Incredible deal on Kirkham? - Page 2

otomix · #21 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 10:56 AM

In final reality you get what you pay for:

Back yard home garage built = well we all have seen such
Professional built (only a handful of top quality builders) = Significantly better
Sub par engines parts assembly fit finish 4 speed cars (priced accordingly)

Todays general US$ market on Kirkham cars = 85-105k

The range considers quality of build, mileage or use (like track use), brushed pained or polished, type of car (fia, SC or rare street car), engine specs, type of registration etc..

Either way - recession or not, the Beautiful cars are art forms, under promoted and Undervalued. They get classified and marketed by the Kirkhams as a "Kit" car....what a shame.

otomix · #22 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 11:00 AM

Additionally, to build a new one today with all top quality parts build by top quality builders and consider All misc. costs (flights travel transports etc..) the 110k - 120k+ figure is very accurate.

Tony Ripepi · #23 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 12:39 PM

Great thread,

I've built them myself starting from the early 90's ( Shell Valley & Unique) and when the SPF rollers came a long I know that it was very expensive,time consuming and difficult to achieve the fit , finish and quality that they put into their cars from the factory.

Shelby originally tried to compete with FFR with their "kit" up picked it up in Las Vegas with a rough Fibreglass body, Original styled frame and 27 boxes of all the orginal style bits and pieces --- No Instruction Manual !!!! They have been through eight years of change and numerous interation of builder to get to where the SPF guys have been for ten + years.

The Kirkhams uppped the ante when they started putting cars together in in Utah with Aluminum body parts, frames and some additional pieces from Poland, they even sold some to Shelby. And then they took the next step to Stainless Steel ----If you have seen the MBA presentation that Thomas put together on the business model you have a new a respect for them a company, family and business model that puts them at the top of the industry and keeps them there.

In recent years I have gone to the best people to have cars built by people that had the experience, skills, historical reputation for quality and delivering on time to feed my passion for the toys that have ended up in my garage.

In this thread All of the years of change and the opinions of both the home builder and professional expertise are voiced. You make the choice and take the path your skills, time, and money lead you and deal with the results when and if you decide to sell. I have seen home builders take 10 -20 years to fabricate a car and then sell when they got to the end of the journey, it was about the journey not the destination and talked to the people that bought their cars to hear them rave about the quality, beauty and engineering.

One lesson I have learned is that it will always cost more than you think to build than the number you start out with in the spreadsheet and when you sell it you will not get back what you put into it. Labor is not free even if it is your own.....when you consider shipping, registration costs etc. etc. etc. You will end up upside down no matter what.

This is a hobby and passion for me ----- One mans Opinion !!!!!!!!

Four Cobra Roadsters, One Daytona Coupe and a GT40 have made their way into my garage ----The Shelby is in the garage and the GT40 is for sale and looking forward to the next project

Tony R.

RodKnock · #24 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 01:02 PM

The deal on the $89K Kirkham looks even better when you consider that the engine had Stage 3 heads, Velasco crank, Lunati billet rods, CSX block, the extra Weber setup, and the polished roundels. "Well bought" and "well sold" in this market.

The Kirkhams give you a wonderful package, but it's not perfect or finished and thus there are some that will change things and hopefully make them even better than when they left Utah.

ng8264723 · #25 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 03:22 PM

I have many of the upgrades you mentioned. I guess I also searched for deals. For instance the Aviad oil pan I found used for 1/2 price. I also am running a Jag rear which I paid $275 for. The alum diff is really nice but not any stronger than the jag unit. I also went with the Genesis iron block the alum was only $400 more though. The Shelby block is overpriced. As far as heads go Barry from survival said the stage one give you 550HP with a 482. Why would you want more? The powerband moves up in rpm's and you then have a track only car. I wanted my rpm lower. I figured the engine master winner Survival motorsports was a good one for advice. So in the end you can always spend more but you don't always get more.

