G.M. to Cut jobs sell Hummer

[Ron61]

If things are this bad at G. M., then Ford must be in worse trouble. This is getting scary and I hope they can turn our economy around one of these days but it isn't going to happen an a month or so for sure. And from another source, I can't vouch for its authenticity, they say that both Ford and G.M. have a huge inventory of SUVs and those over sized pickups that they can't move at all. I do know that the dealers here are cutting back and it is hard to get them to even consider taking in a big SUV or pickup on a trade. We could possibly wind up without a Ford dealer in Redding one of these days.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080715/bs_nm/gm_dc

Ron

[Mark IV]

Actually, GM is in worse shape than Ford.

Ford took it on the chin previously to cut costs and has cut production to avoid having to fire-sale trucks. Ford is sitting on over 27 billion of cash, GM has less than 20 and is running a much higher burn rate (close to a billion a month....). Ford has already arranged credit facilities, GM is now just going to the money market to look for capital.

Ford delayed the production and intro of the 2009 F150 from August to late September to allow dealers to sell-down the 2008 units. In the old days, they would have cranked up the line, shoved product down the dealers gullets and then thrown as much incentive money as it took to sell 'em at them. Now they will pay the line workers the 90% rate to stay home and let the market adjust.

[nevermind65]

I visit about 5 facilities making parts for Honda. They are running 24/7 and can't keep up with production. 3 of the facilities just put in about $300 million in new machines and 2 of those are doubling the size of their facilities.

Anybody see anything wrong with this picture?

[427 S/O]

With a hundred years of production under their belts, I believe they will survive and prosper. If VW can produce a 60-70 MPG car (the polo), F&GM will have some nice surprises.

[Cobrabill]

Ron,i don't understand how you view this as a bad thing.The Hummer(H2 & H3) are two of the biggest piles of junk to come from GM in a long time.Nothing but re-badged & re-sheet metaled GM trucks.
They are a joke.And in a typical GM "heads-up-the-a$$" move they discontinued the REAL Hummer.
This is just another case of GM attempting to "right"the plethora of wrongs it has done over the years.And it makes sense.There is no need for Hummers(at least ones with 4 wheels).

GM killed the Electro Motive Division before selling it off too.EMD locomotives were number one for years.Not anymore.GE is king now.

[Excaliber]

Those freakin' H2 and H3's are nothing more than "replica's" of the real deal...

[427sharpe]

GM still doesnt get the real issue for themselves....they built a corporation to sell (build) cars that 50% of the market wanted to buy. Now, they have less than 30%. TOO MANY BRANDS. TOO MANY MODELS. They killed Olds and will kill Hummer. They will have to pick at least one more (maybe two) to get production in line with demand, unless they just start rebadging the same car again (and that would kill the company, IMHO). Buick can't get out of the doldrums, even with good product and advertising they are still seen as an old mans car. I place this marque next, followed by GMC or Chevy Truck (I'd bet on GMC). Leaves Chevrolet, Pontiac, Cadillac as the big three with Saturn floating in the breeze. Cujt your model lineup, lowering production costs. Close plants. And start making some decent products again, 'cause you can't burn thru $3 BILLION a year forever.
On the Ford side, sell Volvo. Sell or kill Mercury. Get back to core products and give the dealers something to sell. One break FoMoCo has caught (they need it!) is the reliance on V-6's in the Lincoln brand (MK-Z). Mags dissed 'em, but it looks smart now. Just pray the EcoBoost (twin turbo V6 replacement for the V8's) works out in '09. They killed the 'new' 6.8L V8 plan already.

[Ron61]

Bill,

I don't view them getting rid of that POS Hummer as a bad thing. What I view as a bad thing is the mess all of the American Car companies have sit around and let happen by building bigger and bigger SUVs, Pickups, and anything else big, instead of looking at what the other companies, Honda for example were doing. That have know for years that this gas crunch was coming and just kept building those over sized and worthless gas hogs that are only driven on the highway by people who want to have the biggest car on the road. Why don't they pay attention to their own studies and build what most of the people have wanted for the past several years instead of saying, here we built this bigger this year, you buy it?

Ron

[4RE KLR]

Its $3 Billion a Quarter NOT a year.

Hummer needs to go. Yea it was a great novelty, however The Governator only needs so many of them. Besides it is a waste of resources and people now view them as part of the problem and not part of the solution.

Buick also has to go. It has been dead for many years and GM doesn't want to admit it.

But here is the real deal. The upper management needs to go. They have got their heads so far up their own a$$es they can see the market has changed.

If Toyota or ANY other car company can build a car that gets good mileage so can our American Companies. We just need to reach down and pull our pants up, stop getting screwed and go to work and build what is good for business. It is true in any business that if you build what customers want they will buy it. Why can't GM remember what made them a great company to begin with.

I won't even get into the union problems here. I also do not understand why the line workers are getting 90% of their pay to stay at home.

[Cobrabill]

Originally Posted by 4RE KLR

Its $3 Billion a Quarter NOT a year.

Hummer needs to go. Yea it was a great novelty, however The Governator only needs so many of them. Besides it is a waste of resources and people now view them as part of the problem and not part of the solution.

