427so

[ERA 626]

Please some one respond ASAP!
I found a 427s/o short block (C5AE-H)
in exellent condition. New forged pistons bored .030" Never ran on new bore. LeMans rods & crank.
The guy will ship it to me How much is this worth, I need to know ASAP because he has someone else who wants it now and he is willing to sell it to me for my new ERA....but I need to give him an answer.
Thanks,
Mike

[ERA535]

Mike, assuming (!) that it is useable it is worth between $2000 and $2500. Is the crank standard?
Pat

[ERA 626]

Pat,
Thanks for the promped reply that is why I love this fourm!
I thought it was worth more!! It is supposed to be in exellent condition. New forged pistons lemans rods and the crank is mains standard and rods to .010" It is in Salt Lake and he will clean it and ship it (he wants 4K I think that is too much) maybe worth 3300??
mike

[ERA535]

mrmike

Add up what you are going to have to put on it make it work in your car.
Heads - 1250 - Edelbrock
rocker shafts 200
rocker arms 350
stands 120 (?) can't remember
intake 300
pan $600 Avaiad
oil pump 60
distributor 225
oil pump drive 30
carb 450
valve covers 140
gaskets 80
timing cover on it?
timing chain 80
cam in it? if not 150
pushrods 130
damper on - if not 250

lets say 4500 - plus 3300 = 7800....there is a sideoiler thats sounds really good being advertised right now on the Norcal Shelby site for 8500 - that is a complete engine and I think it is local -- food for thought - Good Luck!

[ERA535]

I took the liberty of pasting the ad here - I hope this is kosher.

427 side oiler.. Dove alum heads,ARP head studs, Stl Manly valves,Org.2x4 Hirise intake,2x4 Holleys,BC & BD,linkage, org. Shelby valve covers, part # S7MS6582,dual point dist.,forged crank "$",LeMans rods.Arp rod bolts, Arias 10:1 forged pistons,Mellings H.V. oil pump,Canton pan, windage tray,Edelbrock alum. waterpump, expansion tank, McLeod flywheel, clutch cover & damper. Blueprinted and balanced $8500 or B/O.
427 Arias Pistons, New in the box forged ,.017,flat tops,valve reliefs,spiral locks,Cost $528, ..$450 B/O.
New F.E. cast iron waterpump..Make offer
Don Enos Phone-day: (415) 897-8776 Phone-evening: (415) 897-8776 Hyriser54@aol.com Novato [12]

Maybe you can't use the hi rise intake - but the thing comes with a lot of stuff..and no, I don't know the person.

[ERA 626]

Pat,
I wish I would have known a few months ago,
I already have everything bolted on my 428. But if I could find a 427 s/o short block for a decent price I would buy it and sell my 428 block (C6me) my block is fresh and ready to go . Then I could bolt on all of my other stuff $$$$ and go! As I said before I found a short block for between 3500 and 4K is this worth it??
Mike

[ERA535]

Mrmike: To me it wouldn't be worth it. It is hard to give someone else a black and white answer on something like this.....for example some of the variables are:

What shape is the block really - was it cracked and repaired?

How much is shipping?

At .030 over - it is probably at its limit as far as any kind of reboring in the future.

How are the cylinder walls - are they really thin? Did the present owner sonic check the block and does he have documentation for that?

I think LeMans rods are great conversation pieces - but they are 35 years old! Selling them is the best thing to do with them.

I wish I could be more supportive!

Sometimes you just have to go with what you feel - so you pay a couple of hundred more than you should have - big deal. Maybe there are lots of people out there who think that this is really a steal.....I could just be cheap - but I purchased a complete side oiler for 4500 - a sideoiler block, crank and heads (cracked) for 750 - and a high rise center oiler for 5500 - apart.

Good luck!

Pat

[Toivo]

has anyone seen a new Genesis block.

If these are real and not vaporware, an iron version is around 2K I think, brand spanking new.
427 (same as 390 cranks) are used as door stops in barns across the country. New rods agree would be a good thing.

I'd buy a new block, clean up the $250 crank and buy some $600 Eagle rods.

JMO

[chopper]

mrmike:

One note here. Keep in mind that the maximum recommended bore on the 427 block is 0.030 in. That means that this particular block is finished as far as any more work goes, unless you decide to sleeve cylinders. That's not necessarily bad, it's just that it may entail more expense down the road if you ever have to have any future work done on the block. Ford recommended only one sleeve per bank maximum; however, we have guys out here in DesertLand who have eight sleeves and no complaints. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, George Anderson has eight sleeves in his engine, and he seems to blow by a lot of folks on the road, so the original Ford advice may be outdated now.

I agree with ERA535 on his comments about the block and LeMans rods, also. The 427 blocks are a high-nickel alloy cast iron and while stronger than the other FE blocks, are more brittle and more prone to cracking. Repairing requires specialized equipment and procedures, or the repair welds will just crack out around the edges of the welds. The LeMans rods were the be-all and end-all in 1966, but metallurgy has progressed far beyond them nowadays. I had LeMans rods in my old engine and Bill Parham at Southern Automotive strongly advised against using them in the replacement engine. They are great conversation pieces and will serve well if you're not planning to run the engine really hard, but you might think twice about using them if you're planning any type of performance driving.

IMHO, you may wish to be a little wary of plunking down large quantities of hard cash for something you haven't even seen. I'm not advertising for Southern Automotive, but for $8500, Bill Parham could build you a really nice 428 hi-po rig. I'm sure George Anderson at Gessford could provide a competitive engine for a similar amount. Have you tried either of them for quotes? Both are first-rate shops with wide followings.