RodKnock · #26 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ng8264723

I have many of the upgrades you mentioned. I guess I also searched for deals. For instance the Aviad oil pan I found used for 1/2 price. I also am running a Jag rear which I paid $275 for. The alum diff is really nice but not any stronger than the jag unit. I also went with the Genesis iron block the alum was only $400 more though. The Shelby block is overpriced. As far as heads go Barry from survival said the stage one give you 550HP with a 482. Why would you want more? The powerband moves up in rpm's and you then have a track only car. I wanted my rpm lower. I figured the engine master winner Survival motorsports was a good one for advice. So in the end you can always spend more but you don't always get more.

Opinions will vary. Your $77K build could qualify for the cheapest Kirkham build on Club Cobra.

Why would someone want more HP? Hmmmm....let me think about that one for a second

Because this is America.

If I were in the market for a used Kirkham, then I would be looking at only the cars with aluminum blocks, Stage 2 heads, aluminum rear ends, etc. and the most HP.

Lastly, watch out for that used Aviaid pan. Mine had two small pin holes in the outlet for the line to the puke tank. I didn't discover this until I had a few hundred miles on the car.

ng8264723 · #27 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 04:29 PM

Rodknock,
I have built a few cars. It is easy to get a car with high HP numbers. When building a car you have to really decide on usage. If your building something for maybe track time and mostly street then you should build accordingly. That is why I went with stage one heads. I could of afforded more as well as a different crack. Barry asked, "What am I going to do with the car". I also confirmed this with Keith Craft. So if your not racing then it becomes a less streetable bragging right car. As far as the alum block. I also asked about that. Iwas told by multiple people that an iron block was more reliable for a long term street driven car
chris

madmaxx · #28 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 05:42 PM

Tonny,

I saw your gt40 on cobra country, stunning car!!! You always take it to the next level. Can't wait to hear about your next project.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Ripepi

Great thread,

I've built them myself starting from the early 90's ( Shell Valley & Unique) and when the SPF rollers came a long I know that it was very expensive,time consuming and difficult to achieve the fit , finish and quality that they put into their cars from the factory.

Shelby originally tried to compete with FFR with their "kit" up picked it up in Las Vegas with a rough Fibreglass body, Original styled frame and 27 boxes of all the orginal style bits and pieces --- No Instruction Manual !!!! They have been through eight years of change and numerous interation of builder to get to where the SPF guys have been for ten + years.

The Kirkhams uppped the ante when they started putting cars together in in Utah with Aluminum body parts, frames and some additional pieces from Poland, they even sold some to Shelby. And then they took the next step to Stainless Steel ----If you have seen the MBA presentation that Thomas put together on the business model you have a new a respect for them a company, family and business model that puts them at the top of the industry and keeps them there.

In recent years I have gone to the best people to have cars built by people that had the experience, skills, historical reputation for quality and delivering on time to feed my passion for the toys that have ended up in my garage.

In this thread All of the years of change and the opinions of both the home builder and professional expertise are voiced. You make the choice and take the path your skills, time, and money lead you and deal with the results when and if you decide to sell. I have seen home builders take 10 -20 years to fabricate a car and then sell when they got to the end of the journey, it was about the journey not the destination and talked to the people that bought their cars to hear them rave about the quality, beauty and engineering.

One lesson I have learned is that it will always cost more than you think to build than the number you start out with in the spreadsheet and when you sell it you will not get back what you put into it. Labor is not free even if it is your own.....when you consider shipping, registration costs etc. etc. etc. You will end up upside down no matter what.

This is a hobby and passion for me ----- One mans Opinion !!!!!!!!

Four Cobra Roadsters, One Daytona Coupe and a GT40 have made their way into my garage ----The Shelby is in the garage and the GT40 is for sale and looking forward to the next project

Tony R.

Ronbo · #29 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ng8264723

Ronbo,
That's too bad! I guess I got a super deal!

Not at all. You chose to compromise, I didn't. End result is we both have Kirkhams that are different cars.

As far as bragging, I only recall yours...

Got the Bug · #30 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 09:09 PM

It seems like there's a bit of rationalization or selective memory when it comes to the true final cost to build these cars.

