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10-07-2009, 07:21 PM
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Senior Club Cobra Member
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Meriden,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427 SC s/n 718, 428 FE
Posts: 1,731
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Not Ranked
I didn't realize ERA is the only Cobra that has free open access to the oil pan. it just drops straight down with no interference. Nothing in the way. Worth the price of admission in itself.
__________________
"Paint It Black, Black As Night"
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10-07-2009, 07:25 PM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZOERA-SC7XX
I didn't realize ERA is the only Cobra that has free open access to the oil pan. it just drops straight down with no interference. Nothing in the way. Worth the price of admission in itself. |
Yep, here's a shot for the po' folk that spent their money on CSX, Kirkham, SPF, and like stuff....
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10-07-2009, 08:37 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZOERA-SC7XX
Here's my take. I don't think the one broken bolt is causing your leak. As I wrote the other day, I have the same Canton pan and it leaked down the side rails/flanges at rpm above 2000 or so. The flanges were not straight. After putting a straight edge (square) to it I saw the non-flat condition of the pan. The pan came like this from the factory. Just do some tweaking and hammer the holes down so the straight edge shows no more than .020 gap. Plug up the hole from the broken bolt with silicone. I've had broken pan bolts before without leakage. Pulling the engine for one broken bolt shouldn't be necessary.
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Pat's right. I just couldn't bring myself to do that, but I might be saner if I did. I will double check the flanges side-to-side as well as down the length of the pan (which is what I checked before) to be sure they are flat and if not adjust them.
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“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
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10-07-2009, 08:53 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
OK, here are some pics of the hole and it's location. Corner bolt, rear of the pan. I checked the hole again tonight and while the sides look pretty bad (from removing the broken extractor which I couldn't drill completely straight on), the "top" and "bottom" at least in this perspective should still have good thread as there is still a thin layer of the broken bolt against those threads.
My plan is to drill out this hole with a 1/4" bit which fits perfectly into the other pan bolt holes and then see what I have to work with. I still think there is an outside chance I can clean the threads up with a tap and use the Permatex solution to rebuild the damaged/missing threads. If not, then I already have a great pilot hole for the TimeSert.
I did order today a set of tap sockets (wish I knew these existed a week ago - TimeSert site suggested them) and a tap guide which should help a lot with keeping the tap plumb.
I will ultimately have to use a bit of extra silicon around this bolt hole to fill the small gaps that remain on the side of the bolt hole.
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-07-2009, 09:14 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Boise, Idaho,
ID
Cobra Make, Engine: Contemporary Classics 427 SC, 427 sideoiler
Posts: 54
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Not Ranked
Happily, the Contemporary has a clean shot at the pan also. It really reduces the PITA factor.
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10-07-2009, 10:08 PM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Driftwood,
TX
Cobra Make, Engine: Contemporary Cobra, 427 side oiler
Posts: 1,850
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Not Ranked
Doug it looks like you are making progress, though it couldn't have happened in a worse hole.
The Hurricane is free of any obstructions well, the pan can drop straight down.
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10-08-2009, 05:35 AM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
OK, I must be really dumb this morning, but in the picture below, what is the hex nut looking thing and what is the big crater just above and to the right of it?
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10-08-2009, 05:57 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Not sure about the hex nut. Some sort of plug? It is outside the pan rail. The "crater" is the bolt hole. The "cratered" piece of it is mostly near the surface and the hole is normal further down. It looks like it is really large and blown out in this photo, but you still can't stick a 1/4 bit down the center of it, so there is still some bolt left along the sides. So when drilled out, it should clean up reasonably well. As mentioned before, the damage on the sides came from getting the extractor out, but isn't that deep. The out-of-round pieces along the sides should fill reasonable well with either epoxy if I can do the Permatex solution or silicone if I end up with the TermSert.
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-08-2009, 07:34 AM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
That makes sense now. I was looking at that hex plug thinking that was the end of the bolt that had broken off and now you had magically partially drilled it out a bit in the shape of a hex pattern.  |
10-08-2009, 07:42 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 4,078
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmariachi
Doug it looks like you are making progress, though it couldn't have happened in a worse hole.
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X 2.
I feel more strongly after seeing it-either TimeSert it or oversize it and stud it as I said before. Either way, I'd rather not remove/install that fastener more than once.
Me-I'd stud it oversize.
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Chas.
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10-08-2009, 07:57 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt
That makes sense now. I was looking at that hex plug thinking that was the end of the bolt that had broken off and now you had magically partially drilled it out a bit in the shape of a hex pattern. |
More coffee before Club Cobra.....
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-08-2009, 07:59 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by ERA Chas
X 2.
I feel more strongly after seeing it-either TimeSert it or oversize it and stud it as I said before. Either way, I'd rather not remove/install that fastener more than once.
Me-I'd stud it oversize.
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I ordered a timesert kit and will likely end up that route unless the hole looks pretty good when I drill it out. I also ordered a tap guide and tap sockets which should allow me to get it plumb. Will be a fun weekend......but at least I should make some progress.
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-08-2009, 08:19 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 4,078
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Not Ranked
Good Doug.
Just be careful to not break through the boss on the inside of the block. They aren't really generous.
__________________
Chas.
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10-08-2009, 08:24 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by ERA Chas
Good Doug.
Just be careful to not break through the boss on the inside of the block. They aren't really generous.
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Good to know. I will wrap electrical tape around the bit so I know that I haven't gone too far.
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-08-2009, 08:35 AM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by ERA Chas
Good Doug.
Just be careful to not break through the boss on the inside of the block. They aren't really generous.
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Uhh, you know that if you do break the boss, it's a pretty big deal. Not like "windowing the block" or anything, but still a pretty big deal.  |
10-08-2009, 08:38 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt
Uhh, you know that if you do break the boss, it's a pretty big deal. Not like "windowing the block" or anything, but still a pretty big deal. |
That's what makes me a little nervous about the Timesert since it's a slightly oversize hole. On the drilling, I will be checking the depth measurements repeatedly plus taping off the bit at the right depth. Other suggestions?
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-08-2009, 08:41 AM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdoug
That's what makes me a little nervous about the Timesert since it's a slightly oversize hole. On the drilling, I will be checking the depth measurements repeatedly plus taping off the bit at the right depth. Other suggestions?
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The only other thing I could think of would be a portable drill guide. That would help you have a nice straight hole but I just don't know if you could use one of them down under there. This is what they look like, but I just don't think you could use it:
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10-08-2009, 08:56 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
I don't think i have room for that. I did get a hand guide for the tap and I was planning to use for the drill too. Not as good as above, but will fit in the space I have.
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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10-08-2009, 08:58 AM
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Half-Ass Member
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,005
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdoug
I don't think i have room for that. I did get a hand guide for the tap and I was planning to use for the drill too. Not as good as above, but will fit in the space I have.
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Then go for it. If you screw something up, we'll just use JB Weld on it and it'll be good as new. |
10-08-2009, 09:06 AM
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CC Member
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda,
MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt
Then go for it. If you screw something up, we'll just use JB Weld on it and it'll be good as new.
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Let's hope we don't have that conversation.
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
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