Prices for engines?

diiulio · #1 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 01:25 PM

I just started looking around for some FE engines. I came across an older garage and started talking to the owner. He has a complete standard 390 from a 63 T-bird that has had the higher compression heads swapped on, the engine is complete and he offered it to me for $250. He also has a 390 SCJ block, crank, rods, and heads (non-high compression), that is mostly disassembled and he offered it to me for $200.

Are these deals I should jump on? or should I keep looking for the 428 that I am searching out? I was thinking of maybe buying both, and using high compression heads from one on the other SCJ block, but I would rather have a 428. Your thoughts?

He had a 428 block and crank behind the building, but he said that they were in rough shape and weren't worth even showing me.

Cracker · #2 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 01:53 PM

SCJ 390? Do those exist?

Woodz428 · #3 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 02:04 PM

No 390 SCJ,or CJ for that matter. GT was the most common performance 390, but there was a Hi-Po 390 in the early '60's.

CJ428CJ · #4 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 02:39 PM

Unless your budget is very tight, keep looking until you find a 428. It may cost you a grand or so more but you won't ever have that "I wish I had gone with the 428" feeling.

Chris

DKing · #5 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 02:47 PM

There's some good books to take a look at on this. One is the Ford Parts Interchange, and another would be Steve Christ's "How to Rebuild you big block Ford". These would allow you to look up what you're being sold, to determine if you're getting what you think you're getting. Saved me once already on an Ebay 428 "Police Interceptor" engine. (It wasn't a "real" PI...)

In regard to Cobra engines, my plan is to go "cheap" and build a mildly wild 428. If it gets to feeling too weak, I'll build an alloy 427 later, when I have more dough to burn.

My reasoning for conveying this is that $200 for a 390 sounds like a good deal, based upon the prices for 428's I've been seeing --- providing that it doesn't have any cracks or repairs, and won't require an extraordinary amount of machining. You could pick up that motor (be it a standard 390 or otherwise) and build a respectable engine "on the cheap", and then switch to a monster FE later on. This gets your Cobra on the road for a smaller bottom line. Lot's of guys have 390's in their Cobras. From what I understand, even some of the originals had 390's, though most were 428 PI, 427 SO, and 427 CO.

Just a thought. Good luck!

diiulio · #6 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 02:52 PM

Thanks guys. Yea, I have access to those books when I am home, but I am currently 5 hrs. away from home and will be for a few more days.

I guess I will keep looking. Thanks guys.

I don't want to do it cheap the first time around because it always costs more in the end. I will just do it right the first time around.

diiulio · #7 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 03:04 PM

I do have a question now that I think about it.
The block he said was a 390 SCJ, had two sets of bosses for the engine mounts. He said it was a SCJ because it had more webbing around the crank. Now I can't remember if he said anything about crossbolting.

Does more webbing around the crank mean anything in terms of what block it is?

Chaplin · #8 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 03:10 PM

Diiulio-
As Woodz mentioned, there is no such thing as a 390 SCJ. If the block were a 428CJ or 428SCJ, then yes you would find extra webbing around the crank. As for the cross bolting, you would only find that on 427s (and 406s I think).

diiulio · #9 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 03:26 PM

Chaplin,
OK that is what I am asking, I realize now there isn't a SCJ or CJ, then what is it if it has extra webbing around the crank? does that mean that this is not a 390 and possibly a 428 CJ or SCJ? Is he selling me a 428, but thinks it is a 390, possibly?

What about it having two sets of two bosses for the motor mounts? The other 390 he had only had one set of bosses. Does this even mean anything?

The "supposedly" SCJ block was stamped 352 and from reading prior posts I am aware that this is because the mold was not changed when building the other blocks.

Thanks,
Jason

terry lee · #10 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 04:19 PM

diiulio,
Last year when I was looking for an FE block there was some guy in Buffalo NY. selling more crap than you could find in an old outhouse. This guy was more slippery than a rattlesnake soaked in 10W50. Several of us were drawn into his web of deceit on what he claimed to be 427 SO blocks, but fortunately the guy was such a poor BS artist I don't think anybody bought in from CC. Haven't heard much from him anymore, maybe changed his name, better yet left the planet.
Be carefull who you deal with, if you aren't 1000% sure of what you are buying. George Anderson @ Gessford, and Bill Parham @ Southern are respectable people to deal with, and have good access to the 428 block you are looking for. Both advertise here on CC. Remember cheap isn't always the best way to go; you get what you pay for!

