Congress’s Secret Plan to Pass Obamacare

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http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=33740

[Ron61]

There is a resolution H Res 554 that is up now that would make them post anything they are going to vote on where all people can read it 72 hours before the vote. Pelosi is determined to stop this as she doesn't think the citizens have a right to known everything the Govt. is going to vote on. In some cases I would tend to agree with her, but her main concern right now is the so called Health Care Reform. I wish I could post a link to the two articles about this and the other mess, but it came in the form of an e-mail notification from a Senator and another source that tracks what Congress is doing and they are far to long to cut and paste. I could probably download them as a Word file, but I still don't know where I could load them and then link to them.

Ron

[Excaliber]

This method of passing a bill is often referred to as the "Nuclear Option". It has been done before but remains incredibly controversial and is generally seen as a last option that carries great risk come election time.

I'm not convinced a 72 hour window of time will make a difference on a major bill. It's simply to short a time frame to digest thousands of pages of legal talk, consult with lawyers and get the latest revised changes just before a vote is scheduled. It's little more than window dressing in my opinion and just add's another layer of red tape to the issue. If anything, we need greater than 72 hours!

There's nothing "secret" about it. The Democrats have been threatening it's use for some time in order to get the Republicans to WAKE UP and smell the coffee. Many Rebpublicans ARE going to reject ANY bill that upsets the status quo, period. They will vote no regardless of how a health bill is written or by whom. Nuclear option, get with the program or get run over, the option remains on the table.

[Ron61]

Ernie,

I agree about the 72 hours as it is almost impossible to actually read and cormorant a 1500 page bill in that time. However I do think they should have to post what they are going to vote on where all people can read it and not have to dig through the Govt. sites to find out, plus they don't seem to show everything on their sites.

I believe the Constitutional reference to Secret Ballot was meant for the people, not Congress.

Ron

[cobra bill]

Reconciliation was used by the republicans to pass the Bush tax cut, and that was more costly then the healthcare bill.

[Excaliber]

Here's why we might need the "Nuclear Option".

[BeanCounter]

This large billboard is on I-70 here in KC. It's a coming boys!!!!! I think that old vet was right despite someone calling him an ahole.

[Ron61]

Actually Ernie I prefer that to getting sick and having to go to a doctor.

Ron

Originally Posted by Excaliber

Here's why we might need the "Nuclear Option".

[Excaliber]

What's up with the Russian symbol on the highway sign?

Who ever put that sign up is an a hole...

[cobra de capell]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

Reconciliation was used by the republicans to pass the Bush tax cut, and that was more costly then the healthcare bill.

costly? Costly to whom?

Where do you get this stuff, space bill? Have you found a blooter input site?

[Ron61]

Hey ernie,

Here is the video that you got your sign from. This guy can't possibly be a little biased could he?



Ron

[Excaliber]

Biased? Nah, I thought his argument was carefully worded with an abundance of facts and logic.


...now about that bridge I have for sale, ya still interested?

[Ron61]

I think I will wait a while on the bridge. Hawaii will one day be part of the West coast according to the geologists as the Pacific Plate is moving under the North American plate. Just think, take a cruise to Hawaii.

Ron

[Dan40]

The Democrats accuse the Republicans of hyperbole, misinformation, and 'scare tactics!" Seems Mr Grayson is very capable of using the same!
One of his statements was, "If you cannot afford health care insurance, we will provide it for you!" More welfare, that we cannot afford as a nation. NO ONE argues that the left wing health INSURANCE reform will cost at least a Trillion dollars. The only arguement is how many MORE Trillions will it cost.
Already, BEFORE ANY health care total overhaul is passed, for each Trillion we spend, we MUST BORROW just under 500 Billion dollars. Absolute, total fiscal insanity.

[Excaliber]

The Democrats accuse the Republicans of hyperbole, misinformation, and 'scare tactics!"

Yup, that about covers it...

NO ONE argues that the left wing health INSURANCE reform will cost at least a Trillion dollars. The only arguement is how many MORE Trillions will it cost.

