New Member w/CA Reg. Question...Again

[RodKnock]

Hi, everyone. I'm new to the site, but I have loved Cobras since I was very young. I've been a longtime member of the National SAAC and NorCal SAAC, as well as other car clubs such as STOA, CAT, TE/AE and the NCRS.

I've searched through the CC site looking at various past posts for a while now, but I don't see an answer to my potential situation(s). I would like to purchase a Cobra from another state and bring it to CA. There seem to be some very nice Cobras on the market at the moment. One possible purchase involves a car that is complete, but not yet titled, and another possible purchase involves a car that is complete and titled.

1. Am I correct in assuming that the used titled car will have to go through the SB1578 process and the untitled but complete car will have to get an SB100 exemption next January? Are they the same process with different SB #'s?

2. If the car has been titled in another state, is the Certificate of Origin (CO) not needed because it was given up to the other state's DMV when it was originally registered?

3. For the untitled car, if I have the receipts for work done and the CO, are there any other pratfalls I should be aware of in the registration process?

4. I've read about "Titles Unlimited" of Alabama, but there appears to be legitmately registered Cobras from other states with the year "1965" or "1966". In fact some say "Ford Cobra replica", which I realize that it's not a Ford Cobra anything, at least here in CA. On the surface, is this a problem by itself? I know I will have to register the Cobra as a SPCNS in CA, but does it need to have a "2005" or "2006" on the registration certificate?

5. What do I need to do in order to get a TOP after purchase and delivery in CA?

Please bare with me as I get used to the nuances and subtleties of the site.

Thank you.

[xlr8or]

You need to register as SPCNS (special construction) and either be able to pass the smog requirements for the year the car was manufactured or get in line for SB100 so you can be exempted from smog testing based on the year the car replicates or engine block date code.

[RodKnock]

First, thank you for your response. I do realize that I'll be getting in line on that chilly morning of January 2, 2008, but I want to make sure that the car I buy has the proper documentation and that the car is "title-able" (for lack of a better word) in CA?

I know it can't be registered as a 1965 or 1966, but if the block is a 1970 351W, a service block with no date or maybe even an aftermarket Dart block, doesn't the SB100 exemption make the car registerable in CA regardless of engine block or date of manufacture?

Thank you.

[Terry Brown]

I'm not an expert but this should get you close:

1. Am I correct in assuming that the used titled car will have to go through the SB1578 process and the untitled but complete car will have to get an SB100 exemption next January? Are they the same process with different SB #'s?

A. The bills are intermingled. 1578 added wording to allow "previously registered" vehicles to meet the requirements for SB100. (as an aside, I appeared before the Calif. Senate Transportation Committee with Sen. Johannessen to give testimony on the necessity of this modification for those of us who were previously registered incorrectly).

2. If the car has been titled in another state, is the Certificate of Origin (CO) not needed because it was given up to the other state's DMV when it was originally registered?

A. Can't help on this one.

3. For the untitled car, if I have the receipts for work done and the CO, are there any other pratfalls I should be aware of in the registration process?

A. You will probably have to get a "vehicle bond" (to protect the people of California!) at a cost of 1 to 1 1/2% of the total vehicle cost. Make sure to have all your receipts to prove the value of your car. You must also be careful in reading the definition of Special Constructed Vehicles - you may have a great deal of difficulty if the roller AND engine were installed by the same dealer. If the roller came from ERA or SPF and you installed the engine or Joe, the mechanic down the street did, no problem it will meet the requirements.

4. I've read about "Titles Unlimited" of Alabama, but there appears to be legitmately registered Cobras from other states with the year "1965" or "1966". In fact some say "Ford Cobra replica", which I realize that it's not a Ford Cobra anything, at least here in CA. On the surface, is this a problem by itself? I know I will have to register the Cobra as a SPCNS in CA, but does it need to have a "2005" or "2006" on the registration certificate?

A. Some states apparently allow the registration of replicas as the year they represent. In California your SPCNS will show the model date as the ACTUAL date of manufacture, i.e. 2001 SPCNS, etc. Any vehicle with a model year different than the year manuafuctured is incorrectly registered.

