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11-03-2007, 12:40 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham #492/ 427/482 Keith Craft. Simple, Clean.
Posts: 114
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Not Ranked
Pond Aluminum ' Side-Oiler'
Guys,
Anyone have any experience withthe Pond 427/468 Aluminum side-oiler? I am finalizing my engine selection for a Kirkham and this engine has caught my eye. I will be using shelby add ons (intake, water pump, cover), etc. I am going for a miler version...500 hp urban drivable car..
Looking for real info...
Thanks
al
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11-03-2007, 05:51 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: West Bloomfield,
MI
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 717
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Not Ranked
If your building/having one built you should put a little extra machining money in the budget - the Pond requires finish sizing the main tunnel, the cam tunnel, and the lifter bores - along with the pond specific head and main studs.
Your power goal should be easy, and the rest of the build is pretty conventional.
__________________
Survival Motorsports
"I can do that....."
Engine Masters Challenge Entries
91 octane - single 4bbl - mufflers
2008 - 429 cid FE HR - 675HP
2007 - 429 cid FE MR - 659HP
2006 - 434 cid FE MR - 678HP
2005 - 505 cid FE MR - 752HP
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11-03-2007, 06:40 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: E BRUNSWICK N.J. USA,
Posts: 3,841
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Not Ranked
You have mail
alpace you have a P-M message Rick
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11-03-2007, 06:40 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Northwood,
NH
Cobra Make, Engine: Unique
Posts: 90
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Not Ranked
I'm running a Keith Craft / Pond 482 and I love it... I'm still getting use to the power 
I've got a little over 500 miles on it; send me a note and I can give you some details....
My numbers @ flywheel 613 HP / 613 lbs of tourque and certainly streetable/driveable..
Good Luck,
R |
11-03-2007, 06:59 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Fresno,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX 4766 (Vegas Built) with 482 Aluminum Pond motor
Posts: 814
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Not Ranked
I am also running a Pond 482 Aluminum block. Why are you spending the extra bucks on the Shelby water pump intake and cover when basically you are buying Edlebrock parts?
__________________
Morgan LeBlanc
Fresno CA
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11-03-2007, 10:04 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. Louis,
Mo.
Cobra Make, Engine: 427 S.O. Dual Quad / Cobra undecided
Posts: 1,380
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Not Ranked
Heres a pic of a fresh unmolested Pond block fresh out of the "bag", no machine work performed yet.
I'm with Morg on his observation, buy quality parts best suited for your needs unless name brand is important to you.
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11-03-2007, 11:24 PM
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Super Moderator
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Fresno,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: KMP 184/482ci Shelby
Posts: 14,445
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Not Ranked
There's a logical reason not to buy the Shelby cover or the pump, based upon personal experience.
You won't even see the name on the cover...it's covered by the pump.
To see the name on the pump, you'll have to stick your head into the fan...makes quite a mess.
You can clearly see the name on the manifold.
__________________
Jamo
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11-03-2007, 11:48 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Cobra Make, Engine: KMP 539, a Ton of Aluminum
Posts: 9,591
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Not Ranked
I apologize if I'm borrowing your thread, but Al, why a 468 (4.125 stroke)? Why not a 482 (4.25 stroke)? How about a 454 (3.98 stroke)? if I can't find a nice used side oiler block, I may build a Pond block down the road and I'm having hard time answering this question for myself.
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11-04-2007, 05:21 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Winchester, VA,
VA
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF 2369; Keith Craft 427FE Alum w/614hp. & 1999 Lotus Esprit V8, 375hp
Posts: 72
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Not Ranked
If you are going with a Pond Block I would definitely recommend Keith Craft and the 482 set up. Keith has made so many of these he has the process down pat. If somome is unfamiliar with the pond set up puts the engine together you could have oil pressure issues. Ask Keith for details. |
11-04-2007, 05:39 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Virginia Beach, Va & Port Charlotte, Fl.,
Posts: 2,284
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Iceberg
If you are going with a Pond Block I would definitely recommend Keith Craft and the 482 set up. Keith has made so many of these he has the process down pat. If somome is unfamiliar with the pond set up puts the engine together you could have oil pressure issues. Ask Keith for details. |
Keith Craft is definately the way to go. Top notch product and service. 
__________________
Too many toys?? never!
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11-04-2007, 06:08 AM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto, Canada,
Ont
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX 4995, Keith Craft built 427 SO
Posts: 1,168
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Not Ranked
Quote:
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Originally Posted by undy
Keith Craft is definately the way to go. Top notch product and service. |
I agree! Great people to work with and a great product!
