Obama: US Could Go Broke Unless Healthcare Is Reformed

[fsstnotch]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090616/...ealth_overhaul

Sebelius stressed that Obama is open to compromise on the shape of the public plan, which doesn't have to be run by the government.

[cobra bill]

There are a few other things to look at here, if you are a small business person, and there is a single payer health care, there will be no need to pay for workers compensation, the worker will have healthcare, you will no longer need to have extra auto insurance to cover medical bills, and I know for a fact, that if you offer to pay for the service with cash, as I had to do for my son who is too old to be covered on my insurance, when I paid with cash they took 60% off the bill, so what does that tell you about the price of healthcare, we are already paying 60% inflation to cover the cost of people without insurance.

[mdmull]

& just what are all of the people employed by this "bloated" health care system/insurance/worker's comp industry going to do?

If there is going to be all of this "savings" happening, Why is it going to cost a trillion dollars?

[cobra de capell]

Originally Posted by mdmull

& just what are all of the people employed by this "bloated" health care system/insurance/worker's comp industry going to do?

If there is going to be all of this "savings" happening, Why is it going to cost a trillion dollars?

As is always the case, the savings will disappear once something like this is in place, but the cost with triple.

Why not accomplish the savings part first? Keep in mind that part of the savings projections relate to a reduction in care and a huge reduction is the amount paid to hospitals under Medicare.

Relating to Cobra (space) Bill's comments - it's doubtful that he knows anything about what's being planned by his leader - he's a Kool Aid drinker, big time - way left of center, a government worker bee and doesn't own a driveable Cobra - never has. In fact, I'm thinking that he's somehow been assigned here by the Obama Administration just to piss us off.

Actually, this is what really needs to happen....

[cobra bill]

No its just to piss you off CDC and I do love my job!

[bomelia]

The reason "insurance" is so expensive is because it is NOT insurance... its just a pooled payment plan for most medical expenses. If it were insurance, then it would not pay for doctors visits, baby deliveries, etc. It would only pay for unexpected health catastrophes which, if uninsured, would wreck a family's finances.

This is the real problem with "health insurance".

But I would bet there are even some consrervatives here that will disagree with me on this... because this hits you in your wallet. And because you disagree, you are gonna get Universal Health Care.

What amazes me is the biggest losers (second to us) are the health insurance companies. Sure, Obama says it will not be a single payer system. So the the insurance companies are not out there lobbying for our attention. But they are stupid too. They are going to be wrecked within a few years.

Mike

[cobra bill]

Oh by the way CDC is right, I do not have a drivable Cobra, I have the kit and I have assembles $20.000 in parts to do the build, I retire in 6 months and plan to start then, I had to build my shop first, and the key word is I built it, all of it, I have restored and shown 4 cars now, so I suspect that putting together a kit Cobra will be no trouble what so ever, Did you build yours CDC or did you buy it built? I mean really bankers are the biggest *****'s I know, and I would be surprised if you could build a fire!

[bomelia]

Cobra Bill, I wish you and CDC would open your own thread and make it so we did not have to read your stupid $hit. Better yet, go away.

One more person on the ignore list.

[cobra bill]

Well see there you already know what to do.

[computerworks]

Originally Posted by cobra de capell

Relating to Cobra (space) Bill's comments - it's doubtful that he knows anything about what's being planned by his leader - he's a Kool Aid drinker, big time - way left of center, a government worker bee and doesn't own a driveable Cobra - never has. In fact, I'm thinking that he's somehow been assigned here by the Obama Administration just to piss us off.

Originally Posted by cobra bill

Oh by the way CDC is right, I do not have a drivable Cobra, I have the kit and I have assembles $20.000 in parts to do the build, I retire in 6 months and plan to start then, I had to build my shop first, and the key word is I built it, all of it, I have restored and shown 4 cars now, so I suspect that putting together a kit Cobra will be no trouble what so ever, Did you build yours CDC or did you buy it built? I mean really bankers are the biggest *****'s I know, and I would be surprised if you could build a fire!

OK, listen up. (I love saying that...it's so, so military)

You don't have a Cobra and he doesn't know where his brake fluid goes... so what?

What is important... if you two keep locking horns and throwing turdwords at each other, you will both have a week off to get some chores done around the old bunker.

thanks
ron
ClubCobra Moderator

[cobra bill]

Ser, Yes Ser!

[4RE KLR]

Thanks Ron,

It really is getting old.
__________________________________________________ _


Bomelia,
Insurance companies do not insure for catastrophe, in the sense that you are thinking. Sure you and I think Katrina was catastrophic even though it may not have "personally" touched either of us.

The elements of insurable risk are:

It must be Calculable
It must be Affordable
It must be Non Catastrophic
It must be Homogeneous (similar)
It must be Accidental and Definite
It must be Measurable

Yea, yea, I know. If your house burns down that is a catastrophic event to you. However it does not fit the insurance industries definition of a catastrophe. Sure you will get paid on the loss.

The insurance industry defines a catastrophe as, for example and act of War.

BTW:
I am not trying to argue with you here because I believe you are on the right track.

[bomelia]

OK, fair enough. I do not know anything about the insurance world. But having a baby does not seem Accidental. It can be Catastrophic (keeps me in debt and working long hours).

