HELP! a 428 challenge!

[johnd9]

Okay Clubcobra friends,

I have a challenge for all of you. Here is my situation. I just bought a Cobra that has a very stock 428 in it (I will give engine details below). I have $2500 and I want to get the most power out of the engine possible while maintaining its driveability and keeping it on pump gas. What parts/changes are the best bang for my buck?

What I have now:
428 FE block
stock pistons, rods, etc.
Cam is an edelbrock 194/204 duration @ .050 and .46/.48 lift
heads are aluminum Edelbrock heads 2.09 intake, 1.66 exhaust, 3/8 valves, etc. (part no. 60069)
Manifold is an Edelbrock Performer 390
Carb is an HP 4150
Exhaust are the normal cobra side pipes
Mallory ignition

What would you change and what would you change it to?

Thank you so much!

John

[PatBuckley]

I would put a Performer RPM intake on it along with a little stouter cam.

That is it.

Spend the rest of the money on women.

Pat

[bmalone]

What Pat said and possibly the pipes--open them up a bit, that is.

[johnd9]

To both of you. I am looking at the Edelbrock Performer RPM manifold, doing a 5 way valve job (I think that is what he said), and installing one of two cams.

1) Lunati 242/258 duration @ .50 and 535/535 lift
2) Comp Magnum Hydraulic Flat Tappet cam - model 292H with a 244/244 duration and .560/.560 lift.

Which would you suggest of those two cams being that I want the most driveable HP increase I can get while keeping it on pump gas? What do you think of the valve job...is it worth it?

Thanks again and where are you located in Northern California? Im from Healdsburg...

John

[PatBuckley]

Hi John -

I would recommend that you ask a pro engine builder the cam question....George Anderson from Gessford or Tom Lucas in Sacramento would be glad to clue you in I am sure.

I am in Rescue CA - a little town near Folsom. It was allegedly the starting off spot for the rescuers that went to find the remains of the Donner party....

What kind of Cobra did you get?

Pat

[KobraKarl]

naw....... spend it all on women, unless of course you are married.................then spend it on your misstress ......................................of COURSE I meant your car........................

.............sure I did

KK

[SFfiredog]

I'd go with the Comp Extreme Energy grind XE274H
It has a little less duration than the Magnum but quicker, more modern lobe profiles and the lift should, I repeat should not require fly-cutting the pistons. The Performer RPM is a given.
The valve lob is a good idea; I've seen complete head out-of-the-box valve jobs that were lacking. I would also go with a good rocker arm assy like Erson or Doug at Presision Oil Pumps' set up.
If you still have the stock oil pan I would replace it a good one from Canton, Armando's or Aviad if your're gonna drive it fast in corners.
--Mike

[bittentoo]

John,

I would call Sonny Hall @ 979-548-2772. He has raced 428 cobra jets all of his life and now his two sons are racing. They hold several nhra records in the 428 class (not sure of what bracket) and Sonny knows what makes a 428 run. He won't guide you wrong. He built an engine for Jim Weatherall that is a member here.

Fell free to use my name if you call him.

Kelly Mullins

[Clois Harlan]

John.

Take your block to a good machine shop that is not into turning out volume. I used Carbones' Machine Shop in Tulsa and they made all the difference in the world. Gessford is another great machine shop as is Southern Automotive and FE Specialist. These shops know the FE engine and what it takes to make one live and live well. Clearances are more critical on the FE engine than probably any other engine. I have had a poorly built engine and the one I have now that is BUILT RIGHT! I don't have over heating problems or oiling problems and I have plenty of power for the track.

I brought Carbone's Machine Shop a standard bore 428 CJ block and my Crank that needed to be cleaned up to .030 bore. Kent and Steve did a line bore, decking and squaring of all surfaces. Balancing of all rotating parts. Then they supplied new Speed Pro pistons and pins which were sized to each cylinder, new bearings, rings, oil pump and pickup that were blue printed to my Canton oil pan. In addition they provided all new gaskets, Crane solid lifter cam (572 lift & 232 Dur @ .50), new timing chain, plus they assemblied the whole thing for less than $2500.00.

When I brought my block to Kent I also brought my Eagle rods, Smith adjustable push rods, Sig Erson Roller Rockers, Edelbrock alum heads, MSD Dist, Edelbrock 2x4 med riser manifold, Edelbrock water pump, March pulleys, Carbs etc. plus my flywheel and clutch.

These guys are racers and know how to build an engine. So the point I am trying to make is choose your machinist carefully and don't necessarily go with the cheapest (it may cost you big sooner than later).

Good luck with you build.

Clois

I know this from experience

[johnd9]

Thanks Kelly, I just called sonny and set a time to talk with him on Tuesday since I will be out tomorrow. He seems very helpful and I hope to get some more good direction on Monday.

I think it is coming down to a cam, intake and a little valve/head work. He thinks doing those three things I should be able to clear 475 HP on it so that will be plenty.

Thanks again!

John

[bittentoo]

John,

Glad that you hooked up with Sonny. I've known him for 30 years, a great guy. He helped me pick out the cam for my 351 4v cleveland that goes in my 71 Torino.

Keep us posted on what you decide on.

[johnd9]

Pat

I got a Lonestar - built in 1999, had 2100 miles on it when I bought it. I already mentioned the engine specs, has a Tremec- 5 speed, 9 inch rear end, black on black. The previous owner didnt really know how to keep it beautiful so I used a very light rubbing compound and polish and the car looks like a totally different car now.

Do you have any pictures of yours other than the all metal one that is up? Beautiful body.

John

[FUNFER2]

Clois hit the spot. I agree with most of all she said. If you want to stay basic & not tune all the time, good torque, h.p,& sound, you don't have to go radical with very expensive parts. Get the block good & sound. Line bore &, honed, do the FE oiling mods & good oil pump, forged pistons, but not needed, stock crank is fine, just have it polished shot peened & checked, try to get everything balanced, check & resize both ends of the rods. Go with the performer rpm manifold, the runners are larger, port match the, manifold, heads & gaskets, (with the alum. heads it's easy) Cam- I like Comp cams, others are fine also. Stay around 248 duration & under, 570 lift. If you go higher on the lift, you'll need higher spring weights, valves ect. If you want the "lopy" sound, lobe sep. angle is important, the higher the number, the smoother running, stay under 110 deg. Ultradyne also has some good cams. Don't worry too, much of the advertised rpm rates for the listed cams, we have very light weight cars so it's not as important as a heavy, Camaro, Firebird, ect...., but, stick around 2,500 & under. Carb- a good old Holley is fine, just put a rebuild kit in it, if you have the funds, go with a Berry Grant, awesome carb. All, of this depends on how you want to use the car, good daily driver to all out street thumper ! Since it sounds like a good street car, you can do it easy with the $$$ you have. Big blks have great torque & fun on the street. If you want high rpm's & hp...it costs big bucks. Straight block, good flowing heads, cam & carb, is where to put the money.
Kev

[PatBuckley]

John -

Thanks - I had forgotten I had a picture in the gallery...I will put some more in there soon.

Pat