple of things
Do you have the correct length of the pushrods?
End stands are a MUST for any motor with shafts, I have 2 shaft broken over
time. 1 was standard shaft and the other was heavy duty. Also make sure the all the surfaces are flat. Thiner stud goes in the oiling hole to rockers. Run an .080" oriface in each head. This will help help more oil in the bottom end.
Lifters if you filled them and they will not bleed down, Pull them apart and drain most the oil. Just remove the clip on top. Clean out oil and reinstall with a dowel stick.
You need to get the correct pushrod length to keep the rocker end in the center of the valve top trough the whole open to close event.
Adjusting valves, Adjust to contact of lifter and bottom of rocker and 90 degree turn and lock off adjustment. Reason for this is if you miss a shift or high rev the motor there is less chance of mr. valve kissing mr. piston and doing damage to motor. This is a cold adjustment.
I hope you are running a HV oil pump with an 80# spring in it. FE motors need and love oil. 7 quart oil pan also and over fill it 1 quart. FE motors have slow returns from the heads. You should be able to goggle how to check pushrod lengths and setup. Good luck. Ps IMO not a good idea to try and collapse a lifter full of oil. easyier to remove the clip but be careful and have a good grip on it. IF you have the intake manifold on depending on switch one you can sneak the lifters out of their bores with a mini magnet and get them out through a hole between head and manifold. If no hole, you are pulling the manifold. Also make sure none of the pushrods are hitting the holes in the manifold. May have to grind a little for clearance. Rick L.

[philminotti]

Good points, Rick. But remember, FE hydro roller lifters can't be dissassembled. You can remove the snap ring, but you can't remove the guts because the tie-bar rivet interferes.

[Barry_R]

Normally the offset is used to pull the pushrods "away" from the intake ports - but centering the valve tip is number one, centering the pushrod through the intake opening is also number one...sometimes you have to juggle rockers to get both....hint...

[kdavies3]

Thank you all for your insight.
I have the correct pushrods (although I nearly missed that one).
Other than rubbing the new lifters with plenty of lube and oil I didn't soak them it's annoying how a couple of them have gone pumped.
Is it still possible to set the preload with a hard lifter, there's movement there with enough pressure? by feeling the pushrod for slack then add 1 turn as recommended by Comp Cams for my lifters / rockers.
It looks like I need to raid my piggy bank again for end stands etc then.

[Rawkkrawler]

Buy the end stands, best $120 I've ever spent on this car. After 2 snapped rocker shafts I called Precision Oil Pumps, no more issues.

[Danr55]

Precision Oil Pumps is a great source for parts and information. End stands are not essential but went a long way toward quieting the valve train noise in my motor. Solid spacers went even further. I have a complete assembly from Precision Oil Pumps.

[kdavies3]

Thanks guys, all of the above now ordered from Precision Oil Pumps.

[DougD]

If I remember correctly, don't the Edelbrock heads have a slightly different valve spacing than stock Ford heads? This needs to be accounted for when assembling the rocker shaft assemblies.

[kdavies3]

Doug, you are correct the valve centres are slightly different, I'll need to shim some of the rockers.