If health insurance covered "the big risks" only, then we would have a viable system that needed no fixing. I will be considering Health Savings Accounts over the next year. And, more serious illnesses could be/would be treated. and more people could afford it. Yes, that means we pay out of pocket (or the non-taxed HSA). It is a wiser path.

But no, every imbecile wants the government to pay for EVERYTHING. No responisbility and total dependence. I can't do much, but I can write letters and emails to senators and congress people. We cannot afford medicaid, medicare, SS, Prescription Drugs for Old Farts, and now we are going to add Health Insurance for All"?? and our bond rating could drop to AA? And Russia wants a new currency standard? Yeah, the commies will win afterall.

I admit it. I am part of the problem. My eyes have been opened to the whole issue of "Health Insurance". Its time for more folks to think long and hard about this. Because once the governemnt enacts another entitlement, it will not get undone. It will move to the top of the list in the budget as a Mandatory Spending Item. Say goodby to your colleges. Say goodby to infrastructure. And Say goodby to your defense.

Ron61 was right. Pull your own dam teeth.


Mike

[Dan40]

Originally Posted by 4RE KLR

Thanks Ron,

It really is getting old.
__________________________________________________ _


Bomelia,
Insurance companies do not insure for catastrophe, in the sense that you are thinking. Sure you and I think Katrina was catastrophic even though it may not have "personally" touched either of us.

The elements of insurable risk are:

It must be Calculable
It must be Affordable
It must be Non Catastrophic
It must be Homogeneous (similar)
It must be Accidental and Definite
It must be Measurable

Yea, yea, I know. If your house burns down that is a catastrophic event to you. However it does not fit the insurance industries definition of a catastrophe. Sure you will get paid on the loss.

The insurance industry defines a catastrophe as, for example and act of War.

BTW:
I am not trying to argue with you here because I believe you are on the right track.

Actually there are catastrophic health insurance policies available. Policies that do not pay for minor or routine care. The insured must be out-of-pocket $10,000.00 before the insurance pays anything. The premiums are a mere fraction of regular policies.

[bomelia]

And that is what we really need for health insurance. I think the current system allows for a $5000 HSA. Maybe it can be bigger... but that determines your deductable. So on top of the HSA, you have an insurance program that covers you against terrible losses due to medical bills. I would expect that as people got used to the concept, these things would move around a bit till we got it right. What you are not paying in rediculous premiums you use for paying medical bills (you put that money in an HSA, which is not taxed).

Yes, some poor person will ***** about it, but the system wide savings should help them out.

If the government gives you everything, then what need is there for you te "better" yourself? Where is the struggle that makes it worthwhile?

Mike

[cobra de capell]

Originally Posted by bomelia

Cobra Bill, I wish you and CDC would open your own thread and make it so we did not have to read your stupid $hit. Better yet, go away.

One more person on the ignore list.

bomelia - are you completely insane? This is my thread.

Please make sure that I'm on your ignore list as well. It' an honor of sorts.

Also, don't pick on Cobra (space) Bill - that's my job.

In addition, just feel lucky that you don't have to read your own posts.

[cobra bill]

Oh come on, there's enough to go around, you know I'm not afraid!
I've never backed down from a fight and I can more then take care of myself.

[Ron61]

Mike,

Ron61 was right. Pull your own dam teeth.

Actually Fred has offered to do it for me. If he will just hide Frenchy while I am having him do it I may take him up on it.

As for as insurance, I haven't had any since they declared that I was dead many years ago and I pay all of my medical bills out of my own pocket, so none of you in here that are complaining about the uninsured causing you to have to pay are not right in all cases. And no, I don't have the coverage from Social Security as they claim my breakdown as a mental illness and they don't recognize that so I cancelled it 18 years ago. I may as well have that money to put in on the medical bills as them have it to put in their pockets. I do draw Social Security but I paid a huge amount into it. When I was working I always had the years amount paid by late May or early June, so unlike Govt. workers who don't pay a penny into it, I feel I have a right to collect some of what I paid in. Don't lump every person on it into the category that they never contributed anything and should be done away with. You may be paying into it to help cover what people now get, but I paid into it to cover what they got when I was working.

Mike this last rant was not aimed at you, just the ones that keep complaining about everyone on disability or S.S. as it is costing them money. When I lived and got out of the hospital I found out that I owed 14 doctors from UCLA to Berkley who had came up here to study my break down and huge hospital bills.I had to clean out every account that I had all over the country, but I paid it with my money which I had invested and saved toward my expected great retirement. I don't want Govt. Insurance or any other kind as I have always paid my own way and don't want to feel obligated to anyone.

Sorry for the long rant.

Ron

[cobra de capell]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

Oh come on, there's enough to go around, you know I'm not afraid!
I've never backed down from a fight and I can more then take care of myself.

you funny, Cobra (space) Bill

[Wayne Maybury]

Originally Posted by cobra de capell

bomelia - are you completely insane? This is my thread.

Please make sure that I'm on your ignore list as well. It' an honor of sorts.

Also, don't pick on Cobra (space) Bill - that's my job.

In addition, just feel lucky that you don't have to read your own posts.

I'm sorry if I am going off-topic here, but would you guys talk to each other this way if you were face-to-face?

I for one, would like to see people discussing / arguing their points and position rather than always slinging insults at the other guy(s). I try to appreciate both sides of an argument but the insults get to be a bit much after a while.

I will get off my soap box now.

Wayne