Buick also has to go. It has been dead for many years and GM doesn't want to admit it.

But here is the real deal. The upper management needs to go. They have got their heads so far up their own a$$es they can see the market has changed.

If Toyota or ANY other car company can build a car that gets good mileage so can our American Companies. We just need to reach down and pull our pants up, stop getting screwed and go to work and build what is good for business. It is true in any business that if you build what customers want they will buy it. Why can't GM remember what made them a great company to begin with.

I won't even get into the union problems here. I also do not understand why the line workers are getting 90% of their pay to stay at home.

Unfortunately,Buick is not dead.It is selling like Hotcakes overseas.But yes,it has to go.

Hummer-GM never should have bought it in the first place.The H-1's have there purpose but not the H-2&3s.

Why can't GM remember the great company that they were?Simple,they still think THEY ARE the great car company they were.
The last innovative thing GM did was the Corvair.

[Mark IV]

Originally Posted by Cobrabill

The last innovative thing GM did was the Corvair.

And look how well that turned out for them!!!

Us manufacturers built what the public here wanted, import manufacturers built what sold elsewhere in the world and sold it here in smaller numbers until events caused a greater demand. Were GM and Ford wrong when they had very profitable trucks rolling off the lines to waiting customers? No, but were they wrong to beleive that business model would last forever? Yes.

Much of US business is short-sighted looking only at the quaterly profits and what Wall Street says about them. Auto manufacturers have routinely stolen next quartres business with incentives to pull sales ahead and "we'll worry about next quarter when it arrives".

They are the equal of crack addicts, they have addicted the buying public to expect massive incentives. They are hooked and the only way off is cold turkey.........................it won't be pretty for a while but it will be the only way out.

[Joe Wicked]

I was just reading where GM may pull out of auto racing sponsorships as well as part of the cuts.

http://www.theolympian.com/nationwor...ry/507913.html

[Ron61]

Joe,

I also saw a post on another site that Ford may be considering pulling out of NASCASR. I haven't seen any news reports about it yet, but I wouldn't be surprised now that the cars are all the same and they just pay a lot to have their names painted on them. Until GM and Ford get back on their feet, I would think that kind of money going out would be one of the first things they would stop.

Edit To Add: Bill, is there really no way to convince you to get another avatar? I notice posts by the avatars more than the name and that is one that has caused me to miss a few of your posts. How about something along the lines of Fred's?

Ron

[Joe Wicked]

Originally Posted by Ron61

Joe,

I also saw a post on another site that Ford may be considering pulling out of NASCASR. I haven't seen any news reports about it yet, but I wouldn't be surprised now that the cars are all the same and they just pay a lot to have their names painted on them. Until GM and Ford get back on their feet, I would think that kind of money going out would be one of the first things they would stop.

According to the article I read, Ford is saying that they are evaluating the investment, but the level of commitment is not changing for next year. Toyota said the same thing, Dodge left it open. What this means is if Chevy pulls out of Nascar next year, Ford and Toyota are not going to sponsor those teams and that leaves just Dodge to sponsor all of them. I don't see Dodge sponsoring all current Chevy teams. Way too much. This means we could possibly get back to non manufacturer sponsored teams.

[Ron61]

Joe,

That might be the best thing that could happen for NASCAR. Dodge doesn't have the money to sponsor all of the Chevy teams as they make up well over 50% of the teams in the two top classes. I do believe that Ford will pull out, or cut back to the point they are no longer much more than just cars to fill the field. In a few years it could be the Toyota series period.

Ron

[Joe Wicked]

My thoughts exactly

[Wayne Maybury]

Don't forget that the Big 3 have been building cars for a very long time. During the post war period right up until some 15 or 20 years ago, they were very profitable and they agreed to some very expensive union contracts. Since they have been around so long, they all have lots of retirees that are benefitting from the lucrative times and contract benefits. The off shore car companies have not been building cars all that long therefore they do not have nearly the retirement load that the Big 3 has.

I saw an estimate where GM has something like $1700 of benefit costs in each unit they sell whereas Hyundai only has $57 per unit sold.

While the Big 3 are building big SUV's and pickup trucks, the size of their vehicles have not increased nearly as much as the Jap cars & trucks over the past 5 years. Honda, Toyota, and the others are building SUV's and pickups just as big as Ford or GM these days.

Wayne

[Ron61]

Wayne,

I don't know about up there but they are starting to cut the benefits of the retired people now. Other companies have done it for a long time. The telephone company cut out most of theirs a couple of years ago. I saw an article where GM and the union has also agreed to freeze the next round of wage and benefit increases. If the union has finally realized just how bad things are, it has to be bad. I am not a fan of unions and have never been. They did a good thing long ago, but in this day and age, with a few exceptions they are just a dinosaur collecting money.

Ron

[Sharroll Celby]

Ford evidently has a GREAT little car over in Europe. I think it is the next-generation Focus, but could be mistaken. Supposedly, that car is coming to the U.S. in 2010; why not NOW, I dont know.

[Ronbo]

Maybe the Pinto and Vega will be revived like all the '60s muscle cars.

Dont laugh, this is probably being discussed in the board rooms in Detroit.