__________________
"The 427 Cobra is easily the highest performance car ever sold for street use. A decent 427 - not the worst, not the best, will go from zero to 100 mph and back down again to zero in less than 14 seconds. All thing considered, you can put together a pretty good argument that the 427 Cobra is the ultimate performance car, judged on any basis you want to name." Taken from; Corvette, The Sensuous American 
Last edited by 427SnakeSC; 11-04-2007 at 06:16 AM..
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11-04-2007, 10:44 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham #492/ 427/482 Keith Craft. Simple, Clean.
Posts: 114
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Not Ranked
All, great photos and great info! Looks like everyone is pretty darn satisfied with the Pond. Jamo, terrific advice about the shelby parts. I am going to speak with Keith Craft tomorrow. Maybe I go with the shelby intake and valve covers, passing on the pump, etc.?
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11-04-2007, 10:47 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham #492/ 427/482 Keith Craft. Simple, Clean.
Posts: 114
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Not Ranked
Rod,
I am a bit of a novice when it comes to big blocks...so I am not the bes source. As to the Pond, I meant 482....Roush has a 468/shelby block. My personal history includes motocross (Yamaha Enduros) and rebuilding a '64 bug, MG, Spitfire, TR-4a and TR6....hence my interest in 'british' cars....If I go with the Kirkham, I am hoping to get British styling, American Horsepower and Polish aluminum craftsmanship....a bit of an international street fighter!
al
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11-04-2007, 11:19 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Tampa,
fl
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham #473 427 every option, Keithcraft aluminum FE 482 ci. Mass Flo FI. Tremec TKO 600.
Posts: 260
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Not Ranked
Ditto on KC 482 Pond
I to got the Keith Craft 482 Pond motor. Love it.
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11-05-2007, 07:04 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Chicago 'Burb,
Il
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF#1245 w/ 1966 427 SO
Posts: 1,167
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Not Ranked
What are the differences, pro's and con's, between the Pond alum block and the Shelby alum block? -Besides the obvious one of $price$.
But then again, if the Pond block needs all this extra machine work, is there a big difference in price in the end?
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11-05-2007, 07:12 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Millbrook,
NY
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 758 KC Pond 482
Posts: 391
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Not Ranked
Pond block weighs less, costs less, has period correct casting # for those states that require it for ease of registration. Downside is that it can only go up to 496 c.i. vs. 500+ for the Shelby, along with the Shelby name. I think the machining required of either one is about the same. The oiling system is different as well, but for street use, I don't think it really makes much difference.
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11-05-2007, 07:12 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Madera,
CA
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham 427sc
Posts: 70
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Not Ranked
I hope this doesn't swing things off topic... but where does the Genesis Aluminum block fit in?
I have heard of some porosity problems with some of their cast iron blocks, but the aluminum blocks are sleaved and shouldn't have a problem.
Are these a good option if you don't want to spend the money on the Shelby block?
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11-05-2007, 09:03 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Greenville,sc,
SC
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham 427 (KMP 266); CAV GT40
Posts: 1,464
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can you use hydraulic lifters in the Shelby? I assume the pond is solid.
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SPF Daytona coupe 055, Roush 427R
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11-05-2007, 09:06 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: cleveland,
OH
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX4000, 427
Posts: 1,999
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Not Ranked
Quote:
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Originally Posted by ENTDOC
can you use hydraulic lifters in the Shelby? I assume the pond is solid.
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You can in both.
__________________
"After jumping into an early lead, Miles pitted for no reason. He let the entire field go by before re-entering the race. The crowd was jumping up and down as he stunned the Chevrolet drivers by easily passing the entire field to finish second behind MacDonald's other team Cobra. The Corvette people were completely demoralized."
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11-05-2007, 09:10 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: cleveland,
OH
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX4000, 427
Posts: 1,999
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by xracerbob
Pond block weighs less, costs less, has period correct casting # for those states that require it for ease of registration.
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Not that much less. I think the shelby block has an old casting date as well.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by xracerbob
Downside is that it can only go up to 496 c.i. vs. 500+ for the Shelby, along with the Shelby name. .
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At those displacements, HP is limited by head flow, and I donlt think 20-30 ci will make that much difference.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by xracerbob
The oiling system is different as well, but for street use, I don't think it really makes much difference.
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Unless you throw a rod through the side of the block, like I did. Shelby block doesn't have gallery in skirt of block
__________________
"After jumping into an early lead, Miles pitted for no reason. He let the entire field go by before re-entering the race. The crowd was jumping up and down as he stunned the Chevrolet drivers by easily passing the entire field to finish second behind MacDonald's other team Cobra. The Corvette people were completely demoralized."
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