Value of an original 427 sideoiler engine?

[sideoiler10]

Hey Guys...need a little help here. I have found what I have been told is a 1966 427 sideoiler with single Holley (410 HP) with only 13,000 original miles on it. (maybe 1/4 mile at a time?)

Anyway, the older Gentleman says it came out of a 1966 Fairlane that had been wrecked many years ago, and has been stored in his garage with the big spine toploader tranny since.

I really don't need it, but if it is what he says it is I would be interested at a good price. Since it would be somewhat of a gamble on the condition is it worth much other than a block for a complete reuild? He doesn't know what to ask for it and I'm nervous about offering much without first tearing it down. Of course he doesn't want to tear it down.

What do you all think? Thanks for your input. Bob

[Woodz428]

Although Fairlanes with 427s are often talked about they are rarely seen, factory produced anyway. I would say it is unlikely and most probably a 390 GT engine. Having said that, if it is one, with that few miles and not having cracked ftom freezing over time or overheating after the accident, it is the most desirable of the FE engines. A price is pretty subjective without knowing condition, but I would guess a minimum of $6500. It could go for more depending on originality and part #'s on the components. I believe that all big blocks had the big input shaft transmission.

[Ibr8k4vetts]

First...Do you know a 427 when you see it? I don't unless it is in pieces. It MUST have a cross bolted block...BUT, that could still be a 406
Good luck

[Bunkie314]

Last SO block I put together leaked water into the cylinders after about 10 hrs run time. Old blocks have battle wounds that show later on and create heart ache and disasters.

Even a tear down doesn't give you all the details. Cleaning, inspection, and pressure test makes you feel somewhat more comfortable. I had mine tested at 50 psi and it still leaked.

I personally will never buy another used block for the above reasons. Besides, they are available new now.

[undy]

Originally Posted by Ibr8k4vetts

First...Do you know a 427 when you see it? I don't unless it is in pieces. It MUST have a cross bolted block...BUT, that could still be a 406
Good luck

There's been several posts, with pics, on the FE board of a couple non-cross bolted 427 irrigation motors. They also had the press-in feeze plugs. They had the riveted Ford "427" metal name plate on the block too. They both mic'd to 4.23x". For every rule there's an exception...

There are too many variables in buying a 427 of relatively unknown origin. A lot of the engines were beat within inches, and beyond, of their lives. A lot of blocks were "windowed" and jack-legged back together, crappy weld jobs .. the whole nine yards. The block cylinders were thin from the start and plaqued with core shift woes. You might end up with a jewel ... or a money pit.

[sideoiler10]

Thanks for the prompt response. Yeah, the big blocks all had the big tranny's. Considering that an old used engine (even if only 13K miles) has been setting around for all these years I'm sure it would have to be gone through, and possibly even rebuilt. Since any used engine of that vintage that has not been taken apart is a definite gamble, $6500 seems high to me. If it was a guaranteed engine, yeah, could be worth it, but as it is it's pretty much a crap shoot.

In my mind, I would have to think about it a bit to pay even $1K for an assembled old original engine because there is no way of knowing whether the block is even usable. There are just too many things that can ruin your plans with an "old motor" like that. If it was running and you could hear it and test compression, it would be different. Is my thinking way off?

Again, I haven't seen it yet but the gentleman who owns it should know what he is talking about. He knows Ford motors, but he said he just doesn't know what to ask for it. He asked me to make him an offer but I don't want to offend him.

Yeah, I know all about the aftermarket iron and aluminum blocks. Some are pretty good and some are junk and some are great, but to build one you're talking $15 - $20K depending on what parts you use. Even to rebuild a used sideoiler you will have $10 - $12K in it depending on whether or not you can do some of the work yourself. Considering the type of motor it is I would have it built at a reputible FE shop.

By the way, I do know what a 427 sideoiler looks like, as I run one in my Cobra. I really don't need the motor but if I could get it at a reasonable price it might be worth buying. As it is an unknown, it might be good only for parts in which case the value wouldn't be all that great anyway.

Thanks for you time, Bob

[spl310]

Not all of the big block engines got the big input shaft trannies. The 390s were delivered with a small input shaft with a short snout in many instances. I have one in my garage now...

