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05-27-2004, 11:25 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. Louis,
Mo.
Cobra Make, Engine: 427 S.O. Dual Quad / Cobra undecided
Posts: 1,380
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Not Ranked
427SO block now a boat anchor
After magnafluxing my 427SO block my engine builder found what he felt could be a serious problem . Went ahead and had the block soni-checked where a crack in the #2 main bearing saddle was confirmed. Has anyone ever heard of fixing this? From all the information I have been able to gather this block is now a bust. Fortunatly I did not shell a lot of cash for this block so right now my losses are minimal. I am now considering a 427 top oiler or a 428 cj.
Any advice, opinions, or alternatives from you guys would be appreciated.
Thanks
M
Last edited by lineslinger; 05-27-2004 at 11:28 AM..
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Advertising
05-27-2004, 12:35 PM
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The longest build.....
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Midwest, USA,
KS
Cobra Make, Engine: Mid-States, 428 Police Interceptor, TKO 5 speed, Jaguar rearend, Trigos, and Guardsman Blue!!!
Posts: 612
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Not Ranked
M,
Check this guy out.
Talked to him last year about
doing almost the same thing to a 427.
Midwest Cylinder Head
1700 West "F" Avenue
Nevada, Iowa 50201 USA
Contact: Rex Baker
Phone: 515-382-2791
Toll-Free: 800-873-8506
Email: midwestcylhead@aol.com
If not, I would buy your boat anchor for $50.00 !!!
Good luck,
Bill
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05-27-2004, 03:16 PM
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Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Southern,
NJ
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX4300, C5AE-H, Toploader
Posts: 695
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Not Ranked
There is a company called Cast Metal Restorations that is well known for repairing cast iron blocks and heads. They have a web site. If you can not find it email me and I will locate it for you when I get back to my home computer, Sal.
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05-27-2004, 03:40 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
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Not Ranked
Couldn't be a worse place on the block to have a crack! Welding up a crack in just about any other location would be a snap. But the main bearings are the greatest stressed area.
Hopefully it can be addressed. It would be cool to have a side oiler over a top oiler or a 428. Worth looking into.
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05-27-2004, 03:54 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Livermore,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #629, BBM Side Oiler Block, 482ci, Richmond 5 speed
Posts: 852
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Not Ranked
Before I spent a ton of money repairing your block I'd consider going with one of the new Genesis blocks.
Chris
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05-27-2004, 04:04 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
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Not Ranked
Good luck getting one of those!
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05-27-2004, 04:11 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Bay Area,
FL
Cobra Make, Engine: What Cobra?
Posts: 7,193
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Not Ranked
Call George at Gessford Machine about the proper repair techique.
I am not sure I would have someone else repair the block and then have someone else build the motor.
It would be prudent to have the same people performing both operations that way there would be no finger pointing if it fails.
Right now you are out the cost of a replacement block. After it is all buttoned up, you may be out the cost of a complete FE engine, if it decides to granade itself.
TURK
__________________
OBAMA IN in 2012
Last edited by Turk; 05-27-2004 at 06:33 PM..
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05-27-2004, 05:07 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern California,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: -Sold- Contemporary 427S/C # CCX-3152 1966 427 Med Rise Side Oiler, 8v 3.54:1 Salisbury IRS, Koni's.. (Now I'm riding Harleys)
Posts: 2,567
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Not Ranked
The reality is the crack was likely there from day one. It would probably work fine without fixing it at all. Am I suggesting you do it. NO. I'm just saying most cracks are part of the manufacturing process. Many are only (in)visible through processes unknown or never done back in the day.
Should you have it repaired? It depends. What is the bore? If it's .030 or more maybe not. If it is .015-.020 probably. If it's sandard I would say hell yes.
__________________
michael
A man that is young in years, may be old in hours, if he have lost no time. But that happeneth rarely. Generally, youth is like the first cogitations, not so wise as the second. For there is a youth in thoughts, as well as in ages... Sir Francis Bacon (1561-1626)
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05-27-2004, 05:15 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Castle Rock,
CO
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 579
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Not Ranked
Follow Turks advise. George is a FE expert and will tell you the truth - not what you want to hear.
Good luck! A Side Oiler is a terrible thing to waste.
