427 engine build

[Alfa02]

Nope Patrickt, I'm taking my Cobra with me. Can you just imagine what the roads would be like?? Well like "Heaven" !!

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

I don’t own a cobra.. seriously considering one now.. Unique or ERA

I would recommend you start with how much money you intend to spend. If you are in the $30K to $50K area, buy a used car off a site like BAT (Bring a Trailer). If you are in the $50 to $80K area, buy a used car off, you guessed it - BAT.

If you are in the low $100K window, consider buying and building. If you have never built one of these, buy a used car off BAT.

By now, you should be picking up a theme here. As many of the guys have already suggested building one of these is not like anything you have ever done before — even if you are a motorsports enthusiast. If you have built 'for real' race cars or open-wheel race cars, you will have the skills and, most importantly, the facilities and tools to do one of these builds.

If not, you will end up like so many before you with an incomplete build that you have given up on, cut corners to save money, and are now attempting to sell for $0.50 on the dollar and typically less because buyers demand higher build standards than you were willing to pay for.

Same story on the engine. Decide big block or small block desired horsepower (don't get crazy, 550 hp is a LOT in a 2400 lb car) and go to a builder like Brent Lykins (on the site here) and have him build you an engine from oil pan to air cleaner. You will be thousands of dollars ahead of the game, and you will not kill the engine before you have the first 500 miles on the car.

These cars look beautiful and are more arduous than almost any project you will undertake unless it is a Daytona Coupe or a GT-40. Don't piss away a pile of money — you'll be happier if you don't. And, we have not even touched on how not to kill yourself yet ...

[MGP69stang]

Well .. ERA or Unique manufactured 10-15 years ago is still at $70-80k with a 428 if they come up for sale at all , so why not build a new one since those 2 manufacturers don’t deprecate

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

Well .. ERA or Unique manufactured 10-15 years ago is still at $70-80k with a 428 if they come up for sale at all , so why not build a new one since those 2 manufacturers don’t deprecate

Have you ever built any car before? Done a frame-off restoration?

Do you have the tools? Starting with a lift?

I have a sense this will be one of the kits sold for half price in 5 years.

[MGP69stang]

If I buy it will be either ERA or Unique

[MGP69stang]

Roller that steers and stops

[NROTOXIN]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

Roller that steers and stops

Called a Turn key - minus.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

Well .. ERA or Unique manufactured 10-15 years ago is still at $70-80k with a 428 if they come up for sale at all , so why not build a new one since those 2 manufacturers don’t deprecate

OP, this is not about any particular replica manufacturer. Buy whatever makes your foot pat.

This is about YOU! YOUR skills, YOUR experience, and YOUR ability to complete a project of this magnitude and of course let's not forget — the fact you have never undertaken anything like this before. How do we know? Your questions give it away. We have already been where you are going! Pay attention; it is to your advantage.

Your question,

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

...so why not build a new one ...

This indicates you have not been reading what the members have been telling you. You have the unique benefit of using the collective experience of many current owners who have already been where you are going.

You are not hopping up an engine in an already built car or even swapping in a new, bigger, more potent one. You are building a high-fidelity replica of a 1960s World Champion purebred race car, and you are doing it from the ground up.

The big difference is twofold:

• You will do it with an engine that has perhaps 50% more power and torque than the original championship cars,
• You will do it without the original builders' experience, knowledge, expertise, or skills.

Just a couple of examples;

Can you explain what anti-squat and anti-dive suspension geometry requires to be properly implemented?

Can you explain what bump steer is and how to eliminate / mitigate it in a car?

Or, how about corner weighting? What do you want? How do you get it?

This is the easy stuff. Wait until you get to the hard stuff. Your line of questioning and the questions you are asking, along with the commentary you are offering, speak volumes about your experience and most importantly suitability to build vs buy one of these cars.

Buy a finished car that has been already sorted out and focus on how not to kill yourself.

In the driving and staying alive domain, do you know what trailing torque oversteer (TTO) is and what to do when you experience it?

Once you have owned one of these cars, learned about what it is and how it can kill you (without actually killing yourself), then maybe, only maybe, you might be ready, willing and capable of taking on a replica build of your own. Until then, you would be smart to go to BAT with a budget and see what your budget will allow you to play with.