And you plan is?? Do nothing and it will cost a trillion dollars, and more.

[BeanCounter]

I guess Ernie has a get out of jail free Ahole card.

Personally I think the guy who put up the sign is a pretty astute individual. And we know what those who criticize free speech yet go on and on about their own little pet crusade are..............ex Hare Krishnas.

[Excaliber]

Free speech doesn't give you the authority to say whatever you like where ever you are, there are limits. I reckon the sign is within the guidelines, but the Russkie symbol I find offensive and inciteful. It doesn't help the cause or inspire confidence in reasonable talk concerning the subject. It just makes the guy who put it up an ,,, well you know where I was going with that!

[cobra bill]

Originally Posted by cobra de capell

costly? Costly to whom?

Where do you get this stuff, space bill? Have you found a blooter input site?

For almost 40 years we had stability in the country, and it was growing at a steady rate, then Reagan came along with his tax cuts and, it took so much away from the government, that he had to use social security funds to come closer to a balanced budget. That's when the tax burden was shifted to the middle class, and then when Bush gave us his tax cut, that was the last straw, the country could not handle it anymore, for 30 years the government let the infrastructure go, because there was no money to keep up with normal maintenance. Wages were stagnated for middle and lower class for 30 years and so there was no way to make up the gap in revenue, so here we are, after 40 years of republican fiscal lunacy, the country is broken the middle class is all but gone, and the rich are swimming in money, a great way to form a banana republic! When 1% control 50% of the nation's wealth, and have more money than the bottom 90% the gap is so severe, this is what has caused revolutions, and not the astro turf ginned up tea baggers,
I mean like the French revolution, if you study history, you will note that the gap between the haves, and the have not's, was right where we are today!
So maybe we should break out the guillotine and start offing the heads of the tyrants that put us here.

[Jamo]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

For almost 40 years we had stability in the country, and it was growing at a steady rate, then Reagan came along with his tax cuts and, it took so much away from the government, that he had to use social security funds to come closer to a balanced budget. That's when the tax burden was shifted to the middle class, and then when Bush gave us his tax cut, that was the last straw, the country could not handle it anymore, for 30 years the government let the infrastructure go, because there was no money to keep up with normal maintenance. Wages were stagnated for middle and lower class for 30 years and so there was no way to make up the gap in revenue, so here we are, after 40 years of republican fiscal lunacy, the country is broken the middle class is all but gone, and the rich are swimming in money, a great way to form a banana republic! When 1% control 50% of the nation's wealth, and have more money than the bottom 90% the gap is so severe, this is what has caused revolutions, and not the astro turf ginned up tea baggers,
I mean like the French revolution, if you study history, you will note that the gap between the haves, and the have not's, was right where we are today!
So maybe we should break out the guillotine and start offing the heads of the tyrants that put us here.

Grammar still sucks, but now we're running into a math problem...

"40 years of stability" (pre-Reagan)

"30 years of infrastructure failing/wage stagnation" (post-Reagan)

"40 years of Republican fiscal lunacy"

Reagan was President from 1981-1989.

So, the "40 years of stability" you're talking about must have run from 1941 to 1981, which includes the trauma of WWII, the Korean War and Viet Nam, not to mention the Cold War, the 60s, Plato's Retreat and bad hair (I'm not counting big bell bottoms, the Gas Crisis or assorted other "stabilizing" scenarios).

"30 years of failing infrastructure/wage stagnation" must've run from 1989 to 2019, which includes 8 years of Clinton and 9 months of Obama, with 10 years to go.

"40 years of Republican fiscal lunacy." Hmmmm....Reagan (8 years) plus Bush I (4 years) plus Bush II (8 years) adds up to 20 years. I guess Clinton (8 years) just doesn't count?

What followed the "wonderful" French Revolution? Anarchy and a short Corsican.

One more assinine post and you're gone forever. The rest of us here deserve better than this.

