Anyone see this EBAY GT40 Replica Body?

[*13*]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...SS%3AUS%3A1123

[Three Peaks]

It doesn't look too bad, but where in the world would you get the parts to finish it? Glass, interior, chassis, headlight covers, door hinges, etc....

[*13*]

Good question. Would be a scratch build project, probably need a lot of research to source or have parts made. If I had the space.....It would be a fun project.

[Excaliber]

Parts might not be to bad. VW pan and engine, Corvair windshield, plexiglass for rear. Typical headlights up front, etc. etc. Or, Corvair engine mounted mid ship, but that would be a real hassle. VW was the "donor" car.

This is really "old school" stuff, in the days when kits were just barely kits and a LOT of fabricating was required.

[Ron61]

This is kind of strange. Two days ago I was talking to the guy who actually made the body for my Cobra for Emerson and he told me his son has picked up one of those GT-40s that was built on the Volkswagen set up and that it was in pretty good shape. He is going to finish restoring it.

Ron

[Got the Bug]

This is also a "no reserve" auction, so the body could sell for next to nothing.

[Gunner]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

This is really "old school" stuff, in the days when kits were just barely kits and a LOT of fabricating was required.

No, that's "ancient school" - I recall a couple of very funny Peter Egan columns about getting a wobbly uncut body and a pile of uncut steel stock called a kit. That's late 50s, early 60s.

"Old School" is late 60s to 80s, a "kit" was a crappy, badly-designed (think jr. high student drawing his dream car during History) or distorted (think fitting a Rolls onto an 84" wheelbase) body designed to bolt onto a Beetle chassis.

There was just nothing like spotting something cooler-looking (at first glance) than a Maserati... and having it go WAAAAAAA... WAAAAAA... WAAAAAAAAAAAAAA... away from the stoplight. (He was by then up to 35, BTW.) You could always follow the driver to a parking lot and see how many tries it took to get the door to close and latch behind him... or better, yet, watch him hammer and curse behind a jammed "lift top" or something else futuro-kewl.

Of course, in an era when a performance car meant lots of tape, paint and plastic bumps, and the Vette had a whopping 160HP, I guess these things were an improvement...

[charles roybal]

I think I remember this … kit was an "Avenger"...VW pan could use corviar motor.

[Gunner]

Originally Posted by charles roybal

I think I remember this … kit was an "Avenger"...VW pan could use corviar motor.

BINGO!

http://www.avenger-valkyrie.org/

These were soooo hot back in the day.

EDIT: I wonder if this is the last uncut Avenger body in existence?

[Bryan Anderson]

I am sure that B&B could help out with some of the parts, our car parts if they don't work straight out of the box would give you a real good start anyway, Ck out our car at www.bandbroadster.com

[BT SNAKE]

That is a T3 GT. It has very little deminsion similarity to the real GT. The headlight boxws are much longer and deeper than a real GT.

Here is a link to a photo of a finished one. I believe this company went out of business in 2002 or earlier. That is not a fiberfab avenger or any other early kit company. You would need the chasssis for that car or you will have to custom build it.
http://image.kitcarmag.com/f/1207430...rd_gt40+t3.jpg

Cheers,
Hersh

[Woodz428]

Nice guesses, but since I have 2 +, I think I can speak with a little authority. That is, as stated a Kellison GT40K. I have assembly manuals as well as headlight covers and other parts that are spares. It can set on a VW chassis, both of mine currently are, but they offered old school V8 to Corvair midengine chassis. I have one sold that will get a 1600 dual port engine from the other one. The second one I am building a lightweight aluminum chassis for and haven't decided on which motorcycle engine I will use, probably Valkyrie. The corvair shields are still available at $185, very cheap. If anyone here buys it, I can supply about any info or parts and what I can't I can direct you to.
It was based on the prototype MKII that had a long nose, and are very close to a GT40 with the main exception being the windshield and surrounding areas that blend into it( door and hood opening areas. Several companies used the molds, with revisions, one was T-3, I also believe that maybe L.A. Exotics also used it at one point. Neither made it any better looking, usually worse. Kellison was one of the larger 'glass companies in their period and were predominantly known for their front engine cars as well as dune buggies,boats and FV cars among a load of other stuff. The Stallion body was from the old Kellison molds, so their is a lot of history. check out www.priceofhistoys.com for info on it and about any kit car you could think of.

[Gunner]

Aren't these all pretty much iterations of the same thing - even more so than with Cobra bodies and molds, these bodies went from maker to maker for years, with little or no variation except in the finish details. Some, IIRC, had five or six major names and instances, few of which turned out more than a few dozen copies. Kits have always been a flaky and unstable business and one guy who had the skill to turn out a good mold was often the g'g'g'grandfather of a whole dynasty of identical-but-different kits.

You can call the one on eBay anything you like, but I don't see any notable variation from the Avenger - which is the one of this series that I recall best.

