MSD Rotor phasing

Tom Kirkham · #1 (**permalink**) 09-28-2009, 03:50 PM

Well with all the problems with phasing distributors, I thought I would take some pictures on how to make a tool and phase your rotor in your distributor. You will need an old distributor cap and a timing light.

The first step is to modify the distributor cap. The V shaped notch on the top is to check and make sure that the top of the rotor is contacting the terminal inside the cap.

I cut two large windows so I could better see what is going on.

Next I marked the rotor with a Sharpie.

Putting everything back together

In this picture I hooked up the timing light to the post I wanted to illuminate. This picture was taken with the engine running and with the timing light hooked up. Note that the mark is lined up with the post. This is what you want.

Hope this helps.

sllib · #2 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 06:42 AM

Thanks, Tom. This is something I've been meaning to do. For those of us who DON'T have a box of old MSD caps laying around, will the cheap parts store caps do as well for chopping up?
Bill Stradtner

Jerry Clayton · #3 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 07:05 AM

there used to be a clear cap available---I used one on my pro stocker--don't remember who made it

vector1 · #4 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 07:42 AM

drill a hole next to #1 terminal on top between button and terminal, white nail polish on top of bug pointer and use a timing light as described above works well. then you can plug the hole when done or leave open and use as vent system.

Rick Parker · #5 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 08:30 AM

MSD has also suggested doing as Vector 1 suggested. View from above. Use a sacraficial cap or one that s being replaced. MSD markets a Rotor with an adjustable tip that fits several applications including the small diameter billet distributors that are popular with several of our engines. #84211. Originally designed to remidy issues associated with EFI, it can be used with carbureter application if needed.

http://www.msdignition.com/product.a...69&terms=84211

cobred · #6 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 09:32 AM

What is the reason for doing this, Im not sure I understand.

scottj · #7 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cobred

What is the reason for doing this, Im not sure I understand.

For a carburated application, using a crank trigger, rotor phasing is adjusted by rotating the distributor and this would be the method to verify that adjustment. If you are using the magnetic pickup in the distributor then this method verifys that MSD built the distributor correctly.

Argess · #8 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 09:46 AM

The closer the rotor points to the correct dist cap terminal, the less chance of going to the wrong terminal (crossfire) and the shorter spark means potentially more energy to the plugs.

He is getting it bang on because he can. No mech advance inside the dist. With an advance mechanism, the rotor has a range of movement around the respective terminal.

Large rotor caps have reduced the need for this to some extent (for the crossfire problem), but it's still a good idea.

Did I get that right?

Rick Parker · #9 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 09:51 AM

It is a means on verifying and correcting as necessary the rotor position so it is lined up with the conductor post in the distributor cap when the coil discharges.

Tom: Don't send it back to MSD for a warranty claim.............

Got the Bug · #10 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 11:18 AM

If the phasing is off, what action do you take?

patrickt · #11 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got the Bug

If the phasing is off, what action do you take?

This is the little flier that comes with the MSD distributor.

Eljaro · #12 (**permalink**) 10-04-2009, 03:20 PM

The phasing on my distributor was off, not by much but enough to give me hesitation on full advance. I did loosen up the magnetic pickup and moved it as much as the holes allowed in the most advanced position ( it was firing well past the terminal) and it was enough. Now the rotor lines up perfectly and the hesitation and misfiring is gone.
My MSD distributor out of the box was NOT phased correctly. I never checked the phasing because MSD claims that it is factory set correctly and I believed such an apparently serious company.
I wasted a lot of time and bought a new 6AL box, a new mag pickup, a new cap, new springs, new weights and made myself several cables connecting the 6Al to the distributor, shielded and twisted and you name it.
In the end upon seeing this thread I modified a distributor cap and saw that the phasing was off. My problem is solved, but some money and time was wasted

:mad :

Argess · #13 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 11:44 AM

you can buy adjustable rotor buttons

RodKnock · #14 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 04:11 PM

Here's a dumb question. How does one know if he or she has a "crank trigger" system? I'm running a 8594 MSD Billet distributor and a MSD Digital 6 ignition, but now I'm curious, and would like to check my rotor phasing and I know that "crank trigger" systems are treated differently according to the MSD instructions.

patrickt · #15 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Here's a dumb question. How does one know if he or she has a "crank trigger" system? I'm running a 8594 MSD Billet distributor and a MSD Digital 6 ignition, but now I'm curious, and would like to check my rotor phasing and I know that "crank trigger" systems are treated differently according to the MSD instructions.

That's not a dumb question at all. The violet/green wires from your MSD box will run to either your distributor or a crank trigger. If the little wires that come out of your distributor run to nothing (the plug is not hooked up to anything) then you have a crank trigger. If they run to your MSD box then you have regular magnetic pickup. The overwhelming odds are that you do not have a crank trigger.

patrickt · #16 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 04:33 PM

See the two wires coming down out of that black spirally looking thing on the base of the distributor? That's your magnetic pickup. That will lead to the violet/green wires in your MSD box. If those wires are not hooked up to anything, then you have a crank trigger. I'm almost positive though that you don't.

Rick Parker · #17 (**permalink**) 10-09-2009, 07:58 PM

This is a Crank Trigger, absolutely dead nuts accurate. It does not provide for any advancing of the ignition timing based upon RPM. It fires at the same instant each time. To change when it fires with relation to crank rotation the "Pickup" is moved in a slot on its mount to a slightly different location around the perimeter of the Trigger Wheel (just a few degrees).

http://www.msdignition.com/info.aspx...=32&taxid2=447

FatBoy · #18 (**permalink**) 01-23-2010, 08:06 AM

I've been plagued with a misfire since first getting the car on the road nearly two years ago and I've just got round to checking the phasing. I was putting it off because it meant butchering a distributor cap. But now, having checked it, I can see that the spark is firing way past the terminal post.
I'm irritated that MSD have apparently assembled the distributor wrongly, but I'm also pleased that I have found the cause of the misfire at long last.
I suppose I now need to order one of their adjustable rotors.
They should really supply these free of charge given that it is needed to rectify their error.

I marked the position of the distributor before pulling it out, but forgot to note the position of the rotor.

Eljaro · #19 (**permalink**) 01-23-2010, 03:51 PM

You can not imagine how many times I removed the Webers and the jets and the MSD box and the cables and the alternator and I do not want to go on.
In the end it was that damn rotor in the MSD distributor not being aligned correctly.
Misses at max advance and at cruising speed for several months until I did the cut-up-the-cap thing and found that the phasing was wrong.
The problem is that when they fit the gear at the factory it can be just a matter of a few degrees wrongly pinned to the shaft and the phasing is off. So they should just supply an adjustable rotor if they can't do it precisely.
The same thing applies when you change the gear. Depending the location you are disturbing the phasing in relation to the reluctor.
I had to replace the iron gear for a steel gear because I have a hyd roller cam and that also has made the phasing to be off. So if you start playing with those things an adjustable rotor is probably a must.

Got the Bug · #20 (**permalink**) 10-08-2009, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Here's a dumb question. How does one know if he or she has a "crank trigger" system? I'm running a 8594 MSD Billet distributor and a MSD Digital 6 ignition, but now I'm curious, and would like to check my rotor phasing and I know that "crank trigger" systems are treated differently according to the MSD instructions.

The other question is, if you're not experiencing any symptoms whatsoever, how much are you really going to gain by checking the phasing. Seems like a lot of tweaking for a small or no payoff.