CT registration

[stallion112]

I own a Kellison Stallion that is registered as a 1968 model in North Carolina. Will there be any problems registering this vehicle in CT with things like emmisions, side pipes, noise levels, etc.? Is there a loop hole with the antique plates?
The engine is a 1971 vintage.
Thanks for any input you can provide.
Stallion

[Bob In Ct]

Hey Stallion:
Based on my experience in January of 2001 I would recommend you kill yourself instead.

Bob

[stush]

The emissions is usually not a problem.

Side pipes: need heat shields
Noise: Do not know what the Db limit is but I am sure you are too loud.
Then there is ride height
and the biggest obstacle is you have to trailor it to the inspection location in Weathersfield(cannot drive it even with out of state plates)...and it will almost certainly fail and then when you bring it back after you think you have corrected why it failed the first time, they may find a reason to fail it again...oh and you again need to trailor it there again...other than that it is a breeze. Ditto what Bob said.

Stu

[Todd Hedges]

They will check brake bias, clearances around break lines, fuel lines, etc., that the battery is secure, seat belts, wipers, defroster, high/low beam lights, park brake, steering play, shock quality, end play on wheels, check for loose fasteners.

There are some savvy ways to play with the noise issue.
A tightly coiled piece of 4" wide - wire mesh temporarily secured in the side pipe will cut down on the noise.

The car looks nice from the photos. If everything is tight, secure, and it looks like it was put together by someone with skill, which is 60% of the process. If there are easy pickings for them to find, they will look harder.

Best of luck.
See ya out there.

[joe g]

I recently went though DMV with my Cobra in July. As Bob mentioned killing yourself may be an option. You will get through it, but it will take at least 2 trys. And whatever you do, DON"T argue with them. It's like stirring up a bees nest. My car is a Venom, brand new out of the box. You will have to make an appointment which will be around 3-4 weeks away. They did not use a meter on mine. I have sidepipes that are baffled. If its real loud tame it somehow. I needed side reflectors put on mine, as well as a minor drip from the real seal which was nothing but since we had to come back we changed it. Any drip or drop will catch there eye. If the car is well made they will just do a fairly simple inspection- the more problems they find the harder they look. I must say even though I HATE the DMV the inspectors where mostly decent except for one old guy there. I had to trailer it back the next day which was a pain the ass. I went out bought some stick on reflectors, which i quickly took off after it passed.
And once passed it was to late to register it that day. Expect to spend 1-2 hours waiting in line-- OR get there at 7:30 to stand in line so your firs t at the counter. I'am sure my blood pressure was out of control those 3 days. It got to the point i almost wished i had not bought the car. But once registered that morning and my fist drive ( legally with plates) I was one happy guy.One nice note, the DMV guys for my benefit said MAKE SURE you use your front plate, otherwise you will be a target for the cops to have a reason to stop you.
Good Luck
joe

[Don]

Everyone needs this " experience " at least once in their life, just think of the sense of accomplishment when you receive the CT plates. Some repeats:

* CT DMV would not accept a legally registered, title and Bill of Sale, all notarized, from Wisconsin as a 1966 Ford using the Ford VIN for the Cobra. VIN was on the Cobra. Had to follow the composite " kit car " approach. Bill of Sale was valid for sales tax purposes.
* Reference the DMV publication R-157 Composite Motor Vehicles, follow all the
regulations/specificatioins 100%, no exceptions. Good starting point to verify the inspection items, before going to Wethersfield.
* Cannot use temp plates, must be trailered to Wethersfield where all kit car inspections are performed, by appointment only. Vehicle will be placed on a lift. Brakes are tested
* Did not have any trouble with the sidepipe db level,why I still do not understand, mandatory to have heat shields,
* If previously registered, DMV will check the VIN for theft
* Major drive train components must have individual Bill of Sales as well as the overall Bill of Sale or certificate of origin. I had all documents notarized and stamped with a raised seal.
* Had a nut that was not tight on the front suspension, falied the inspection, had to return with another appointment, could not just get back in line. Took three attempts, the first time the paperwork was incorrect, did not have the individual Bills of Sale for the engine, transmission and rear end
* CT DMV will assign a CT VIN and affix to the door jam, by the Anti Theft Unit. These DMV personnel were extremely considerate on the exact placement to make sure it was straight, centered , etc
* Have a 351W, passing emmisions was not a problem, standard was the least stringent of all the years, for a 1966 engine.
* Year of vehicle will be the year registered and on the registration, called a Composite