__________________
'It's not getting any smarter out there. You have to come to terms with stupidity and make it work for you.' -- Frank Zappa
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05-27-2004, 08:15 PM
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Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Southern,
NJ
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX4300, C5AE-H, Toploader
Posts: 695
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Not Ranked
Here is the link to the restoration shop. Like Turk said give George a call and ask for his opinion. I would listen to whatever he tells you about wether or not the engine can withstand this kind of repair. I was suggesting the other company because they have done a freeze cracked 427 block that I know of. The engine builder who then buildt the engine said it was a very nicely done repair. The freeze crack repair was $1000.00. If your block is a rare date then it would be worth the money. Good luck and I hope it works out for you, Sal. Crow Welding |
05-27-2004, 08:32 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Hastings, Nebraska USA,
Posts: 345
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Not Ranked
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05-27-2004, 09:38 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
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Not Ranked
So George are you saying there is no satisfactory way to repair a cracked main?
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05-28-2004, 06:29 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: E BRUNSWICK N.J. USA,
Posts: 3,841
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Not Ranked
Lineslinger M couple of things, Any motor can be welded up with the correct procedure. Block has to be heated to 600f for a time and special rods are needed to weld with. They do 2-3 heat cycles. It then goes on a stress table for some time and test the weld area. If OK the section of the block is stronger than anyother. Keep checking on E-Bay. Does it have to be a SO block?? 90% of the people wouldn't know the differents, Cobra nuts that's a different story. I am not a machinist but in the old days when motors cracked alot of them where welded. What are you going to do with this car, cruiser, racecar, waxer, Under easy care I would bet 20$ that motor will hold with a weld job and good machine work for truness. I will look for a couple of articles on welders who do this. You put side bolts in a 390 with caps and no one will see the differents. Last question HOW much HP&TORK are you looking for?? Answer these Q&A and maybe you found the answer. Rick Lake. Ps if you are going racing or building a top notch car you maywant to go with the Shelby or Genesis block. The Alum blocks are 90 lbs lighter than iron, in a cobra that's alot  
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05-28-2004, 12:05 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. Louis,
Mo.
Cobra Make, Engine: 427 S.O. Dual Quad / Cobra undecided
Posts: 1,380
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Not Ranked
The main reason the machinists are giving me negative feedback is this crack runs from the top of the saddle straight down through the cam bore and continues slightly into the webbing itself. Maybe one day I will spend the bucks to repair it properly but for this build I would like to start off with a solid block, not one with a crack in it.
428CJ could be the next contestant, testing starts soon. Wish me luck.
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05-28-2004, 12:08 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
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Not Ranked
Dang, thats a mean crack if it goes all the way into the cam bore. I'd be so nervous even after repair I'd be afraid to "hammer" the motor!
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05-28-2004, 12:16 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. Louis,
Mo.
Cobra Make, Engine: 427 S.O. Dual Quad / Cobra undecided
Posts: 1,380
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Not Ranked
Rick Lake,
I have looked at the aluminum blocks being offered by Carroll Shelby engine parts. I believe they are asking in excess of 5k for one of those. I did see a couple of NOS 427SO blocks for sale on ebay, one was $4,000 the other $4,200, this 428 block (if it has no cracks) is a lot more cost effective for my build, my budget for a completed power plant being $7,000 + or - including blowproof bell housing but no gear box.
Mark
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05-28-2004, 12:21 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. Louis,
Mo.
Cobra Make, Engine: 427 S.O. Dual Quad / Cobra undecided
Posts: 1,380
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Not Ranked
Excaliber,
I'm with you. I would always be worried about something letting go inside and sacraficing a lot of new and expensive parts. I know it would end up giving me nightmares and could you ever really open it up with that repaired crack haunting you?
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05-28-2004, 12:37 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Las Vegas,
NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham#182/Shelby 496c.i.
Posts: 756
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Not Ranked
lineslinger
In a month or two I'll be selling the sideoiler that I'm currently using in my Kirkham. It will be priced very close to what you're looking to spend. It's got about 5K miles on it and if you come to Vegas, you can even drive it.
Email me if you're interested.
__________________
"You can NEVER teach a pig to sing! You'd just be wasting your time and annoying the pig!"
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06-01-2004, 10:01 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. Louis,
Mo.
Cobra Make, Engine: 427 S.O. Dual Quad / Cobra undecided
Posts: 1,380
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Not Ranked
I thank all of you for the input and suggestions. I emailed George Gesford and gave him a brief description of the problem. As suspected, in his opinion, there are no options on fixing the damage to the bearing saddle.
If Mr. Gessford says its no good I think it wise to go with that and move on.
Thanks again for the help guys.
Mark
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06-01-2004, 10:12 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
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Not Ranked
ST, curious. What engine are you going with to replace the FE?
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