FE Experts needed possible rebuild 427 SO

[RICK LAKE]

Priobe You are making this easier. The motor is new with 500 miles. Nothing is seated yet. The piston rings are not worn in, the valve seat and valves are not broken in to seat. You didn't say what temp the motor is running at. The motor is tight to start. I don't agree with Pat on the oil pressure at idle. I just put a stroker kit in my Shelby block 482. I am using the same pump and oil on the new parts. The new bottom end is tight but I still have 30-35 psi at idle, 850 rpm and goes to 80 before 2,500 rpm. This is a HVHP pump from Mellings. Go to the FE forum and ask about the rod and main bearings there. Barry R, John V, or a couple of the others are involved with FE motor since the 60's. If your oil gauge is reading correct at idle IMO you will pound out the bottom end bearings. Call Barry R and ask what a custom set of pistons cost for the rods and crank you have. Tell him the cc on the heads. Get the compression up to 10 1/2 with the aluminium heads. Next look for a cam in the .600" lift. Look for a power range from 2,700rpm to 6,200rpm. A 112 LSA with a -2 cam retard after the cam is installed. Some cams come with a 4degree retard built into them. As for the idiot oil lights coming on at 4-10 psi, If you see this light the party is WAY OVER. What oil are you running and is there any additives? 600HP is not easy to hit, I am talking REAL NUMBERS with a streetable 427 motor. My 482 motor is new and I hope to get it on the dyno in April. On dynosim and Dyno 2000 I am looking at 510 HP and 580 torque at the crank not RWHP.My FI system may cost me about 8-10hp and 5-8ft of torque over a good carb. My cam is a 587-607 roller. great power from 2,500 to 6,000 rpm with a 6,500 rev limiter. The ford number for the nascar rod bearing is C9AX-6211E or F. You could try Rich Kirk or H&M for the correct bearings. I have heard they are very hard to fine. There are also questions about the nascar crank being crossdrilled and causing alot more oil pressure drop in the motor. I will catch you later Rick L.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

I don't agree with Pat on the oil pressure at idle...

That's what makes this forum fun.

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

Go to the FE forum and ask...

... and you might find this post on oil pressure at 332-428 Ford FE Engine Forum

The Ford shop manual 1970 (has Boss 02/429/428cj/scj/429cj/scj) great ref. materia ... correct psi is 25-60 lbs @2000rpm HOT...minimun psi is 6lbs at 400 rpm , lifter collapse, valve train noise. Bearing clearances of .0025/.003 will result in 10-15 lbs at hot idle, and 65lbs at 2000...

[Tony Ripepi]

Hmmmmm,

Good info here...my 427 SO (Shelby CSX 4xxx)runs at about 15-20 at idle and 50 anytime I push down on the loud pedal....almost 10k miles on the motor. I also had a 427 CO with a stroker crank and it was a joy on the road ---- I almost had to beat my brother out of the car with a sledge hammer once he drove it, he still holds it against me that I sold that car.

If you are set on a rebuild keep the compression ratio at 9.5 - 10.5 and put in a stroker crank.....build a torque engine that will be pleasure to drive on the street. If your goal is a high HP racing engine that loves 5500 RPM + take the directions listed above.

BTW pics in my gallery of both cars....the silver Unique is the 427 CO.

One mans opinion........

Tony R.

[priobe]

I guess with all information the oil pressure might not be that bad. AS for the leakdown test I guess its not a enough miles to make a decision.

As for the cam, well, I will wait to hear my the shop to see if they are ready to release the car back to me. I will wait to hear his final recommendation.

Either way I win. If the motor needs a rebuild then possible more power if it doesnt then strip it down and off to the paint shop

[RICK LAKE]

Patrickt Pat your know there is a big different between Nascar cranks and rods and 427SO or 428 cranks and rods. It is very possible that the guy who put his motor together used stock 427 bearings. They are NOT INTERCHANGABLE with when using a Nascar crank and rods. This info is from multi articles on FE builds. The bearing being used in most FE motors are 3/4 groove. Some are full groove on the mains. I just took these off my 452 motor. and with the stroker kit installed 3/4 grooved only after calling Barry R. who I got the kit from. He explained the change in design. The info you have for oil pressure doesn't include the Nascar motor. IMO if you want to run a heavy bottom end motor on 10-15 psi of oil thats your choise. If the bearings get spun on the bottom of this motor are you going to help repair it?Have you every seen bearings in a motor damaged from hi oil pressure? I am still waiting for the first set. Is high oil pressure hard on the gears of the cam and distributor, yes but there are some things to help the wear problem. I am a student of the FE. I have been a auto mechanic since 73. I am not a pro, but have seen enought motors and damage to know what works and what doesn't. Every magazine out has articles on oil now and how and why breakins either fail or work OK. Clearances on motors have changed too with the oil changes. I wish I had the money and place to do what Barry R. and Jay B. do. A dyno for motors and 1020 liquid head flow bench is all you need. I tell everyone about a peroiler for there $20K motors and how dry startup do 80% of the damage to any motor. I have a friend who is a hydraulics engineer. We talked for hours about how much pressure is needed to keep a rod floating and not letting metal contact metal. Do you know which cycle is hardest on a motor? I will tell you next time. 80% have thought wrong. I am one of them. Have a nice day Rick L.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

The info you have for oil pressure doesn't include the Nascar motor. IMO if you want to run a heavy bottom end motor on 10-15 psi of oil thats your choise.

The closest I can get in my old manuals to the Nascar engine is the R Code Specs below, 505HP, 13 to 1 Compression. Here it is (but I will concede that there is always the possibility that someone puts the wrong parts in). Note the oil pressure specs in the upper right hand corner.

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

Do you know which cycle is hardest on a motor?

Uhh, premenstrual?