..........approach is to be low key, explain, but, best not to get into a discussion as to how the regulations should be applied, or whether the inspectors interpretation is correct, or if other states make the process easier.

GOOD LUCK !!!!!

[Bob In Ct]

Hey Don:
What if your 351W is a new crate, are you still OK on emissions? According to the new Connecticut emissions laws you have to meet emissions for the year of the engine. What if you bought a used car and you don't have receipts for the engine, transmission and rear-end? If you don't have paper for the components you fail.

Also Stallion, when they ask you to put it into 1st and let out the clutch to test the emergency brake, be sure it's not in 3rd! Also, bring a couple of pieces of wood so when the clown geos to jack up your car they don't make a mess of the underside.

Bob

[Don]

Bob:

Have only registered one " composite " in 2000. I mentioned the explanation given to me at that time. Your point on a " new " crate motor would need to be clarified by the DMV. My Bill of Sale for the engine did specify the year of the block, 1966

I failed the first inspection based upon insufficient paperwork, the Cobra was not inspected. Did not have the Bill of Sales for the engine, trnsmission and rear end. The DMV inspector asked why the engine block did not have a serial number, like the VIN. Had to go back to the builder of the Cobra, which fortunately was Don Scott, who was extremely obliging in providing the paperwork and having the documents notarized.

Someone in CT must have experienced the crate motor question as it relates to emmissions ?

[TCR_BRIAN]

Hello all intersted in how CT DMV works....
Hey Joe G!!
I have now been to two inspections at DMV in Wethersfield and both times the have checked different items then the last making it very confusing. Requirements can be downloaded from the website @ www.dmvct.org and do a search for composite vehicle inspection....You will have to make an appointment like Joe explained and expect to be on hold for 45min-1hr. just to talk to someone to make appointment, next as was said it will take 3-4 weeks for the date of the appointment to arrive. When you go you can pull in the left lane (Not the right lane that takes forever and is for all kinds of inspections) Wait for the inspector to call you over. Items that they check first....
*Windshield MUST be DOT AS/1 Certified
*Measure the steering wheel diameter
*Check all lights Horns etc. etc.. Must be DOT...Blinkers + Parking Lights as american cars, also reflectors on sides and rear
*All Switches MUST be labeled....All dash lights, gauges etc must work.....
*Put car on lift and do full undercarriage inspection, cables, lines, hoses must me held on with rubber grommets every so many inches (Outlined in specification booklet)
*Must record Rear Diff #, Transmission #, and Motor #....NOW to Answer the Crate Motor ?, Last car I took had a brand new Ford crate motor, the Inspector wanted to know the VIN it came out of, I said, well it is new, never been in a car, so was never stamped with a VIN on the block, he said OK, gave him a receipt and he said I'll be right back. Came back out looked around a bit and said OK.....Transmission was new and has a number on the plate attached.....Rear end has a plate and comes with car so is covered under MSO......As Far as Emmisions, car must meet 1967 Standards, which is nothing......DB level was not checked, our cars are muffled/baffled and I wouldn't rev it up much when driving it in/in the building.....
*The car's lowest point (Usually oil pan) has to be a minimum of 4 inches....IF YOU SAW THE WAY THEY MEASURED THIS I WAS LAUGHING, THE USED AN OLD EXTENSION CORD AND 2 TAPE MEASURES....We were 3 and 7/8", When I asked inspector how much I had to raise (Not knowing I was watching measurement and overhead them) responded I don't know but it's under 4 inches.....Just wanted to know how much I needed to crank up the coilovers....
*The car then comes off the lift and the E-Brake is checked
*Then the brakes are tested on the Skidpad for balance
*Then you loop around the building again and it is tested for front end alignment (Toe) on a machine that is 3 times my age, but works like a dream.
**As was emphasized before you are at the mercy of the inspector, making comments or asking reasonable questions is frowned upon, take what they say, fix it, and go back and then they can't say anything, they only retest the stuff that failed, also you go back in the same lane, you don't have to wait in the other lane like was told to us one time, and 3 hours later, the same inspector said "You should be in the left lane!" after 3 hours prior said "You need to be in the right lane." I had to bite my tongue off and I think Joe held me back.....Car has to meet 1967 standards....Side reflectors weren't required till 1968, but can you argue this.....NO!!!!!Just have to do it and smile!!!!
**They said our cars were the best they've seen and still we had to go back.....Last car was Toe Alignment (Which they didn't test 1 st time) and ride height...simple adjustment in the parking lot drive through and we had a VIN....IT's really not bad, just preparing you with what I/We have experienced....Plan to make a day or 2 out of it depending on how early you inspection is and what they find wrong.....Both times were different as Joe will remember, some of the stuff I mentioned they didn't test on his car or check and other stuff they did and didn't this last time I went......It's luck of the draw......You will get a 2003 Title or whatever year we are in, and it will be listed as Composite...
If you have anymore questions or need clarifying give us a call (860)225-3184 and I will try to answer or if you want to bring your car down and put it on the lift I might be able to make some suggestions or show you what I mean by what they are looking for, I know that we have passed inspections in CT with Joe's car, and in the beginning of October with another customers car.....So what I have told you should be consistant with what you will see and what they will be looking for.............You will get it through, just listen and put on that smile