[Woodz428]

Originally Posted by Gunner

Aren't these all pretty much iterations of the same thing - even more so than with Cobra bodies and molds, these bodies went from maker to maker for years, with little or no variation except in the finish details. Some, IIRC, had five or six major names and instances, few of which turned out more than a few dozen copies. Kits have always been a flaky and unstable business and one guy who had the skill to turn out a good mold was often the g'g'g'grandfather of a whole dynasty of identical-but-different kits.

You can call the one on eBay anything you like, but I don't see any notable variation from the Avenger - which is the one of this series that I recall best.

Actually IT IS COMPLETELY different than an Avenger. The Avenger was a Fiberfab car ansd was kind of bizarre in relationship to it's lines. The headlights were slanted the rear fender line went up and back at and extreme line. 2 completely different cars, nothing alike with the exception that they were both based on VW chassis and had V8 chassis options. The Avenger doesn't have the doors cut into the roof and used '65-'66 Mustang glass, which is very different than the Corvair glass. Even a two second look at the 2 would, to any discerning eye, easily illustrate the difference. If you check out the link I posted and go to the Avenger and the GT40K the differences are night and day. Kind of like comparing a Triumph to an MG, they are both front engined british cars, but that's about the only connection( that and the crappy british electrics).
Kellison splashed this and made the molds, and they have made the rounds, T-3,L.A. Exotics as well as others...I think the most recent may have been the Melson GT. The windshield line and front edge of the door and hood are the giveaways. Some tweaking has been done by various companies, but they never eliminated that telltale design weakness. Kellison was the first and, until a few decades later, the only one that used this particular body/mold. There was a really nice kit built in the mid 60s, which I have yet to see in person or track down, that was called the Sebring GT, I think the company was called Perfection(have to get out me '67 Car & Driver ad) Plastics. Never saw one then and haven't seen any for sale used. Not sure if they built any other than the one in the ad( so there is one somewhere).
A side note, Jim Kellison was also the main archetect of the Kelmark GT, which many may be familiar with ( sort of Dino looking). The Kel part of the name, of course, was Kellison.
Since I fell in love with the Kellison in high school and thought the Avenger a little grotesque, I can't even see how the two could be confused for one another. The V8 Avenger was called the Valkyrie and it is being reproduced again...still grotesque. The GT40K has all the main GT40 styling ques such as the doors into the roof, pontoons below the door. The Avenger has neither of those or any other ones, with the single exception of the side scoops.

[Woodz428]

Here's a link to an Avenger http://jalopnik.com/5380877/fiberfab...n-the-junkyard
compare it to the e-bay ad and if you can't see the difference I'd suggest a new prescription.

Don't let the last 25 years of kit car industry dictate your perception of the early kit cars. They were difficult to build for some, but most car guys built their own race cars then and had skills far beyond what is typical today. Kellison as well as the original Fiberfab were pretty long standing companies. Kellison made bodies from not long after he was a Korean war fighter pilot. It lasted until he sold the company in the late 60's/early 70s. Almost 20 years is hardly a fly by night operation. He even won a lawsuit that Bruce meyers( Meyers Manx) because he made dune buggy bodies in the same vein. Jim said that Bruce would have been better off buying more chopper guns instead of lining some lawyers pocket.
If the shipping from Ca. wasn't so much( I just had one shipped from there) I'd buy it to add to the herd.

[lovehamr]

For the Avenger I always thought that they were going for a GT40 Mk III look with that headlight treatment.

Steve

[Woodz428]

Originally Posted by lovehamr

For the Avenger I always thought that they were going for a GT40 Mk III look with that headlight treatment.

Steve

If you use the broadest terms. They used 4 headlights that were slanted somewhat. Once you get outside of the headlight bucket, you've entered the twilight zone.
I'd have to look at some of the MKIII pics, but I recall they used a set of smaller lights on the inner pair. The tail of the MKIII is more similar to the Kellison, a little longer than the MKI and II. Overall the Kellison is virtually a copy, whereas the Avenger was more of a "feel". That is comparing the 2 cars, I don't consider the Kellison a copy by any means.
Much like Cobras are always mis-identified that's the case with an Avenger, anyone that knows GT40s would never confuse the 2. The Kellison from certain angles may easily be confused with a GT40, but from other angles...no way.

[Excaliber]

Remember, "back in the day" ROUND headlights were the only legal way. Square ones and other "oddities" had not yet been DOT approved!

[*13*]

is this a match? it showed op on ebay this morning
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...SS%3AUS%3A1123

[Woodz428]

Originally Posted by *13*

is this a match? it showed op on ebay this morning
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...SS%3AUS%3A1123

That has been on and off e-bay a couple times as the guy tries to hawk it. I read the ad originally, but not from the link here. I believe that is a cut down Fiero chassis, currently they use them in some of the Ferrari and Lambo kits. It would take a LOT to get a Kellison or even an Avenger on that thing. I didn't see the bidding or price when I opened the link, but I thought that he was asking waaaaay too much when I saw it a few weeks ago.