I can't stand Ma. As my car nears completion I now facing the real possibility I may

[mtml427]

Geez, you sure are going through a lot of grief. Do you have a friend or relative in another state that you could gift it to and trust them to gift it back to you?
Better yet, what about showing your residency with that same relative (perhaps even a rental agreement for some low amount of rent i.e. 1 dollar/mo.). It seems that you would be justified in having a car at the property you are renting and not have to surrender primary residency in your home state.

[RodKnock]

Circumventing the law is not the way you should go. Always having to look over your shoulder is not exactly good for the conscious.

IMHO, I would try to register as is, if that's possible, or extricate the engine and tranny for an engine/tranny that will pass, or sell it as a last resort. All the other options (e.g., setting up a corporation/LLC in another State) is: a) expensive and b) is borderline legal/illegal.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

... b) is borderline legal/illegal.

The law is but a seamless web, with each square its own delightful shade of gray....

[RodKnock]

It's one thing to throw your plastic bottle into the trash instead of the recycle bin, but quite another to register your $90,000 Kirkham within the "prism of grey."

Having said that, there's a city out here that has proposed analyzing people's trash each week to make sure its citizens are correctly recycling every item that they should.

[RedBarchetta]

Originally Posted by patrickt

The law is but a seamless web, with each square its own delightful shade of gray....

Playing with the law can sometimes be a little like playing with Harry Callahan.

"I know what you're thinking. "Did he fire six shots or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?"

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

... or extricate the engine and tranny for an engine/tranny that will pass,

Engine switching is not without peril. In fact, some might say that the ol' engine switcheroo trick has a greater risk that that of a carefully titled out-of-state solution. See: http://www.epa.gov/compliance/resour.../engswitch.pdf

[RodKnock]

No trick. Sell the 482 and just buy a properly dated sideoiler. Easy, see?

Although I'm not a huge fan of cast iron blocks and heads on the front end of my Cobra, if I lived in MA and was faced with this decision, then I'd learn to live with it.

[Don]

Have an understanding of your predicament as when I attempted to register a pre-owned Cobra from out of state, that was legally registered, did not have the correct paperwork on the engine etc. While it was a tedious experience, in the end , everything was handled exactly according to the law and obtained the registration w/o any future concerns.

Not knowing the MA regulation, if the option selected is another engine, CT follows the Federal regulations in that only pre-1966 ( 1965 and earlier ) engines and factory heads did not have any Emission regulations and hardware. The Bill of Sale had to be very specific as to the engine codes, year etc and the sellers info, if a business , on their letterhead is a plus. I know of one individual that had the actual VIN tag from the vehicle the engine was obtained from.

[ZOERA-SC7XX]

Just one legal option to consider. If you shop for an dated engine & trans combo that comes with paperwork, that will satisfy all your state laws. Much of the enjoyment of these cars come from overcoming obstacles. Wish you luck.

[JoeT]

Originally Posted by ng8264723

The thing that doesn't make any sense is I could have bought a used Cobra and brought it here to ma and not had any difficulties.
Chris

Actually not true. That's what I did and they changed my Florida 1965 ford title to a Mass 2005 title, and as such am unable to pass the MAC center with a crate engine (with an '84 block)

It pisses me off everytime I walk into the garage and see the car on the lift that I am unable to legally drive. . .It would piss me off even more if it was a $90k + car that i couldn't drive.

I'm actually at the point now that if SEMA doesn't pass this year, I'll buy a beater '60s car for the title (motor/trans) and drop it in 'till it blows.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by ng8264723

Basically, every idea thus far has been shot down except starting a corpoartion somewhere. It seems the gods are against me

When I was at the Barrett Jackson auction in January this place had a postcard on the lunch tables... Create a Montana LLC and register your car/boat/plane there. As is true most of the time, things that are too good to be true probably are, but I'll post it here as a public service

http://www.mtvehicles.com/

[kgs365]

hmm


http://www.mass.gov/legis/bills/hous...df/ht04557.pdf

[patrickt]

You can track it here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/186history/h04557.htm But hasn't the SEMA bill made it to the Gov. before only to have him refuse to sign it? Or am I thinking of a different state.

[Excaliber]

Titling it in someone else's name, in another state. is not circumventing the law, it's playing by the rules. I wouldn't have a problem with it ethically or morally. Mass has their laws, good or bad, they are what they are, for now. So, until that changes the solution seems rather simple. A "used car" back to Mass. Now California has addressed to some degree this "rule" by disallowing a "used" car with less than 7,500 miles on it. OK, thats a reasonable solution, it's their law, gotta play by their rules. So what's the problem with this solution in Mass? There does not seem to be a mileage limitation, nor a time limitation. Could be done in two days! Or even ONE day for that matter, depending on how long the paper work takes, if it has to be mailed, etc.

[Don]

Titling it in someone else's name, in another state. is not circumventing the law, it's playing by the rules.

Might not be when included in the intent is the avoidance of paying the local property tax, i.e., location where the vehicle is principally garaged. One of the reasons, from a tax revenue viewpoint, where states require the registration to be transferred to the new residence state within, as an example, 60 days.

[Excaliber]

If "60 days" or "7500 miles" is in the rule book, you GOTTA play by the rules. If not, one day, done, pay all applicable taxes.