Brian
Team-C-Racing
www.teamcracing.com


P.S...351W was not introduced till 1969.....

[Don]

Brian:

Well Done...........only those that have had the thrill and extreme personal satisfaction of being handed the plates for a Composite car registration can appreciate the " experience ", or whatever an appropriate term is.

Will mention again, the two DMV inspectors from the Anti-Theft Unit, checking the paperwork after the DMV safety inspection, were very considerate, understanding and polite individuals. It was with great care, the CT VIN sticker was applied to the door jam after being centered and positioned . They took the time to explain what was being done and the reasons why.

[65cobtacar]

Hello,
I couldn’t help from replying to these posts a positive experience at Motor Vehicle Dept. My inspection time total only 25 minutes, my waiting time was much more. It started in MVD line at 8:30 ( my appointment was for 9:00 ) and started my inspection at 9:50. First thing the inspector ask for was the paper work. I made him a book of copies he would need, seem to make his day a little easier. Next he asked if this was a FFR cobra which I said it is. He replied “ This is going to be a breeze “. Next he checked the my lights, wipers, and etc. Then up on the lift to check the under carriage for workmanship.
And for you other FFR owners he went right to the rear bumper bolt that must be shorten and the gas line in front of the pass compartment that must be rerouted to pass inspection. Next onto the brake pad machine, then a simple E brake test. That’s it for a total of 25 minutes. The Inspector was very friendly and I did not say anything to him, just answered his questions politely.

[era427tp]

This brings up very ugly memories.The people at Wethersfield are idiots.It was an all day experience for me.They flunked me for running toe out which I find makes the car turn better for open track.I refused to "bring it back".After arguing,threatening,and to have these morons threaten to arrest me for not leaving,they relented and called the state engineer.Upon his arrival I got a cheerful "hi" and was told it was a cool car.I had gone to H.S. with the state engineer.........the car passed.

[capfel]

I purposely looked for a Cobra previously registered in CT to avoid this pain. CT MVD is no fun no matter what car you are registering. Either its wrong paperwork, wrong line, etc.

