Help;

[Todd Hedges]

I can not figure out what's wrong with setting the Timing for my 428.

At 3000 rpm I'm trying to set the timing to 33 degrees.
It keeps flashing to either side of the pointer/indicator.
Above and below it.

The engine runs like crap.
It'll backfire through the carb
It'll shutdown at idle
It won't idle well.

Help.

[decooney]

Todd,
sometimes a fresh set of eyes and troubleshooting procedures helps. I may be wrong, but I recall discussions from another thread where several provided pointers. After verifying the basics, did you have your MSD box/distributor tested, correctly? I did not see a response on that. Sometimes the smallest things can be overlooked when it becomes frustrating; and it happens to all of us. It sounds like it's time to get a professional with a new perspective on it. Good troublehooters can usually sort it out in less than one hours shop time. Good Luck!

[Coloradocobra]

What distributor are you running? I had very similar symptoms when the rotor portion of my Pertronix unit moved up on the rotor shaft slghtly. The top of the pickup and the rotor have to be exactly even or it will not fire consistently.

Other possibility might be a severely worn distributor gear.

And, I have also attempted to set my timing to 33 degrees AFTER top dead center on another car in a murphy moment.

Gary

[Tongue Pirate]

Check all of the simple & mechanical things first.
Did you changes the plugs & swap wire on accident?
Is your timing chain old or could it have slipped.
Is the Carburetor new? A friend just put a rebuilt carburetor on a engine & it showed the same symptoms. He thought the engine had gone south.

[Todd Hedges]

Still working on it.
Checked the timing light - okay
checked "cross-over" from another wire - okay
checked wrong wires on plugs - okay

Point taken on the experts.
I'm going to load the car and trailer it to the engine builder.
See if he can figure it out.

I pray it's not the cam gear again.
Worst case - I could deal with a bad timing chain/gear.
Prefer bad plugs and wires - although unlikely.
Bad MSD 6AL??
Bad Coil??
Who knows.

I'll up date with results when I figure it out.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

[xcobraj]

Todd,give Greg a call at Dyno Time in Prospect,tell him I told you to call.Good luck

[edwhite7]

Todd, I had a very similar problem and it drove me crazy. I finally convinced myself that the MSD 6AL was bad. I was about to remove it when I discovered that the ground wire was removing itself. Just an idea. Another place to look if you have the MSD billet distributer is that the Hall effect wires do not run near your coil wire or other voltage sources.

[mr0077]

Todd, I had similar problems (never noticed the fluctuating timing, though), and it turned out to be a bad cap on the MSD billet distributor...changed that and no more missing out and backfiring through the carb (and VERY difficult starting problem went away, too). Try a new cap, it's cheap...mine was 2 years and 4200 miles old. Let us know what you guys find out.

[SCOBRAC]

yea, check every one of the plug wires for proper order. It sounds like you have two switched...

[SCOBRAC]

ok.. now verify you have both clean uninterupted power (except for the key / ignition switch) and clean ground. DO NOT use power off another appliance or scavenge a ground off something else.

my car had the same problem when I bought it and it was bad (weak) power to the ignition system that actually caused the former owner to frag an engine (he thought it was a carb problem)

[Todd Hedges]

Have clean power,
Checked the plugs, all look the same.
All look realitively "good"
No oil, ash, carbon, excessive gas, etc.
Checked compression - all cylinders are 179 to 183psi
Checked wires - all appear okay.
Checked cap on dustributor - looks good, no oxidation


How can you verify the function and performance of the MSD 6AL?
Next step... back to the engine builder next Saturday.
still backfires through the carb.
hard to start, poor idle, no low end throttle responce.
Appears okay above 3,000 rpms.

[KobraKarl]

Todd,

exept for the timing light twitch, the rest of your symtoms sound like a very lean carbureator. popping and running crappy til your main fuel circuit kicks in... have you try backing out your idle screws? Admittedly I know nothing about msd or electronic ignitions but .......a little timing light bounce is not unusual with vacuum or centrifical advance distributers as they twitch a bit with every fuel variation..good luck ! KK

[Nantucket427]

I am back to the CAP oxidation is not the only thing to look for it may have a hair line crack.

[chopper]

Todd:

For instructions on checking MSD ignition box, go to:

http://www.msdignition.com/

and select Troubleshooting from the menu. They have instructions on how to check the system safely.

Also, unless I missed it, you never stated what type of distributor you are running. If it is the MSD billet unit, you may wish to ensure that the centrifugal advance mechanism is functioning correctly. I had one which I purchased about five years ago. After about 12 months, I started having serious starting problems. I talked with the MSD folks and they told me that they had tried a different anti-corrosive treatment on the advance mechanism and it simply didn't work. My weights had stuck at full advance and wouldn't retract, preventing the timing from retarding at low rpm. This would result in exactly the symptoms you report; runs fine at high rpm but runs poorly and backfires or dies at low rpm. I returned my distributor to MSD and they replaced all of the internals under warranty even though it was not still covered (Kudos to MSD, BTW). Just a thought here.

[edwhite7]

I also had this problem with my MSD unit. It would cause my engine to take a long time to return to idle. I now use a little WD-40 every couple of weeks. Since it a hall effect instead of points I dont think that a little oil will hurt it.

[Todd Hedges]

Found out the power valves on the Holley are blown.
Go figure.
That plus a few other minor odds and ends that need some TLC, like the internals to the dist. which did oxidize.
Waiting for parts now.
Once repaired, I'll let you know how it turned out.
Thanks to all who helped me look for the possible problems.

[edwhite7]

Todd,
The backfire through the carb can blow the power valves. This may be a result of your problem and not the cause. The dist. advance being oxidized may be the cause especially if you are using the light return springs.