Vote 428 or aluminum 427FE??

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Like most, if not all, I'm time challenged. Also, the car has been mostly problem-free (knock on wood). I had an electrical issue sorted out a few months back by a professional, since wiring and me do not get along together.

Was that why you dumped your MSD Distributor?

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Was that why you dumped your MSD Distributor?

That was my other problem. However, I don't want to muddy this thread and raise/get the ire of Jamo or Ron.

[Ronbo]

The numbers I was quoting were from listings I have of Ford crate engines (which is essentially what Shelby was buying) available during the 60's.

There is truth to what Ernie says about the the numbers being "conservative" all engine mfg's will quote a "minimum base line HP rating", in some cases it was real conservative like GM's rating on the L88 427 (rated 430HP @ 5800RPM but failed to mention that it red lined at 6500RPM and would produce in excess of 525HP).

The 426 Hemi, and Boss 429 were very conservatively rated at 425HP.

However at that time high compression (and good gas) was needed to produce these numbers. Still remember laughing at the sticker in my old Pontiac that read: "Your new GM vehicle only requires fuel with a minimum 91 octane rating, so it will run fine on regular gas."

The engine builders today easily produce 600+HP with 10.5:1 compression as long as they don't use any vintage components

[elmariachi]

Originally Posted by Ronbo

The numbers I was quoting were from listings I have of Ford crate engines (which is essentially what Shelby was buying) available during the 60's.

So let's run this to ground. Shelby bought 427's off of the Galaxie line for his CSX cars. Those would have been the 410HP 4V or 425HP 8V variety. I would like to hear how he got those engines to 480HP. Have any of the MR heads on CSX 427s that have been pulled later in life shown signs of being heavily worked? Did he re-cam them? Compression bump? What else?

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by elmariachi

So let's run this to ground. Shelby bought 427's off of the Galaxie line for his CSX cars. Those would have been the 410HP 4V or 425HP 8V variety. I would like to hear how he got those engines to 480HP. Have any of the MR heads on CSX 427s that have been pulled later in life shown signs of being heavily worked? Did he re-cam them? What else?

FWIW, my copy of Bil Carroll's Fooorrd Performance Guide lists the specs of perhaps half a dozen of the different Shelby 427 engines, some with horsepower numbers over 500. Aluminum heads, compression ratios, all were different. I can scan and post those pages for you this evening, if you would like.

[patrickt]

Uhhh, I just happened to have this one handy.

[patrickt]

... and btw, that "K" camshaft that is listed in the specs. That's my cam. Yeah, baby.

[dcdoug]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Uhhh, I just happened to have this one handy.

This has the alloy heads, so would be a comp car, no? Didn't only the comp cars have alloy heads?

[elmariachi]

Originally Posted by patrickt

FWIW, my copy of Bil Carroll's Fooorrd Performance Guide lists the specs of perhaps half a dozen of the different Shelby 427 engines, some with horsepower numbers over 500. Aluminum heads, compression ratios, all were different. I can scan and post those pages for you this evening, if you would like.

Nope, I've got the book and know it well. I guess this was in part my earlier point. A stock Ford Galaxie side oiler was not a 500HP engine, not even close. Only with aluminum heads, 2x4 carbs, higher compression and your coveted camshaft could Shelby get 505HP. Now of course someone will come along here shortly and say that 505 was really 600.

So, if I Doug or I want a solid 500 HP on a legitimate dyno we need at LEAST stage 2 heads and possibly a compression bump.

[RodKnock]

I think Ernie's sideoiler made 667 HP with open headers, 12.5 CR and not one modern component or so he claims.

Now, the Hawaiian dyno operator, may have been similtaneously waxing his surfboard while talking to cute bikini-clad Hula chick and eating his mixed plate lunch, after previously smoking some of those funny cigarettes or something, as he was dyno'ing Ernie's engine, but no matter.

Just kidding Ernie. No diatribes necessary.

I know you engine builders out there sneak a few tricks in there to add HP and claiim it's stock. Just ask the folks who race in the F.A.S.T. class for musclecars.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by elmariachi

So, if I Doug or I want a solid 500 HP on a legitimate dyno we need at LEAST stage 2 heads and possibly a compression bump.

I'm running 10.6 to 1 compression, aluminum Edelbrocks with just a smidge of port matching, 20 extra cubic inches over the 427, the 245/245 .525 114 LSA old school "K" cam, new school Erson roller rockers, a simpleton Holley 4160 and I'm probably right around 500 with no sidepipes and no belts -- and that translates to an honest 450 horsepower with everything hooked up.

[601HP]

Earlier today I found an avatar that depicted a man with a long stick. The man was continually beating a dead horse.

I couldn't insert that avatar into a REPLY for this thread because the file was too large.

David