Anyway, I registered my Cobra in June 03 and didn't need an inspection since it previously had a composite VIN. Except, in error the previous CT title used the EM frame VIN, instead of the CT inspector issued VIN. MVD issued my title with the compo VIN.

The only snag was that in Waterbury they wanted me to turn in the "427 SC" vanity plates and re-apply. I instead took them to Wethersfield along with the shiney newly issued plates that I didn't plan to use. Since I had the necessary letter from the previous owner transferring the vanity plates to me, Wethersfield MVD did what I wanted. "Do not cancel regular plates if you are issued vanity plates, they are forever linked"

The car is registered as a 1995 Composite and needed no inspection. Luckily it is titled as under 10 years old. I only mounted one plate on it and have no bracket for a front mounted license plate.

On the emissions web site the Compo VIN comes up as "not on file". I think it's exempt as a specialty vehicle although the engine is a 1968 428FE and could exempt for other reasons.

[RENEW1]

All these replies again confirm what I have always experienced at CT DMV, it depends upon the personality of the inspectors and your reaction to any questions. My ERA289FIA went through with no problems. The only question asked was " Did the seat belt anchor bolts go into the frame?" I told them yes but the way they go into the frame is not visible from under the car. The only thing that was interesting is you drive your car to the building where they put on the VIN tag. I missed the correct building and was driving all over the parking lot. Drew a lot of attention though! I don't know what you guys that are registered are finding on the latest emissions testing but mine won't be until 2007. It wasn't even tested when registered as the program terminated before my first due date.

Rene'

[Don]

65Cobtacar:

Congratulations, there is no doubt that I would be better prepared if there ever is another attempt to register a Composite, having learned from the experience.

Did you have heat shields installed, I did, and was there any mention of the sound level on the side pipes ?

Capfel:

I questioned with the www.ctemissions.com program the need to test a vehicle registered as a 2000 Composite having a 1966 engine. My CT issued VIN is in their system and I have a July 2005 inspection.

Submitted an inquiry and the response received:

At the end of this message is an excerpt from the regulations defining special interest vehicles. It is available electronically and in its entirety at http://www.cga.state.ct.us/2003/pub/...Sec14-164c.htm

However, to re-state, the determination of whether your vehicle needs to be emissions tested is based upon its registration, for example a 1925 Model T with a 1974 engine that is registered as a composite vehicle in 1999 would need to be tested because its registration date is as a 1999 model year. For your particular vehicle, you need to check the registration to determine if you need to bring it in. A letter will be sent to individual motorists notifying them of their test date and providing a complete list of stations. If you are exempt, you will not need a sticker, there are no stickers associated with this program. You can visit on-line after August 22 and run the vin yourself to get your test date, or you can call our hotline at 1-888-828-8399.

Hopefully you will have all the information you need to determine the manner in which you have registered your vehicle. Please, contact us again if we can be of further assistance.
Regards,

The Connecticut Emissions Program.


Sec. 14-1. Definitions. (a) Terms used in this chapter shall be construed as follows, unless another construction is clearly apparent from the language or context in which the term is used or unless the construction is inconsistent with the manifest intention of the General Assembly:...

(2) "Antique, rare or special interest motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle twenty- five years old or older which is being preserved because of historic interest and which is not altered or modified from the original manufacturer's specifications;…

[Lowell W]

We lived in CT for a total of about 11 years altogether on two separate occasions and it sure seems to me that being an A$$HOLE with an axe to grind is almost a prerequisite for working at the CT MVD. Correction: being a stupid A$$HOLE with an axe to grind. An A$$HOLE of normal intelligence with an axe to grind wouldn't use a freakin' extension cord and a tape measure to check ground clearance! I'm sure the guy who told you it was less than 4" didn't actually know how much under 4" 3-7/8" really is. We did run into a few considerate people at the CT MVD from time to time, but, for the most part, it seems the people who really want to flex their $6/hr worth of authority go to work for the MVD or some other branch of state government.