Good luck and Happy hunting,
TL

FFR428 · #11 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 04:21 PM

If it is a "true CJ block" it will have the sand scratch "C" on the back left hand side of the block. Many FE and FT blocks have the extra webbing on the cranksaddle. Go to www.428cobrajet.org. This is the cobra jet registry. They have a ID section that covers ALL parts on the CJ/SCJ motors with pictures and correct part numbers. It might be a 390 punched out to a 4.13 bore (std 428) or the guy is full of S#%T or does not know what he has. G.

BB427 · #12 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 04:35 PM

If you can buy both for 400.00 or so ....DO IT!!!

A 390 is an excellent engine. Bore it .030. Install flat top double eyebrow forged pistons, Solid cam,and get a set of Edelbrocks and it will run with a 428.

If you want to spend the money look for a 427 if not a 390 is the way to go.

I am not saying the 428 is not a great engine. But to search and spend alot of $$$ on it makes no sense.

BANG FOR THE BUCK

360 truck block bored .060 = 402 ci.
flat top pistons
Ported Edels.
Comp Cam 294 S solid
-B rods
Edel RPM intake
750 Holley
482 HP
****************CHEAP****************

Cracker · #13 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 05:16 PM

What he has there is probably a 391 Truck block engine. These had the reinforced webbing around the mains along with extra thick cylinder walls for over boring. As always though you want to make sure the engine is sonic checked beforehand. George Anderson, by the way, told me as long as you don't mind carrying around 30 extra pounds the truck blocks are good to build around - if you find one. As he was saying they are becoming hard to find. Go figure, Sid-Oilers and hard to find 391 truck blocks!

ENTDOC · #14 (**permalink**) 11-05-2003, 05:22 PM

I would advise to continue to look for a 428.It is not that the 428 is so superior,as it is not,but it does have the distinction of having been placed in original cars and I feel you will be happier with that distinction. A little extra work and money will be well spent when your car is finished and you have what you always wanted.Now a 427SO is a whole different story.To you guys with 390 motors,it is a great motor and excellent choice for the original look at a small block price but this guy wants a 428. chuck

bomelia · #15 (**permalink**) 11-06-2003, 09:49 PM

I think this guy saw you coming!! Beware!

Sure, if it is a real 390 block, you might be able sell the parts.

Keep looking for a REAL 428 CJ.

diiulio · #16 (**permalink**) 11-10-2003, 02:02 PM

It seems like any 428 or even 427 I find is going to cost a mint. I am now just reconsidering puchasing a 428 from Southern or the like.
If I can find a solid 427 or 428, what am I looking at as far as cost for rebuilding.
My goals:
reliable, completely streetable
good torque at the low end
port & polish stock heads, 3 angle valve job (alum later when $ is right)
stock crank & rods
mild cam, alum intake, carb 750 cfm mechanical secondaries

Would I just be better off dropping the $7900 for the Southern 428. It almost seems a better option of finding a good 427 block and throwing in parts from a 390 (crank, rods, heads)

I already have the toploader for the setup. And will be puchasing a Unique to match it all together.

bomelia · #17 (**permalink**) 11-10-2003, 02:57 PM

I thought a good 428 was going for 10K.??

427s?? Fugetaboutit.

You can get a 428 CJ block for 800-1500 dollars. Build up assuming no excessive machining will add 4-5k.

Mike

FFR428 · #18 (**permalink**) 11-13-2003, 04:56 PM

For what it's worth there is a new sideoiler block coming out in 2004 for $2800. Not sure who is making them but if your going to drop $7900 on a 428 I'd wait and see what these new sideoilers are like. You might be able to build a 427 for about the same money or close to it. G.

foothills gary · #19 (**permalink**) 11-13-2003, 06:13 PM

Diiulio,if you buy an engine from Southern,they will probably deliver it to Unique for you for no additional charge,as they are close to each other and Bill is over there frequently.I was at one point considering a Unique,and the Weavers at that time said they would drop the engine in for me for the cost of the mounts.They are both great outfits,a phone call or two may save you a few pesos.

Keithc8 · #20 (**permalink**) 11-13-2003, 09:20 PM

We would be more than happy to help you with your FE project. We have 428 blocks, 427 blocks along with cranks, heads and intakes. We can build you about any type of FE you would like. I can get you a 428 together for about 7500.00 complete and I also have a 454 FE side oiler engine right now available with the Dove medium riser heads and sidewinder intake with Dove valve train. This engine is 11,000.00 of the dyno with MSD distributor and wires, Demon carburator and Edelbrock water pump. Let me know if we can help. Thanks Keith



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