I'm sure DMV can answer your questions about how to deal with out-of-state replicas registered as "1965" or "66"

5. What do I need to do in order to get a TOP after purchase and delivery in CA?

A. From what I read from others it's a coin-toss on TOPs. It seems to depend on the DMV office and the DMV clerk. I could give you a "common sense" answer but, in dealing with DMV, it may not be correct. Over the last few years DMV is slowly getting up to speed with SPCNS. You might do a search on CC on 1578 & 100 from this year. See which DMV offices were the most knowledgeable and helpful, and then find one close to you.

Remember, you don't have to jump through all the hoops if your vehicle meets smog requirements. You wouldn't have to wait for the "500."

Hope that helps a bit. Although it's a pain, at least now there is a way to legally register the vehicle. Clear as mud?

You can also email CC member "Morgester" who is an AG with the State. I believe he has been tasked with "fixing" the whole problem!!! ;-)

[RodKnock]

Terry, thank you.

In one of your answers, it sounded as if the titled car would be easier to register in CA than the untitled car. Do you think that is the case? Is the bond only needed for the untitled car? If a bond is needed, does the bond stay with the car for the life of the car and while it remains registered in CA?

If the CO for the titled car was surrendered at the other state's DMW, how would you determine the year of manufacture (assuming it says 1965 or 1966 and not 2001 or 2005)? Do I get a copy from the manufacturer?

As an FYI, the cars that I'm considering for purchase were sold as a roller (or body and frame) and subsequently finished by Joe The (Hopefully Competent)Mechanic.

Everyone, I apologize for all the questions. Thanks.

[jdog]

Why not just look for a currently registered car in Cali? There are probably several for sale and you could be driving this year.
Jan 2 2008 is a long ways away!

jdog

[RodKnock]

Hi jdog, I've read many of your past posts. They've helped me. Unfortunately, all the cars that I'm interested in buying are all located out of state. Mostly back East.

[xlr8or]

What type/brand of car are you looking for?

[jdog]

Have you figured in the $3,000-$5,000 shipping costs from back east?

I am in the middle of going thru the SB100 process right now, if I can help in any way just ask.

Welcome to the crazyness!

jdog
P.S. Are you from Sac?

[Terry Brown]

1. In one of your answers, it sounded as if the titled car would be easier to register in CA than the untitled car. Do you think that is the case? Is the bond only needed for the untitled car? If a bond is needed, does the bond stay with the car for the life of the car and while it remains registered in CA?

Ans - Jdog is right. The easy route is a California car already SB100 compliant. If you are near Sacramento, Thudmaster just mentioned he wanted some time away from his SPF which is legally registered-see his photos. You will be jumping through a variety of hoops if you go any other way. Not impossible, just more labor intensive.

Bond - You know, once I got my SB100 number I "round-filed" the bond. The bond is not an issue once the car is Ca. registered.

B.If the CO for the titled car was surrendered at the other state's DMV, how would you determine the year of manufacture (assuming it says 1965 or 1966 and not 2001 or 2005)? Do I get a copy from the manufacturer?

Ans. - Contact the manufacturer for a duplicate CO. California returned mine after registration.

.................................................. ..........

Much easier to contact the seller if you have problems if he/she is 1 or 2 hours away vs 1 or 2 days!!

Good luck!

[cobra de capell]

Here's my experience - I purchased a Cobra from California when I was in AZ - it had been registered as a 1965 Ford in CA, so AZ decided it was a 1965 Ford, so that's how it was registered.

I moved to CA, went to the DMV and they decided, once again, it's a 1965 Ford, so that's how it's registered, no smog - minimal fees.

I'd say, therefore, it would be best to buy a Cobra that is registered as long as there was no funny business to get it registered as a 60's vehicle, just to avoid DMV fees. Of course, finding and buying a car that is already registered in CA is the best bet.

One additional thing - pet peeve - when I purchased the Cobra from AZ there was no sales tax or use tax - none, zero, but if one lives in CA, there is always sales or use tax. CA gets you at every turn when it comes to tax.

[Got the Bug]

Hey RodKnock,

Look for a California car, I need to eliminate as much competition for SB 100 registrations as possible in 2008 .