Conversely, every time we moved back here to IL, I was surprised at how smooth, even pleasant the MVD experience could be, to the point of being told, "Here, Honey, just stand over here at the counter and fill this out, then give it back to me," by the lady with the long red fingernails. Yeah, they did lose my paperwork for three months in Springfield, but the local office took care of me in the meantime, and the inspectors were great when THEY CAME OUT TO THE HOUSE TO INSPECT THE CAR!!!

How sad that residents of one state are forced to provide the entertainment for a bunch of angry, insolent, arrogant, envious pr!cks with chips on their shoulders when those of other states are treated with courtesy and respect.

[capfel]

Don:

I checked again and I am still not in the www.ctemissions.com database. This probably is because the title was issued 10/16/03 although I registered in 06/03. It's a 1995 Compo.

Thanks for all your research. Unfortunately it appears I will have to go thru the emissions thing.

My Cobra is a 428FE that runs mildly with a Edelbrock #1406 carb and I do have a PCV valve connected. That is the extent of my emissions equipment.

Any chance of getting exempted as "registered but not designed for highway use"? A thought!

Or, What can be done to help pass? What are the odds of passing?

Chuck

[Bob In Ct]

I was told my SPF would have to meet 2000 emissions since that's the year my car was registered. Since I have no cats or FI the car has no chance of passing. Under the old emissions laws the car was exempt. So now what do I do? The peoples that run the emissoins department are a bunch of a$$holes.

Oops, I've got to run, my neighbor needs my help running his 2 cycle hedge trimmer, his 2 cycle leaf blower, his 2 cycle chain saw and his hydro-carbon belching 6HP riding lawn mower.

Bob

[Don]

capfel & Bob In Ct:

The only remedy that I am aware of is to apply for a wavier. 'If " I understand correctly, spend a minimum of $660 on emissions repairs, possibly fail the free re-test, then apply for and receive a waiver. Or apply for a Functional Waiver, or declare poverty , see below,

When I registered the Cobra in 2000, emissions test was passed very easily, my understanding the standards used were from the 1960's.

For the 351W: ASM Emissions Results:

HC / CO / NO
Max Limit: 484.0 / 5.09 / 3182.0

Tested : 99.4 / 1.99 / 189.3

I retained the original Vehicle Emissions Report, the standards should not have changed, only the vendor to conduct the test. The key might be in finding out where the Max Limit for HC, CO and NO came from that were used in 2000.

The Waiver policy:

Waiver Eligibility

To be eligible for a waiver your repairs must be performed by a Certified Emissions Repair Technician.

Cost - To qualify for a cost waiver, you must spend at least $660 on emission-related repairs (for program year 2003). This figure is linked to the consumer price index and could change annually. The minimum repair cost is for actual repairs made to the vehicle by a state-certified technician, after available emissions-related warranty coverage or written denial of such warranty coverage by the vehicle manufacturer. You must have a receipt for the repairs from a state-certified technician. A written estimate of costs is not sufficient.

Time Extension (Economic Hardship)


You must submit a form supplied by the DMV stating that your annual income is at or below state and federal poverty level guidelines.


Receipt of public assistance - You must submit evidence about all government or utility assistance programs for which you are a beneficiary.


Asset status - You must attest that you have no other assets you could use to pay for the necessary repairs. All information shall remain confidential.


After having received a waiver, a vehicle must pass its next scheduled test before becoming eligible for another waiver.

Functional Diagnosis - You may apply for a diagnostic waiver if diagnosis fails to reveal any problem or there is no evidence to suggest emissions repairs are needed. Your vehicle will then require a functional diagnosis and inspection performed by DMV personnel. You may be granted a waiver if the DMV inspector validates that no additional repairs are required.

[65cobtacar]

Yes, I did install heat shields on the side exhaust pipes, I bought mine from Finish Line. About my sound levels, I installed fiberglass replacement incerts from SuperTrap mufflers and held them in with a funnel shape metal cones. Is was so muffled I didn't think it would even start.
Took them out as soon I got home.