[mrmustang]

Bob,

If you can buy that 427 sideoiler for $1,000 I'll give you $1,500 for it and you have now made youself a $500 profit. You don't even have to open it up.

[82ACAUTOCRAFT]

I think you have to do your homework and make sure it's a 427, check the numbers on the block, heads and intake. it must be cross bolted, it must have screw-in freeze plugs, it must have the side oil galleries. Also, it should not have ribs on the sides, if it is ribbed it has a service block (post 1970), also look for any visible defect like a crack around the freeze plugs, etc. All this checking should give you reasonable certitude that the motor is what it is supposed to be. As far as the condition, pull the plugs and see if it turns freely. A good 427 Sideoiler block alone will cost you 3 to 4K. I forgot, the patina is important: dirty, a bit oily, faded paint and bolts looking like they have not been messed with! The rest is a gamble, if the price is right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[82ACAUTOCRAFT]

It all depends on the price and the sum of the parts!

[sideoiler10]

I pretty much agree with you. I have the books for the casting numbers, etc. and am familiar with all the little indicaters of a true 427 sideoiler. I'll probably try to get up to check it out next week if he is really interested in selling. He told me he also has a 70 Torino GT with a 390 that he would sell. He says it runs great and has a very nice body on it.

Thanks again all for your input and comments. Bob

[clayfoushee]

Originally Posted by 82ACAUTOCRAFT

I think you have to do your homework and make sure it's a 427, check the numbers on the block, heads and intake. it must be cross bolted, it must have screw-in freeze plugs, it must have the side oil galleries. Also, it should not have ribs on the sides, if it is ribbed it has a service block (post 1970), also look for any visible defect like a crack around the freeze plugs, etc. All this checking should give you reasonable certitude that the motor is what it is supposed to be. As far as the condition, pull the plugs and see if it turns freely. A good 427 Sideoiler block alone will cost you 3 to 4K. I forgot, the patina is important: dirty, a bit oily, faded paint and bolts looking like they have not been messed with! The rest is a gamble, if the price is right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The variety of opinions on this subject is always amazing. There was a time around the FE FORUM not too long ago (3 years or so), that service blocks were considered by many to be desirable because of a higher nickel content in the later castings. You know, "continuous improvement" and all that.

I have no clue, and don't care what it's worth, but I do have a incredibly reliable service block SO.............

[Ibr8k4vetts]

Originally Posted by clayfoushee

The variety of opinions on this subject is always amazing. There was a time around the FE FORUM not too long ago (3 years or so), that service blocks were considered by many to be desirable because of a higher nickel content in the later castings. You know, "continuous improvement" and all that.

I have no clue, and don't care what it's worth, but I do have a incredibly reliable service block SO.............

If you go check the FE FORUM now, a higher nickel block seem to be a myth

[clayfoushee]

Originally Posted by Ibr8k4vetts

If you go check the FE FORUM now, a higher nickel block seem to be a myth

Right.........just wait, all those ties in your closet will come back into style.

[MaSnaka]

Now if I'm hearing this right...you don't need the block but if the price is right you want it. Want it to...possibly resell, rebuild or store in your garage until you think you might possibly need it? Trying to get something of great value for little or nothing is always a great risk which often backfires. I'm just not one to by something I don't need, oh wait I did by a cobra, nevermind!
Good luck, John

[82ACAUTOCRAFT]

Sideoiler10, I thought about something else, check the numbers on the toploader, specially the tail shaft and you will know if it came out of a 66 Fairlane. You will find a number chart on the David Kee website.
I have nothing against service blocks except for the fact that they seem to be more prone to defects like core shift, casting irregularities and porosity according to some engine builders.

[Excaliber]

I like the service blocks for one simple reason, you can run hydraulic or solid lifters. I'm running a service block in my ERA but I chose to stay with solid lifters anyway (it's nice to have a choice).

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

I like the service blocks for one simple reason, you can run hydraulic or solid lifters. I'm running a service block in my ERA but I chose to stay with solid lifters anyway (it's nice to have a choice).

I did the exact same thing, and for the exact same reasons. There's an ongoing debate on the FordFE forum on whether the ribs make a difference or not, but I tend to like them.