220 volt elect stove

[427SSSS]

any electricians out there? New stove has 4 prongs. Old recipetical is 3 prong. Electrician says its fine just swap new pigtail for old.

[mln385]

If you have the wiring existing to change to a 4 wire you would be better off, if not leave it alone. Here is a good explanation for you here>>>>> electrical - Should I use 3 wire or 4 wire for a range? - Home Improvement Stack Exchange

[DWRAT]

4 prong is the newer code where 3 prong is the older code.
Either will work fine.
The newer 4 prong basically has a extra ground wire.

[Paul F]

Consult an electrician. Don't get advice from a car forum.

Neutral and ground are not the same. They are not to be connected together except at the circuit breaker box. To do so will defeat the purpose of the ground and affect safety. It will violate code.

Four pins may be required. If the stove has a 120 volt outlet or some other 120v function, then you need the 4 pins for proper operation.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by DWRAT

4 prong is the newer code where 3 prong is the older code.
Either will work fine.
The newer 4 prong basically has a extra ground wire.

What is here is the fact. But if you are looking carefully you will see that the three prong connection adds a shunt from the neutral (white) to the chassis ground (where on the 4 wire, the green wire connects). DO NOT FORGET THIS OR YOU WILL DIE. SERIOUSLY. I'M NOT KIDDING.

The code changed to use a true earth ground (the green wire) on appliances. Previously the electrical connectivity was the equivalent of inside the breaker box - at the termination, neutral and ground were connected on the same bus bar. The new code separates the earth ground and neutral at the appliance. This is for appliances like ranges and dryers only. True 220V devices like air conditioners maintain the traditional 220V connection: 2 hot plus ground (no neutral)

The reason that dryers and ranges split is that they actually (within the appliance) split the 220V into 2x120V circuits. This allows control panels, etc. to run on 120V and the neutral (when the dryer/range is on) actually carries a slight current. In a pure inductive load (the Air Conditioner or other 220V motor with 2xlive and ground) the current is on one (red or black) at a time, and the other (black or red) provides return. The same concept is used in the so-called "edison" 220V -> 2x120V circuit (which is now disallowed by the code).

As recommended, if you are not absolutely comfortable making this conversion, get your electrician back.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by Paul F

Four pins may be required. If the stove has a 120 volt outlet or some other 120v function, then you need the 4 pins for proper operation.

As I stated above, virtually all ranges and dryers have a 120V function, so this is not really true as it has been the way things have been done for say 100 years (3 wire plugs). Once again, an ideal 220V circuit has no current return on the neutral so a ground is equivalent. On 220V appliances the size of the neutral is more than adequate to carry the difference.

This is not to say that neutral and ground are not different. If you have ever used a GFCI BREAKER (in the main panel) you will note that the neutral for that breaker is connected to the neutral of the branch and the ground(green/bare) is connected to the ground/neutral bus. This also is true in a GFCI "plug" which is why there is a upstream/downstream white (neutral) separation.

[427SSSS]

Thanks for the input/information. I'm up in Tahoe, 360 miles from home. I hired general contractor to help. Removed o/h cabinets above existing stove in pensula between kitchen and dinning room. It really opened the place up. Hot wire that was connected to old vent above stove.....asked general to send electrician.
This "electrician" taped ends of wires and shoved them up between joists. I stopped him. I asked if that was code? He said: well he would have to put 2nd box in ceiling, and it would be exposed. I said why not terminate hot wires in same box that new light fixture is connected to? He said wow good idea. Now this a licensed electrician!!!! He's one of the people who said trading the 4 prong for the 3 prong pig tail is fine. But you can understand why I'm not comefortable
with his opinion. I called a different GC and he said it was fine also. I phoned the electrician I use at home, have not heard back yet. So that's why I posted here. I've phoned 6 electrical contractors up here...all too busy to come out. I'll keep trying to hire new electrician. I've been up here twice, 10 days out of last two weeks, remodeling. I want to go home and work on cobra, not house.

[427SSSS]

Again, thank you gentlemen for information/suggestions.
I finally got another opinion from a licensed electrician, old plug is fine.
I installed the new downdraft stove, it works great. Had to install new vent, down through the floor, and out to outside.
I removed the overhead cabinets above stove, in island between kit and dinning room, installed new light fixtures, new kit faucet, new garage door opener, new backyard paving stone patio, and new flooring in LR, DR, and kit. (phase one of improvements)
I'm now home, and I can get back to working on Cobras, first thing, get my new lift off trailer, out of the rain and install in shop.

1st photo, after cabinet removal, before new stove install.
2nd photo, new stove
3rd photo, new stove, and new floor
4th photo, before cabinet removal (actually, I had already removed first cabinet)

[Ron61]

427SSSS,

Very nice. Your Kitchen cabinets and counter top are the same as mine, except my stove is on thew other side near where your dishwasher is. Sink is even the same.

Ron

[427SSSS]

My parents had this place built in 1988, after buying the lot 10 years earlier, and waiting year, after year, for the building permit lottery.
Dad said that he wanted the house to "stay in the family, never to be sold."
Without airing all my family's dirty laundry.....
Dad passed 20 years ago, Mom remarried, 2nd husband somehow managed to change the Trust so that the Tahoe house would be sold after Mom passed. (which she did some 20 months ago).
Tahoe was to be sold.
I went through 5 attorneys over 14 months, "broke the Trust", and got the Tahoe property back into my family name. (out of the 2nd husbands name)
It's always been a "weekend rental", for family/friends/and friends of friends.
At $125.00 per night, it's always lost money, at years end. And now City of Tahoe pass a new ordinance of $600.00 per year to have a rental property.
It's a 5 bdrm/2 bath home, so if several people use it at the same time, it's not a bad deal.
I still cannot get information (from 2nd husband and Trust Attorney), on what/how much it has lost yearly in the past, so I do not know what I have got myself into.
I will continue to rent it at $125.00 per night, and the place will most likely continue to lose money each year.

[mdross1]

The rules were changed to cover everyones butt in the event of legal action. Some where a situation made the electrical experts hover and came up with this solution they wrote the new rule now we all have to follow suit when an electrician gets involved. Knowing the craft and how it all works makes it easy for us to decide what works for our individual needs.

[427SSSS]

mdross1,
I understand what you are saying, I worked in the Construction Industry for over 40 years, heavy construction, not much in residential. Electrical trade has always been my weakest area, being color blind (color confused is actually a more accurate term), I avoided all them different color wires. I know residential wiring is black/white/xxxx, but, still, I mostly avoided electrical work when possible.
Unplugging an old stove, and plugging in a new stove.....no need for an electrician, except for advice, I wanted to be sure/safe, so I got advice from three licensed electricians. And, the information posted here, well, it's obvious, several people who posted know what they are talking about.

I understand this is a car forum, and not the most intelligent location for advice on electrical work, but I was not having much luck connecting with licensed electrician, I was frustrated, running out of time, so I posted here, assuming I'd at least get some advice, (which of course I would take with a grain of salt), and then, finally, when I did get professional input, I proceeded.

Funny, I guess it was the storm, I had as much trouble getting a contractor to install the vent/ductwork, under the house for the downdraft stove. I must have called over 20 contractors, all too busy. I finally resigned myself, that I was going to have to install it; and I'm way to old to be crawling under a house. So, I bought the wrong parts, of course, but that turned out lucky, when I went back to return them, I was telling my "sad" story to the man behind the counter, and he connected me with his brother, in the business, and within 4 hours the ductwork was installed, and I was then able to install the stove.