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11-10-2002, 07:50 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MA,
Posts: 67
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427SO vs Genesis 427 iron
If you could choose between a 67 Standard bore SO and the new genesis 427 Iron blocks, with the money being the same ($3500+/-), which one would you go for and why???
Thanks
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11-10-2002, 07:57 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chicago,
IL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 454 S.O.
Posts: 1,684
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Don't think anybody has built a Genesis yet, are they available?. If they have, I would like to hear about it also.
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Jeff
“If you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough horsepower.”
Mark Donahue
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11-10-2002, 08:03 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Northport,
NY
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham, KMP178 / '66 GT350H, 4-speed
Posts: 10,362
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...despite a whole bunch of mis-starts, I have heard that the first cast blocks from Genesis will ship this month
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11-10-2002, 08:26 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chicago,
IL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 454 S.O.
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Should be interesting.
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Jeff
“If you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough horsepower.”
Mark Donahue
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11-10-2002, 08:53 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MA,
Posts: 67
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Genesis Block
Flatlander is offering them now with prices. www.flatlanderracing.com
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11-10-2002, 09:06 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Northport,
NY
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham, KMP178 / '66 GT350H, 4-speed
Posts: 10,362
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Bax...quite frankly, everyone in the chain has been offering them with prices for quite a while....there's just has been no product to deliver yet.
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11-10-2002, 09:19 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MA,
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So I guess it's a wait and see  Well I found an SO standard bore, and I was just trying to get a feel for the way you guys would lean if it were you. The Old vs New poll got me thinking, but there is no way I'm spending 5-6 g's for the shelby block!
PS while I have your attention, which way would you go on these Bare heads: MR- ported + 219/173 valves OR the Edelbrock aluminum 427 heads and add the larger valves.
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11-10-2002, 09:49 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern California,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: -Sold- Contemporary 427S/C # CCX-3152 1966 427 Med Rise Side Oiler, 8v 3.54:1 Salisbury IRS, Koni's.. (Now I'm riding Harleys)
Posts: 2,567
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Here's my credit card #xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-1651.. Order me three of them and see what happens.. sucker..
Regards,
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michael
A man that is young in years, may be old in hours, if he have lost no time. But that happeneth rarely. Generally, youth is like the first cogitations, not so wise as the second. For there is a youth in thoughts, as well as in ages... Sir Francis Bacon (1561-1626)
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11-10-2002, 09:59 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern California,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: -Sold- Contemporary 427S/C # CCX-3152 1966 427 Med Rise Side Oiler, 8v 3.54:1 Salisbury IRS, Koni's.. (Now I'm riding Harleys)
Posts: 2,567
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michael
A man that is young in years, may be old in hours, if he have lost no time. But that happeneth rarely. Generally, youth is like the first cogitations, not so wise as the second. For there is a youth in thoughts, as well as in ages... Sir Francis Bacon (1561-1626)
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11-10-2002, 10:34 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern California,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: -Sold- Contemporary 427S/C # CCX-3152 1966 427 Med Rise Side Oiler, 8v 3.54:1 Salisbury IRS, Koni's.. (Now I'm riding Harleys)
Posts: 2,567
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Not Ranked
In all seriousness.. Go with the Genesis, just not the first batch IF and WHEN they come out. This has been going on since April of 2000, when a Genesis iron block was priced at $1700 and the aluminum was $2000.. The original ship date was suppose to be April 15, (should have been April 1.. April fools day) They haven't and won't be for a good long time.. Go to their website..
http://www.genesis427.com/
The notion you will find a Shelby 427 block for 6k is not likely.. Shelby documented 427's have risen dramatically and if you can find one it will be generally sold as a complete engine (or scrap) and will go for well over 13-15k.. (I know because I bought one)
There are NOS service blocks being sold for 5k.. Those will need extensive oil passage porting, they should be decked and line bored to insure correct geometry.. In short you are probably going to have 6k in a service block.
A better choice might be a seasoned (late model) std. bore to .015-.020 over bore. As the bore goes up the price goes down.. Later engines (late '66+) had thicker, squared cylinder walls.. As well as provisions for hydraulic lifters..
Stay away from the coasts.. If you can buy an engine in the south or mid west you will be better off.. They seem to have tons of old stuff laying around from various 60's racing efforts, NASCAR and NHRA..
Ebay will often have 427's available.. BEWARE.. a good number of these are warmed over low HP marine engines, 1/2 of which were reverse rotation units and while look like side oilers are not..
If I had it to do over and I didn't want to spend big money on an FE I might go buy a 385 series crate motor (429-460) which now can be had in 502 rated at 500+ hp
Good Luck,
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michael
A man that is young in years, may be old in hours, if he have lost no time. But that happeneth rarely. Generally, youth is like the first cogitations, not so wise as the second. For there is a youth in thoughts, as well as in ages... Sir Francis Bacon (1561-1626)
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11-10-2002, 10:42 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Olympia/Lacey,
WA
Cobra Make, Engine: West Coast. 514 / 6 speed Richmond overdrive
Posts: 1,981
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I have learned..
