Car Payment Box

[Ron61]

I just saw this pop up in the headlines and didn't see anything about it on Snopes. But it could still be just another hoax and I never used the right search terms on Snopes.

I've never heard of this trend before, but according to USA Today, subprime borrowers buying a car are required to have a little box mounted under the car's dashboard that forces them to make payments on time. A light on the box flashes when payments are due, and if the payment is not made on time, the box starts to beep until a four-digit code is punched in to reset the system. The only way to get this code is by making the payment, and if that payment is not made on time, the car won't start.

Apparently, customers hate them, while lenders love the little boxes because it lowers default rates. Sekurus, the company who sells these boxes, has sold over 250,000 at $250, and its competitors are looking at ways to make these payment enforcement devices more efficient. One company is selling wireless systems that sends text messages to the car, and another one is adding GPS functionality to the device to make it easy for lenders to repossess the car.

I know times are tough for everyone, but is this really necessary? Before you know it, we'll have these little boxes locking us out the house too. It's just crazy.

Ron

[meat]

Originally Posted by Ron61

Sekurus, the company who sells these boxes, has sold over 250,000 at $250, and its competitors are looking at ways to make these payment enforcement devices more efficient. One company is selling wireless systems that sends text messages to the car, and another one is adding GPS functionality to the device to make it easy for lenders to repossess the car.

Nice, huh?

I'd heard of this, but ... well, it seems like kind of a moot point to have the "On-Time" system on the car if the car has OnStar. OnStar always knows where the car is, can unlock the doors and make it remarkably easy for the repo man to pick the car up.

Personally, I don't much care for any of that stuff. Not because I'm going to default on a loan, but because I don't think it's anybody's business but my own where I am and what I'm doing.

...and don't even get me started on the black box technology that's on some cars nowadays!

Your pal,
Meat.

[wtm442]

If it was not an April Fools joke, all I can say is "Big Brother is Watching".

They already have a black box that records everything, and it has been used against the driver in court cases where the car was well over the speed limit when it crashed.

[Ron61]

Yes, I know about the Black Box thing. I really don't like any of that stuff but it will soon be to the point that you won't be allowed to open the hood on a new car. Same for their idea of having a computer record miles driven and then when you go to a gas pump it will feed that into a receiver and they can charge you a sur charge if you have filled up to many times in a set time period. This is not a bill yet, but has been talked about as a way to raise revenue. Wonder how they would check your gas can when you go to get gas for lawn mowers and such.

Ron

[Excaliber]

I have a speedo unit device on my motorcycle that records and retains 'top speed'. I check it once in awhile to see how I'm doing. But I can reset or clear it anytime I want, which might be difficult if I'm laying on the side of the road all crashed up...

[Ron61]

Ernie,

The ones that I have read about on cars can only be reset and read by the dealer. I suppose they can also use them to void a warranty if they show you have been driving to fast but I haven't heard of anything like that.

Ron

[tcrist]

This box was on the Sacramento news last night. So it is real, not a made up story. They have been using it for a while now and it has been needed a couple of times for the auto dealers to get there car back. I do not know if it has a GPS tracking thing installed or not they just said that it has a starter interupt on it so it cant be started the normal way.

Terry

[427 S/O]

Cmon', so we have breathalyzers and car payment status electronic BS, you gotta be kidding!. What next........anyone.....

[Excaliber]

There is a way to defeat all these various controls, but it's kind of tough to do when your drunk and poor.

I make an occasional loan, and have had to reposses a a couple of cars. I'd vote for a black box that would give me a better shot at getting MY car back from some looser. Last time it was in Waianae, 2 am, I had the spare keys, not a good place for a repro man to be caught. I'd been looking for the car for two months. The motor stumbled when I started it up, thought it was going to die, reved it up, wind up burning rubber in the parking lot. NOT GOOD, so much for a stealthy escape.

[Ron61]

If you miss a payment it says the box has to have a code put into it to let the car start. Does it have to be taken to the person or dealer that you got the car from? If son, then how does the dam thing know when you make a payment unless you take it back for them to tell it? What next, black boxes on your house and utilities? I am really happy now that I paid cash for everything that I have. I just have my normal monthly bills come in which I can't avoid. Plus a visit to the eye doctor and new glasses which I am sure that I will need this time. And of course the ever present looming dentist visit. Maybe a black box so my teeth will fall out if I don't pay.