[Alfa02]

Couldn't have said it better Ed. MGP69stang, listen to our knowledge & experience, you have come to us, for those very things. I've raced for 40+years, even Formula Fords which needs complete rebuilds after every season (min.) I brought a 60% done Classic Roadster with 427S/O rebuilt already, rolling classis, wiring done, brakes installed. Body needed to fit to frame, interior installed, paint, and wheels & tires, easy peasy for a guy like me, right. Also had the use (helping Hands) of other racers friends, a year tops (yeah Right) 5years, 3x the org. budget later, I was bound & determined to finish, never again will I waste the time & money (Very costly lesson, just in time 60yo started 65 when done, I could have been driving a Cobra in those years) We're just trying to help where we have failed. Cheers Tom.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by NROTOXIN

Called a Turn key - minus.

Which certainly improves the chance if success. It's still a multi year project for the hobbyist. Why not just buy one and enjoy driving it and pay them for all the headaches of putting it together. And be sure to ask how much money they are losing and what their hourly labor rate was and how much they spent on tools used once and never again.

[MGP69stang]

Thank you for all the advice.. I am now trying to source a 427fe block as the one I’d hope for fell through

[sunman]

ERA has 36 hours to finish a complete roller on the website. I’m starting to build a Classic Roadsters I bought 30 years ago. It’s money in the bank. I’ve been driving IROCs, Corvettes and early Mustangs now it’s time for a zero mile new Cobra. I didn’t miss nothing. You don’t need a lift only the tools most car guys have.
The photo galleries here are priceless packed with info.
The guys here are sharp and ready to help. Anything you need to know is a post away.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

Thank you for all the advice.. I am now trying to source a 427fe block as the one I’d hope for fell through

Well that's a shame. You know, except for the side oiler gallery running down the side of the block, there's no difference in any of the FEs other than how much meat is around the cylinders for boring. And what's more, you can't tell the difference between any of the FE engines once they're in a Cobra. If you have a side oiler in there, you can't confirm that because you can't see the side of the block either by looking down from the top or by peeking under the car. So, if you can't get your hands on an original side oiler block that hasn't been windowed years ago, or sleeved up the wazoo, consider talking with your builder about what he can do with a meaty FE block that is not a side oiler -- maybe even a 390. And there are so many advantages to stroking your FE with a nice SCAT crank that I won't even broach the subject. Just take my word for it, you want to do it.

[MGP69stang]

So stroke a 390 to 427ci ? At least it would be a 427FE sort of.

[MGP69stang]

So could the 390 be bored to 4.23 ?

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

So stroke a 390 to 427ci ? At least it would be a 427FE sort of.

Any of our trusted FE gurus can take an easily found, proved to be meaty by sonic tests, 390 and turn it in to your dream FE engine that you couldn't tell the difference in performance from the side oiler that got away. If you're hung up on the number "427" they could probably hit that number for you, although the bore won't be as fat. But my advice is to forget the numbers and rely instead on the expertise of the builder. They will tell you that stroking and boring a 390 with the right parts will easily out-perform original side oilers. And if you stumble on a nice original 428 block, that's even better.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by MGP69stang

So could the 390 be bored to 4.23 ?

No, you'd make it up with increased stroke.

[patrickt]

If you bump the 390's bore up just a hair from 4.05 to 4.06 and then put a SCAT 4.125 stroker crank in you have the magic number of 427 cubes. But it's dumb to chase a number like that. Talk to your builder about what he can do with a decent FE block and forget the numbers.

[mrmustang]

On a slight tangent here, but you may want to add your location (state), as your planned build may be complicated by your states emissions regulations. Some states, even some counties in some states base the emissions on the year of the block. While others the year of the documented build based on the MSO/MCO. While some others have emissions waivers for kit cars. Best you know this going into the initial build, then find out after you are sitting awaiting your basic paperwork to go through. Always best to be prepared ahead of time, just saying.

Bill S.

[MGP69stang]

How are engine temperatures in a hot climate like south Florida with the push / pull fan arrangements plus oil cooler