NEVER to purchase a first production run of ANYTHING. This in part comes from my experience in industrial R& D, but also from having tried Alpha products a few times...unless it has an IRON clad warranty, no thanks.
Wait for at least the Beta version !
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James Madison, father of the Constitution, said, "If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy." He also said, "No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare..."
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http://www.standdown.net/index.htm
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11-12-2002, 07:06 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: E BRUNSWICK N.J. USA,
Posts: 3,841
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Baxter. Has anybody seen a machine block finish from Genesis? The motors I have seen are not machined. With a price that low there has to be a catch. Are the cylinders sleeved? Shelby motor is overbuilt for the average car owner but you can go to 550 cids.You guys should wait and see if any of these motors get on the road before spending 3G. Dove is was to have these motors 5 years ago and still nothing. I would hate to see someone get screwed on this motor. Genesis should do a build up in Kit Car and lets see how it turns out. The prototype motor they had at Carlisle show had no steam holes, in the block, lifter bores where not honed. It was a rough case. Slow down Bax. I know it's hard. Rick Lake
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11-12-2002, 11:20 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern California,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: -Sold- Contemporary 427S/C # CCX-3152 1966 427 Med Rise Side Oiler, 8v 3.54:1 Salisbury IRS, Koni's.. (Now I'm riding Harleys)
Posts: 2,567
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Not Ranked
There are none.. zero, nada.. The last Shelby engine I saw was 35k... Good luck.. As it happens I just saw a fresh plane jane 427 SO .030 (ready for sleeves) sell on ebay with an aluminum intake (repro) and a homemade oil pan for 8K
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michael
A man that is young in years, may be old in hours, if he have lost no time. But that happeneth rarely. Generally, youth is like the first cogitations, not so wise as the second. For there is a youth in thoughts, as well as in ages... Sir Francis Bacon (1561-1626)
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11-13-2002, 07:31 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MA,
Posts: 67
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SCOBRAC
I have a line on a standard bore so block. The guy wants $3500. He also has MR heads ready to go for $1200. Less if bought together. So I can get one of those. You are obsessed with the Shelby. My Question was more along the line of; Should I buy the Genesis when there is one to be had. Or buy the above mentioned. Chill Dude, I was asking, beacause my engine builder said the 427 wasn't that great a block to begin with ie, leaked even when new, brittle,what not. So I was thinking maybe the Genesis would be a better design, without those shortcomings.
Regards
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11-13-2002, 08:24 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Bay Area,
FL
Cobra Make, Engine: What Cobra?
Posts: 7,193
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Baxter take the SO block for $3200.00 Even if you don't use it, you can always sell it.
Don't hold your breath for the genesis block.
TURK
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11-13-2002, 04:13 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chicago,
IL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 454 S.O.
Posts: 1,684
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Not Ranked
Tried to find a phone number for them yesterday, it does't exist.
__________________
Jeff
“If you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough horsepower.”
Mark Donahue
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11-14-2002, 06:12 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: kennesaw ga.,
ga
Cobra Make, Engine: era,427 genesis side oiler
Posts: 42
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Not Ranked
I have one that is being shiped on friday. I have not seen it yet but I am told that is totaly machined and ready to go. Other than bore size. They told me that it is under sized so if you want standerd bore you got it. I have my fingers crossed, as this is a 3000.00 dolar gambel. I will post more once I have seen the block. Untill then wish me the best of luck.
Jeff Neely
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11-14-2002, 06:43 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: E BRUNSWICK N.J. USA,
Posts: 3,841
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Jeff Neely Your the leader.  Go luck with the motor. They did not cut the cylinders to a standard size? Make sure that a bore plate is put on that motor before the cylinders are cut. Does this motor have the oiling system drilled out to blueprint spec? Have your machinist check that block out good before you due any machine work. I have only seen a rough cast, hope the finished one is alot better. Take some pictures of it when you get it. Rick Lake |
11-14-2002, 08:08 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Bay Area,
FL
Cobra Make, Engine: What Cobra?
Posts: 7,193
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I wonder why they won't update their website?
Jeff, good luck. For those of us who have been waiting for this with baited breath, please keep us posted.
TURK
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11-14-2002, 12:44 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Bay Area,
FL
Cobra Make, Engine: What Cobra?
Posts: 7,193
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This was in my mail box TODAY.
This was in response to how I can go about getting one. It seems the date has been pushed further again.
"You can buy direct from Genesis. Iron is $3410 and Al is $ 4467 plus
shipping and handling in both cases. Delivery will be in late Feb.."
TURK
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