Ron

[meat]

Originally Posted by Ron61

If you miss a payment it says the box has to have a code put into it to let the car start. Does it have to be taken to the person or dealer that you got the car from? If son, then how does the dam thing know when you make a payment unless you take it back for them to tell it?

My understanding is that you make a payment, you get the code for the next time period. You miss a payment, you don't get the code.

Your pal,
Meat.

[Ron61]

Thanks Meat,

I hadn't seen anything about that except that you had to have a code put in to keep it working. What happens when you pay the car off? Do you remove the box or does it just stay there?

Ron

[Don]

GM OnStar has or will have the options:

* prevent a car from being started
* not sure how this will work, or even if it is correct. If stolen, the power can gradually be decreased for a controlled stop, then prevented from restarting.

Correct or ?

[RAZOR]

Look at this way guys, their are probably 30 to 40 people a week come into the dealership where I do finance, who want and need a car but cant get one, because their credit is so bad. The only way with their credit history is to use a lender that uses one of these devices. We dont have one that does but their are some out their that do this and it is a benefit for the customer, allowing them to have transportation and rebuild their credit. Ask yourself, would you lend $10,000 to a person that has never paid back any one that has loaned them money?

[Ron61]

Razor,

You have a point. Now reverse it and look at it this way. If you have a credit rating that is in the 850 range, never owed money, and has never been late paying monthly bills, would you like being treated as an untrustworthy person? Also if their credit is so bad they can't afford a car, how is that box going to pay for it? And with or without that box, would you lend $10K to a person with the record that you cited?

Ron

[Excaliber]

I wouldn't assume that someone with good or great credit would have to deal with a 'box'. There are plenty of cars for sale, just go somewhere else. It's a good program for those who have few other options outside of a black box.

A buyer feeling like he's not trusted? Well, being poor sucks on many levels, this is just one.

[Ron61]

Ernie,

I believe that in my post I referred to a person that had money to buy a car, not one that was poor when I asked about the trustworthiness. I guess I never posted it correctly. My main point was if a person can't afford a car, then what good is that box going to do?

Ron

[RAZOR]

The box is only used on loans with very bad credit history, if you have anywhere near good credit it is not a worry for you. The way most devices work, is that it shuts down the car if the payment is not made, and you cant start it until payment is made. Realize these people can do this or go to a buy here,pay here, where they get a $2000 car for $8000 and they pay weekly, and they still might have the black box.
The fact is that bad credit and INCOME have little relationship, plenty of these people make great money,some with meager incomes have excellant credit, or like this past week a very nice couple, each with over 20 yrs on the job each making near $60,000 a year had poor credit, not bad enough for a box but in the subprime range. Being poor certainly makes you more likely to have credit issues but is not the sole contributing factor. Having poor credit is no indicator wheather or not you can afford a car, many times it is an indicator of character.

[427 S/O]

When those 'buy here pay here' lots popped up years ago, I made the comment to a friend, that's a good way to lose money on people with poor credit!, he said, BS that guy will make tons of money selling the same car over and over. Each time he repossesses it.

[Excaliber]

Ron, I understood your post, a person who has the money. But being 'poor' exists on many levels. I can't afford a real CSX for $500K, being a 'poor man' I can only come up $50k or so. To which my nieghbors respond, "THATS poor"?

But seriously, a person with 'the money' would not have to buy a car with a black box, if he/she is insulted, they can simply move on to another car.

But for SOME people I see the black box as a GREAT BENEFIT. Those who have gone through a recent divorce and had their credit ruined, they might have the money for most of the deal. But the need to finance the rest could be crippling. The black box allows them to get back in the game, rebuild their credit and yes, it is somewhat embarrasing. Like I said, being poor sucks.

With the recent shutdown of Aloha Airlines I'm hearing some pretty bad 'instant' scenarios. Like the newly married couple making $60K each as pilots with Aloha. Just bought a new house, car, she's pregnant. OVERNIGHT their both unemployed, lost their insurance, WILL loose the house if they don't sell now. My good friend just bought a 72 Vette, making payments, he to was laid off (Aloha), there goes the car, it's for sale. It will be all but impossible for these folks to secure a new loan or refinance. For some of the 2,000 employees that just got fired the black box may represent a God send for them.