You can also count on some guy who consistently pays less than you and always seems to find the "deal of century"....and tells you that you overpaid.

Ronbo · #31 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got the Bug

It seems like there's a bit of rationalization or selective memory when it comes to the true final cost to build these cars.

You can also count on some guy who consistently pays less than you and always seems to find the "deal of century"....and tells you that you overpaid.

Yep, I bought mine during the '08 summit and got $9k in free options. Currently I've got about $112k in receipts.

I think ng is expecting to win a trophy for building the cheapest Kirkham or somthin.

RodKnock · #32 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 10:32 PM

If you look through past threads where Chris (ng) has posted, then you'll see that this is a commom refrain of his.

767Jockey · #33 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 10:33 PM

Hell, I took the easy way out, I just stopped counting. I'm going to build my car as a like it, and I'll count up the receipts afterward. Whatever they are, they are......

ng8264723 · #34 (**permalink**) 03-05-2009, 04:00 AM

As long as the person is happy with the car and what they have built that's all that matters. I'm not trying to win any prize. I guess I just thought webers and an alum rear was too expensive for my taste. In my eyes I didn't compromise. I got a brand new car with a new motor. Some may not have the means to build a car for $100. I was trying to say for those that don't a Kirkham can be built a little cheaper. You may have to install the powertrain yourself. To some (like myself) that's part of the fun. I like to build things. To all that can afford the webers alum rear and assembly good luck!
Chris

madmaxx · #35 (**permalink**) 03-05-2009, 06:51 AM

I agree alot with NG, my next one and yes there will be a next one I will install the drivetrain and it will have a full blown big block. I am contemplating an ERA but now I must seriously consider a Kirkham and be done with it. I always feel good about saving $59 and then loosing $10K in the market on a dailey basis, LOL!!! Anyone know of a Kirkham roller someone wants to unload on the cheap??

RodKnock · #36 (**permalink**) 03-05-2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madmaxx

Anyone know of a Kirkham roller someone wants to unload on the cheap??

Give David Kirkham a call, you never know what deals might be going on right now in between planning for the "Tea Party."

I certainly can say that I compromised during my build. I would have liked to have added the $7K+ Dynatek fuel injection setup and the Avon tires, but they can wait for now. I'm sure there are other items I missed.

The "upgrade bug" seems to hit everyone eventually.

Tony Ripepi · #37 (**permalink**) 03-05-2009, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

Hell, I took the easy way out, I just stopped counting. I'm going to build my car as a like it, and I'll count up the receipts afterward. Whatever they are, they are......

Yo 767,

Great response........you go through the process and build to the image you have in your mind and how you expect to use the car.

I started the GT40 build before I married my wife and had no idea she would be claustrophobic in it. It does not work for how we want to use it for wine country, Pacific shore cruises and travel through inland California so we are moving on.

BTW I agree with RedBarchetta ---- Screaming deal for quality Kirkham .

I have an image in my head for an SPF Daytona !!!!!!

Thank you MadMaxx.....

Tony R.

RedBarchetta · #38 (**permalink**) 03-05-2009, 10:32 AM

The more that I read the responses on this thread, and the more that I look at that particular car that sold for $89K, the more I realize what a screaming deal the buyer received on a car that had quality components ($$) and was fully sorted out (i.e. it takes more $$ to get to that point). Just wow.

-Dean

RodKnock · #39 (**permalink**) 03-05-2009, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedBarchetta

The more that I read the responses on this thread, and the more that I look at that particular car that sold for $89K, the more I realize what a screaming deal the buyer received on a car that had quality components ($$) and was fully sorted out (i.e. it takes more $$ to get to that point). Just wow.

-Dean

Agreed. Also, sorting for me took a few extra dollars. There were items that annoyed me (LED fuel level gauge, vibrating bulkhead panel, dash switches, etc.) and items that popped up that needed to be repaired (Aviad oil pan quickly comes to mind).

With four full price offers, I wonder if it sold for over asking price.