In MOST cases it is not the INTENT of the law, it is how the law is actually written. If it's written poorly, good or bad, there is a method to correct it in good time by changing or amending the law. Until then, the rules are the rules!

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

If "60 days" or "7500 miles" is in the rule book, you GOTTA play by the rules. If not, one day, done, pay all applicable taxes.

But are taxes due if they have refused to title your car?

[JoeT]

looks like it's almost over. . . I copied this from FFCobra.com


Here's the text of what we believe will be the final version of the bill when it gets out of Ways and Means:

AN ACT RELATIVE TO THE REGISTRATION AND INSPECTION
OF STREET RODS AND CUSTOM VEHICLES.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives in General Court assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:

SECTION 1. Chapter 90 of the General Laws, as appearing in the 2008 Official Edition, is hereby amended by inserting, after section 2G, the following section:-

Section 2H. (a) Notwithstanding any general or special law, rule or regulation to the contrary, the issuance of certificates of registration and number plates for street rods, Replicas, specially constructed and custom vehicles shall be in accordance with this section.

(b) For purposes of this section, and sections 7DD and 33 of this chapter, the following words shall have the following meanings:

“Custom Vehicle,” a motor vehicle for which the year of manufacture is after 1948 and for which the model year is at least 25 years old and which has been altered from the manufacturers original design, or has a body constructed from non-original materials.

“Replica Vehicle," a motor vehicle constructed or assembled by a non-manufacturer from new or used parts that when assembled Replicates an earlier year, make and model vehicle.

“Specially Constructed Vehicle,” a motor vehicle reconstructed or assembled by a non-manufacturer from new or used parts that has an exterior that does not Replicate or resemble any other manufactured vehicle.

“Street Rod,” a motor vehicle for which the year of manufacture is prior to 1949, and which has been altered from the manufacturer’s original design, or has a body constructed from non-original materials.

(c) Replica Vehicles shall be titled as the year, make, and model of the vehicle intended to be replicated. A label of "Replica" shall be applied to the title and registration card. The model year of a custom vehicle and street rod vehicle shall continue to be recognized as the manufacturer's assigned model year. The manufacturer's name shall continue to be used as the make with a label of "Street Rod" or “Custom Vehicle” applied to the title and registration card. Specially Constructed vehicles shall be titled and registered showing the make as "Specially Constructed," and the year the vehicle was built shall be the vehicle model year.

SECTION 2. Section 142M of chapter 111 of the General Laws, as appearing in the 2008 Official Edition, is hereby amended by adding after the last sentence ending on line 137, the following new paragraph:--

Street rods and custom vehicles registered pursuant to this section shall be exempt from section 142M of chapter 111 or the rules and regulations made pursuant thereto. Specially constructed vehicles and replica vehicles, as defined in section 2H of chapter 90, which are registered on or prior to June 30, 2011 shall receive an emissions waiver certificate. Specially constructed vehicles and replica vehicles, as so defined, registered after June 30, 2011 shall be subject to emission control requirements based on the model year and configuration of the engine installed in the specially constructed or replica vehicle, whether the engine is an original equipment manufacturer’s (OEM) production engine, rebuilt engine or crate engine.

i. Regulations for replica or specially constructed vehicle emissions compliance may establish maximum limits on the annual number of vehicle miles traveled by these vehicles, provided that in no case shall said limit be less than 3,000 miles per year;

ii. If the model year of the engine installed in the specially constructed or replica vehicle requires an onboard diagnostic system, the vehicle shall be subject to an onboard diagnostic system emissions test applicable to the certified configuration, including any exclusions or exemptions otherwise granted to that certified configuration.


SECTION 3. Section 33 of chapter 90 of the General Laws, as so appearing, is hereby amended by adding the following paragraph:
(37) For the registration of every Street Rod, Replica Vehicle, Specially Constructed Vehicle or Custom Vehicle, as defined in section 2H of this chapter.

SECTION 4. A fee may be charged for the services provided under this act.


Please make a note of the legislators who helped us with the bill language and with our relations with DEP and RMV:

Rep. Carolyn Dykema
Rep. Brian Dempsey
Rep. Joseph Wagner
Rep. Linda Dean Campbell
Rep. Bill Bowles
Senator Stephen Baddour

Wagner and Baddour got this bill out of their Joint Transportation Committee THREE times for us.

Brian Dempsey filed the bill twice for us.

Linda Campbell and Bill Bowles have been on our side since day one and lobbied their fellow legislators for us.

Carolyn Dykema was instrumental in identifying the problems with RMV and DEP and helping us iron them out. She set up and attended several meetings with relevant regulatory personnel.

We also got quite a bit of support from MAAC (Massachusetts Association of Automobile Clubs). They have several members that are well versed in all of the laws that affect us and our hobby. We should all be a member of a MAAC club.

Dave Smith attended every statehouse meeting we had, and sometimes had only 1 or 2 hours notice.


Read the bill, but lets keep the comments low-key for now. Once the bill is out of Ways and Means, we'll start the phone calls to Beacon Hill.


Rep. Dykema is looking forward to a signing ceremony in October. I told her we'd have a fair number of cars there for the occasion. Who's up for burnouts in front of the statehouse?
__________________

[ng8264723]

Don't believe it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ng8264723]

Well here an update. I'm thinking of selling the car to my parents. If they own it they can register it and insure it in florida. Either that or I can wait to October. Selling it is still an option. I could buy another that has a title from another state....................