[khall]

Mike
The Salt Lake 427 short block is currently on eBay and closes on Jan 4. It is up to $2235 but has not met reserve. There is also a complete marine 427 sitting at $3000 that closes tomorrow night I don't know if you follow eBay, but I see a couple of 427s every month. They seem to generate a lot of interest. If the block you are looking at does not meet his reserve he may be open to an offer immediately after it closes.

[ERA 626]

I do follow e-bay. Can you send me a link for the marine 427. I am looking for a 427 side oiler short block. The guy in Salt Lake wants 4k and I think that is too much...
mike

[ERA 626]

Does any one know about when the new genesis blocks are going to be ready??
Mike

HEY MIKE,

GENESIS 427 SIDE OILER BLOCKS ARE AVAILABLE *NOW*.

IRON BLOCK - - - - - - - $2995.00

ALUMINUM BLOCK - - - $3995.00

CONTACT RON MILLER AT "FORD POWER PARTS".

PHONE: 562-921-5300

E-MAIL: fpp@gte.net

ASK HIM TO SEND YOU THE "ATTACHMENT" WITH THE GENESIS INFO.

I'M SORRY, IF I WASN'T SO DARN COMPUTER STUPID I COULD PROBABLY RE-SEND IT TO YOU.

IT LOOKS LIKE A TERRIFIC PIECE OF EQUIPMENT. I INTEND TO ORDER ONE AS SOON AS I HAVE A PLACE REBUILT TO PUT IT. I KNOW THAT GENESIS HAS DONE A GREAT DEAL OF TESTING ON THESE BLOCKS BEFORE THEY PUT THEM "ON THE STREET".

HAVE A REALLY GREAT DAY,

BLACKJACK

[ERA 626]

Thanks Black I will look into it. I heard that the Iron blocks were $2000 where are you getting your prices from? maybe my source is unreliable. Can we buy direct from Genesis or do we have to use a middle man??
Mike

[ERA535]

I have heard that the Genesis iron blocks require sleeving before use....make sure to ask about that before purchase.

[TERRY M KRYSTOFIAK]

MIKE,
IF YOU LIVE IN THE BAY AREA, TOP OF THE HILL RACING BUILDS A REAL RELIABLE 427. ASK SOME OF THE NOR CAL GROUP WHO RUN COBRAS. NOT TAKING ANYTHING AWAY FROM SOUTHERN AUTOMOTIVE THERE ARE THREE MEMBERS WITH CSX4000'S WHO HAVE REPLACED HIS ENGINES. IN ALL FAIRNESS THE RUN REAL HARD ON THE TRACK. TO GET BIG RELIABLE HORSEPOWER IS NOT A CHEAP ADVENTURE. I LOOKED FOR OVER A YEAR FOR THE RIGHT BLOCK THAT SONIC TESTED STRONG. WHAT EVER YOU DO, THE ERA WILL HANDLE IT!! I DO HAVE A 427 MED. RISER I HAD BUILT AS A BACK UP FOR MY ERA, BUT IT HAS SAT WITH DYNO HOURS ONLY. KEPT IT WHEN I SOLD THE CAR.
TERRY

HELLO MIKE,

I GOT THE PRICES OUT OF RON MILLERS BROCHURE AT "FORD POWER PARTS". THEY SEEMED TO BE A BIT HIGHER THAN I REMEMBERED. I PRESUME THAT FORD POWER PARTS IS ACTING AS A RETAILER AND HAS APPLIED A MARK-UP. I'M NOT SURE IF THE BLOCKS CAN BE PURCHASED DIRECTLY FROM GENESIS. MY FIRST CONTACT WITH THEM A YEAR AGO LEFT ME WITH THE IMPRESSION THAT THEY WERE GOING TO "SELL DIRECT".

I JUST TRIED TO CONTACT GENESIS BY THE PHONE NUMBER THEY LISTED IN THEIR WEB SITE, 317-733-8644. IT WAS A FAX MACHINE. THEIR WEB SITE IS genesis427.com. I SENT THEM AN E-MAIL REQUESTING MORE INFO.

I'LL DO A LITTLE MORE RESEARCH AND POST ANY RESULTS THAT I FIND.

Y'ALL HAVE A REALLY GREAT DAY,

BLACKJACK

[Toivo]

for more on Genesis blocks, see here:


Forum discussion of blocks

The $2000 price is too low, unless you're a member of FECA?

HEY TOIVO,

AS BEST AS I RECALL (AT MY AGE THAT'S ALWAYS A CHALLENGE), THE FIRST 50 OR SO MEMBERS OF FECA COULD PLACE ADVANCE ORDERS WITH GENESIS AND GET THE BLOCKS FOR 2K. I THINK I WAS ABOUT NUMBER 65 SO I WASN'T EVEN PLACED ON A WAIT LIST.

MY RECOLLECTION IS THAT AFTER THE FIRST 50 (OR SO) THE PRICE OF THE BLOCKS WOULD BE 2350.00 OR SOMETHING AROUND THAT NUMBER. I CAN'T GO BACK AND LOOK IT UP BECAUSE ALL OF MY BACK ISSUES OF FECA NEWSLETTER ARE SMOKE.

BTW: I HAVN'T RECEIVED A NEWS LETTER IN MANY MONTHS. I KNOW THAT THEY ARE SENT OUT "IRREGULARLY" BUT I THINK IT MUST BE 7 OR 8 MONTHS SINCE I GOT ONE.

ANY LATEST INFO ON FECA????


Y'ALL HAVE A GREAT DAY,

BLACKJACK

[CSX 4027]

The original blocks were said to go .030 over max but I have heard of .040 living without a problem. It all depends if there was core shift which was common. The walls could even be thin at .020. Make sure every used block is sonic checked. It could also be porous.