In your post, you mentioned that "As an FYI, the cars that I'm considering for purchase were sold as a roller (or body and frame) and subsequently finished by Joe The (Hopefully Competent)Mechanic."

If a car you're looking at has never been titled but is being sold as a complete car (i.e. demo Superformance), you're going to need to have separate receipts for the roller and engine/install and CO to present at the DMV.

Good luck with the search.

[RodKnock]

Terry, I belong to one other Forum for a different type of car and CC wins hands down as the friendliest site. That's for sure and by a long shot. Thank you everyone.

xlr8or, the type of Cobra that I'm interested in is the Kirkham, but I will never give an absolute. Minds can be changed. It seems all the Kirkhams, yours excluded of course, are back East.

jdog, you bet I know I have to figure in the cost of shipping, but for other types of cars, I've gotten estimates at 2,000 +/-. By the way, aren't you finished with the SB100 process?

Got the Bug, I'm always up for a little competition (I'm new, I don't know how to do a smilie face yet). If I'm successful in purchasing a Cobra, I propose we do it together since I'm just on the other side of 17 from you.

cobra de capell, yep, I know all about the CA "use" or "sales" tax. I've budgeted for that too. It's line item #3, right after shipping cost.

Terry, I'm told that I should listen closely to you and I will. Thanks.

After a telephone conversation with a CC member, I'm not sure if it's proper etiquette to give him his due here or not, I feel warm and fuzzy about the "sequence" process. I can't wait to start posting technical questions instead of registration questions.

Here's another one I'll throw out. Are all Ford blocks dated, including service blocks? If there's no date, then what would "they" use say for a 390 or 428? The every two-year smog thing in CA, assuming no dual carbs or radical cam, seems like a viable alternative.

Thank you.

[jdog]

Not thru with SB100 process yet. I drew SPCNS#2007203 last Jan, Yahoo!

Everything from here on is almost a 'formality'. CHP for a Vin #, and BAR for a model year & smog check. The SB100 number makes it a slam dunk! I just haven't gotten around to it yet.

BAR is the "they" that determines what year your car is. I was told service blocks were a bit of a fly'er. "They" could use the earliest or the last year that the service block was used on. It somewhat depends on the BAR agent you get.

jdog
P.S. I'm glad you got some help from my prior posts. My mother always said that even though I do things the 'wrong way' I can still serve a good purpose, as a bad example & a warning to others.

[Powershift1038]

I live in California and just recently got my SPF car from Washington state. It had been registered, and titled, on the road there since 2001. But, bringing it into Calif I have to start the SB 100 stuff. I got my VIN verified by the CHP.. and am running my car around on TOP's until next Jan. Yup, it would have been easier to find a Calif car with the SB 100 already... but like you, I found a car I really like out of state. Is it Jan '08 yet?? LOL

[Got the Bug]

Hey RodKnock,

I sent you an email through CC regarding some of the SB100 stuff that I've collected so far.

2007 is going to be all about patience...must keep busy....stop daydreaming of Cobra...work hard...make dollars to pay for new toy....

[RodKnock]

Got the Bug,

I did not receive your email via CC. Does it come to my normal email address or do I pick it up through CC somehow?

Another question for everyone. I've read that some people going through this process get multiple TOP's during the year to get them to January of the following year. Then some just get one that has a "12" or December on it. Is this true and, if so, is it due to the subjectivity of the CA DMV employee that we get when we approach the "Line 13" window?

Thank you.

[jdog]

California TOP's are 60 day affairs. You'll have to go back and re-beg every 2 months. You'll need a good reason each time (and a little luck).

In Oct, you'll get a "12"!

jdog

[Got the Bug]

RodKnock - The email should have been sent to address that you used to register on CC. I received a message from CC that the email had been delayed. I just tried to re-send it to you (email address starts w/ RME........@aol.com ?)

[xlr8or]

When using SB100 to determine smog test requirements the car owner gets to pick whether they want to use the year the car replicates or the year of the engine block. I believe you will find all production blocks with date codes in the casting. It's easiest with a Cobra to go with year the car replicates as most 427 cars are modeled after the 1965 year and only a PCV is required.