Hydraulic t/o bearings-

PatBuckley · #1 (**permalink**) 12-30-2003, 09:55 PM

How many Kirkham owners are using a hydraulic throw out bearing?

How did you fabricate the clutch pedal stop?

Tom Kirkham · #2 (**permalink**) 12-30-2003, 10:27 PM

Pat,

David and I are using a hydraulic throw out bearing. In our cars a .700 master cylinder does not have enough capacity to overextend the clutch. However to put in a stop would be fairly easy to do. My sugestion would be to due something similar to the bell stops on your brake master cylinders. To make it adjustable you could even thread it.

Call me if you have any questions.

ToyCollector · #3 (**permalink**) 12-30-2003, 10:34 PM

I know, I know what you are thinking,

But I am going to ask anyway. I am currently running a slave set up. I am now comfortable with saying I am expert (at tranny removal and change out of tranny (for those in the know, you know wherefrom I speak)), how tough is it to go from a slave setup to a hydraulic throw out? Can bellhousing be removed in car?

Tom Kirkham · #4 (**permalink**) 12-30-2003, 10:40 PM

Yes, the bellhousing can be removed while leaving the engine in the car. May I ask why?

PatBuckley · #5 (**permalink**) 12-30-2003, 10:51 PM

Thanks for the quick response Tom.

I actually posted this question in case someone else was having a problem with the location/fabrication of a pedal stop because I came up with apparently the same solution as you have - I removed the bottom clutch master bolt and replaced it with a threaded rod that goes to the clutch pedal.

I was going to be a hero. Darn!

Do you guys have a list of things like this that you can give your customers so we don't have to come up with brilliant ideas like this on our own?

TC- the bellhousing can be removed with the transmission installed - you just have to kind of squirm it out of there.

Why? Did you find that space for the external slave was at a premium?

ToyCollector · #6 (**permalink**) 12-30-2003, 11:05 PM

Pat,,, I'm fine, just my knuckle skin could use a break

Bud Man · #7 (**permalink**) 12-31-2003, 06:57 AM

I have been running a McLeod hydraulic T/O for about a year now in #142 without any problems.

Like anything else when fabricating these cars, the key is proper set up. Because I used a Wedge Engineering Cobra bell as original, a diaphragm pressure plate could not be used. Had to be very careful to properly calibrate the three finger pressure plate assembly, and then make sure McLeod had all of the proper information they needed to fab the T/O. Lots of thought given to keeping the lines out of harm's way, also. Clutch feel is fantastic, and I have not had the necessity to install a pedal stop. Very pleased.

The nice thing about my particular car is that the trans mount crossmember will detach, making removal of the trans from the bottom of the car fairly easy.

Bud

decooney · #8 (**permalink**) 12-31-2003, 11:54 AM

Hi Tom,
Are you using diaphram or 3-finger pressure plates or both types in the cars you build?

If using diaphram type, have you ran into any problems with these and/or setup problems on the hyd t/o side?

I ran a 3-finger pressure plate setup with no problems, and then tried a few diaphram pressure plates that did not work out as well for me; so I ended up changing back to the old school setup as a result. Should have just left my 3-finger in there to begin with and would have not experienced issues...

weekendwarrior · #9 (**permalink**) 12-31-2003, 01:17 PM

Pat,

What brand of bearing did you go with. TC you and I are the lone rangers, hope I don't have to do a redo

Gary

PatBuckley · #10 (**permalink**) 12-31-2003, 01:21 PM

Gary -

I went with the MCloed unit. So far so good but then again I haven't started it up yet! The thing should be running by the end of the day tomorrow though...

Pat

decooney · #11 (**permalink**) 12-31-2003, 01:48 PM

Hey Pat,
I ran the McLeod diaphram pressure plate, with the Tilton hydraulic T/O and a Lakewood bellhousing in my last car. Formerly used a RAM hydraulic too. I don't think I ever really got it set up quite right with the diaphram pressure plate - after multiple tries. At first it worked really well...then over time as the pressure plate and clutch disc started to wear in, I needed to re-adjust the gap/clearance setting pushing the T/O bearnig on the trans input collar closer to the pressure plate each time. Eventually, the T/O bearing had to expand so far to disengage the clutch that it would allow the Tilton seal to pop out. i.e. overdriven. I only tried the RAM and Tilton T/O bearing setups though.

Anyhow, I wished I would have just went back to the 3-finger style pressure plate for the hyd. T/O setup (requires much less travel to disengage like .050 I believe). When it was working, I liked how the hydraulic TO setup functioned, very much - smooth and positive action.

Let me know how it goes and if you decided on a diaphram or 3-finger setup. I hope to learn where I went wrong from your guys experiences with it. Thanks.

steve meltzer · #12 (**permalink**) 01-13-2004, 04:31 PM

I just got a look at this discussion on hydraulic T/O bearings. I'm using a Tilton 1" MC with a 1" slave. It does disengage, but it takes the left leg of Charles Atlas, and occurs just off the floor. I have a Centerforece II (diaphragm type) clutch cover. Would I be better off with the 3 finger style (that Parham wanted me to use!)? thanx steve
meltzer, "unencumbered by the thought process"

decooney · #13 (**permalink**) 01-13-2004, 05:03 PM

Steve,
If I had to do it over again, I wish I could have tried a 3-finger instead before I switched back to an external setup. I concur with Bill P. on this one. Good Luck. Duane

mikeforte · #14 (**permalink**) 01-13-2004, 05:25 PM

Hi Pat,
I've been selling the McLeod hydraulic throw out bearing for years. If installed correctly, they are OK, but any leaks or failure requires transmission removal. Some cars with a x-member that isn't removable would require engine removal too. With all of the problems in the past, I've developed an external billet fork, slave & pivot assembly that I install on a Lakewood or McLeod bellhousing so it's complete and any service would then be external. Call me for pictures or any tech info.
Thanks,
Mike Forte
781-273-9900

PatBuckley · #15 (**permalink**) 01-13-2004, 07:44 PM

Thanks Mike,

It is all in now and hopefully connected correctly with a pedal stop and the lines secured so with any luck I should have a long and trouble free experience!

Are you going to post some pictures in your gallery? I would like to see you setup.

Pat

John S Peterson · #16 (**permalink**) 01-13-2004, 11:22 PM

Hey guys...we all have something in common. I also had problems in the beginning with the McLeod setup with a Centerforce clutch. It blew seals, leaked at the banjo fittings and was about ready to put a C6 in it (not really). I also ran a large master cyl. If you remember some of the things we all probably heard, a large bore does not provide for more pressure, just volume. I went to a 5/8" master cyl, changed the banjo fittings to A/N 90' fittings and followed the measurement setup to the letter, and guess what.....it has worked great ever since. Smaller dia master cyl means more pressure, which means less effort. My master cyls mount under the floor, but behind the pedals so I used aluminum shifter rod available at any place that sells stuff for stock cars and threaded it to match the rod out of the master and heim on the pedal end which allows me to adjust how far it moves the piston in the master. Bottom line is...A.no more leaks..B. A five year old with a sore leg can depress the pedal, and C. no pedal stop.

Life is good.

John