[Dan40]

Originally Posted by cobra bill

For almost 40 years we had stability in the country, and it was growing at a steady rate, then Reagan came along with his tax cuts and, it took so much away from the government, that he had to use social security funds to come closer to a balanced budget. That's when the tax burden was shifted to the middle class, and then when Bush gave us his tax cut, that was the last straw, the country could not handle it anymore, for 30 years the government let the infrastructure go, because there was no money to keep up with normal maintenance. Wages were stagnated for middle and lower class for 30 years and so there was no way to make up the gap in revenue, so here we are, after 40 years of republican fiscal lunacy, the country is broken the middle class is all but gone, and the rich are swimming in money, a great way to form a banana republic! When 1% control 50% of the nation's wealth, and have more money than the bottom 90% the gap is so severe, this is what has caused revolutions, and not the astro turf ginned up tea baggers,
I mean like the French revolution, if you study history, you will note that the gap between the haves, and the have not's, was right where we are today!
So maybe we should break out the guillotine and start offing the heads of the tyrants that put us here.

Your opinion vs. the FACTS:
NATIONAL DEBT
*rounded to millions
09/30/2008,10,024,724,896,912.49
09/30/2007 9,007,653,372,262.48
09/30/2006 8,506,973,899,215.23
09/30/2005 7,932,709,661,723.50
09/30/2004 7,379,052,696,330.32
09/30/2003 6,783,231,062,743.62
09/30/2002 6,228,235,965,597.16
09/30/2001 5,807,463,412,200.06
09/30/2000 5,674,178,209,886.86
09/30/1999 5,656,270,901,615.43
09/30/1998 5,526,193,008,897.62
09/30/1997 5,413,146,011,397.34
09/30/1996 5,224,810,939,135.73
09/29/1995 4,973,982,900,709.39
09/30/1994 4,692,749,910,013.32
09/30/1993 4,411,488,883,139.38
09/30/1992 4,064,620,655,521.66
09/30/1991 3,665,303,351,697.03
09/28/1990 3,233,313,451,777.25
09/29/1989 2,857,430,960,187.32
09/30/1988 2,602,337,712,041.16
09/30/1987 2,350,276,890,953.00
09/30/1986 2,125,302,616,658.42
09/30/1985 * 1,823,103,000,000.00
09/30/1984 * 1,572,266,000,000.00
09/30/1983 * 1,377,210,000,000.00
09/30/1982 * 1,142,034,000,000.00
09/30/1981 * 997,855,000,000.00
09/30/1980 * 907,701,000,000.00
09/30/1979 * 826,519,000,000.00
09/30/1978 * 771,544,000,000.00
09/30/1977 * 698,840,000,000.00
06/30/1976 * 620,433,000,000.00
06/30/1975 * 533,189,000,000.00
06/30/1974 475,059,815,731.55
06/30/1973 458,141,605,312.09
06/30/1972 427,260,460,940.50
06/30/1971 398,129,744,455.54
06/30/1970 370,918,706,949.93
06/30/1969 353,720,253,841.41
06/30/1968 347,578,406,425.88
06/30/1967 326,220,937,794.54
06/30/1966 319,907,087,795.48
06/30/1965 317,273,898,983.64
06/30/1964 311,712,899,257.30
06/30/1963 305,859,632,996.41
06/30/1962 298,200,822,720.87
06/30/1961 288,970,938,610.05
06/30/1960 286,330,760,848.37
06/30/1959 284,705,907,078.22
06/30/1958 276,343,217,745.81
06/30/1957 270,527,171,896.43
06/30/1956 272,750,813,649.32
06/30/1955 274,374,222,802.62
06/30/1954 271,259,599,108.46
06/30/1953 266,071,061,638.57
06/30/1952 259,105,178,785.43
06/29/1951 255,221,976,814.93
06/30/1950 257,357,352,351.04
06/30/1949 252,770,359,860.33
06/30/1948 252,292,246,512.99
06/30/1947 258,286,383,108.67
06/28/1946 269,422,099,173.26
06/30/1945 258,682,187,409.93
06/30/1944 201,003,387,221.13
06/30/1943 136,696,090,329.90
06/30/1942 72,422,445,116.22

Both Dems and Repubs can take credit/blame for these numbers.