CSX4753 help with brakes

[CSXBill]

I purchased CSX47xx and had it delivered today. The brakes are terrible. The pedal is rock hard and you have to push a lot to get the car stop. It won’t lock the tires up. Really, it’s not safe. Could someone please explain the braking system so I can try to figure out where to start. I don’t see a regular brake booster. So how do they work? Thanks!

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by CSXBill

I purchased CSX4753 and had it delivered today. The brakes are terrible. The pedal is rock hard and you have to push a lot to get the car stop. It won’t lock the tires up. Really, it’s not safe. Could someone please explain the braking system so I can try to figure out where to start. I don’t see a regular brake booster. So how do they work? Thanks!

They are not power brakes. Neither was mine "two feet on the pedal" brakes. They are "man's brakes" though. Ie, it's not just moving the toes from the accelerator to the brake pedal, you need to move your foot over and apply steady pressure. Are you sure they are "broken" vs. just tougher than what you are used to?

I'd suggest that since you are asking the questions you are asking that a brake shop would be in order.

(PS. When the Cobra set the 0-100-0 record of 13.8 seconds word was that Miles actually did use both feet on the brakes and that more of the time was spent braking than accelerating.)

[CSXBill]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

They are not power brakes. Neither was mine "two feet on the pedal" brakes. They are "man's brakes" though. Ie, it's not just moving the toes from the accelerator to the brake pedal, you need to move your foot over and apply steady pressure. Are you sure they are "broken" vs. just tougher than what you are used to?

I'd suggest that since you are asking the questions you are asking that a brake shop would be in order.

(PS. When the Cobra set the 0-100-0 record of 13.8 seconds word was that Miles actually did use both feet on the brakes and that more of the time was spent braking than accelerating.)

I’m sure it’s not right. I’ve owned other non-power braked cars and these are just rock hard. No movement on the pedal, even with my 250lbs pushing hard.

I’ll take it to a brake shop. But what type of system is it? I don’t see a brake setup under the hood.

Thanks

[Anthony]

Your pads may be bad, whether you can shave them, or just buy new pads. May need to scuff up the rotors a little ?

[LMH]

Some times with these cars, owners will use comp brake pads which don't work well on a street car. They won't get hot enough. Might be something to look at.
Larry

[twobjshelbys]

The CSX should have two fluid reservoirs, as I recall they are near the fender on the driver's side. One is for clutch, the other for brakes.

The CSX brakes were more than adequate.

Check fluid and possibly bleed them.

When was the car built? Has brake fluid been serviced? Could be cottage cheese by now.

[ERA 626]

The CSX car will have 3 reservoirs. one for clutch, one for front and one for rear on the drivers side fender well. there is no booster lol...

[Tom Kirkham]

What size are your brake master cylinders?
What size are the pistons in your brake calipers?
Can you post pictures?

[CompClassics]

Which brake package do you have on your Cobra, Girling, Baer or Willwood? As Tom had suggested there may be a master cylinder issue or maybe a pad issue. If you opted for the Girling brake package the problem is more than likely the pads, there are several compounds available now from EBC.
I have retrofitted a power brake booster to a 6000 Series Continuation Cobra Ibuilt for a client that had had double knee surgeries that was very happy with the brakes after the install. I have also supplied the same booster to other clients so they could retrofit their Cobras with positive results.

[MKS427]

There's a lot of good advise and options here. I'm also certain the CSX cars all had adequate brakes at delivery and you stated the pedal is solid. I'd recommend having someone else look at the brakes to ensure it's not just the difference between power assist (which I'm assuming you a used to) and manual brakes. My FFR and the wife's GT350 brake pedals are night and day different.

[jhv48]

Just a thought, if your car has been sitting for a long period of time, the original pads might have turned to stone. Or, if your car was set up for racing, the pads might need to be hot before they work properly.
If your pedal is solid, that pretty much rules out the master cylinder and brake fluid.
My first step would be more friendly street pads on all four corners. Easy to do, relatively inexpensive too. Then see what you’ve got.
Once again, as others have said, without a booster, you do need to stand on the pedal for best results. But then, you should be able to lock them up. If you can’t lock em up, sumtingwong.

[CompClassics]

I’ve never heard of brake pads changing their composition from sitting over a period of time unless they may have been subjected to chemicals in some manner.
It is known however that if the Cobra is equipped with the Girling type calipers that the pads that were supplied with the calipers were developed for track applications where there is a lot of heat developed and not street driving, EBC has released at least three different brake material compounds that are much more street applicable.

[CSXBill]

Originally Posted by LMH

Some times with these cars, owners will use comp brake pads which don't work well on a street car. They won't get hot enough. Might be something to look at.
Larry

Thanks, I’ll check that out.

[CSXBill]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

The CSX should have two fluid reservoirs, as I recall they are near the fender on the driver's side. One is for clutch, the other for brakes.

The CSX brakes were more than adequate.

Check fluid and possibly bleed them.

When was the car built? Has brake fluid been serviced? Could be cottage cheese by now.

I see the three black round fluid containers. They aren’t labeled, but I will open and see which one is different color than the other two.

It was built in 2004 in Vegas. I’m not sure if brakes have ever been serviced, so I’ll start by bleeding the system and putting new fluid in.

[CSXBill]

Originally Posted by CompClassics

Which brake package do you have on your Cobra, Girling, Baer or Willwood? As Tom had suggested there may be a master cylinder issue or maybe a pad issue. If you opted for the Girling brake package the problem is more than likely the pads, there are several compounds available now from EBC.
I have retrofitted a power brake booster to a 6000 Series Continuation Cobra Ibuilt for a client that had had double knee surgeries that was very happy with the brakes after the install. I have also supplied the same booster to other clients so they could retrofit their Cobras with positive results.

It has Baer brakes. How hard was the conversion? What did it cost? Thanks!

[CSXBill]

Originally Posted by jhv48

Just a thought, if your car has been sitting for a long period of time, the original pads might have turned to stone. Or, if your car was set up for racing, the pads might need to be hot before they work properly.
If your pedal is solid, that pretty much rules out the master cylinder and brake fluid.
My first step would be more friendly street pads on all four corners. Easy to do, relatively inexpensive too. Then see what you’ve got.
Once again, as others have said, without a booster, you do need to stand on the pedal for best results. But then, you should be able to lock them up. If you can’t lock em up, sumtingwong.

Ok, I’ll change the fluid, bleed them, and put new pads on. Thanks for the advice.

[CSXBill]

I should say the car has just over 2,000 miles on it since it was built in 2004. So it could need some sorting out. When I bought it, the seller went to load it on the transport and it had a fuel leak. The seller was Dennis Collins who has a good reputation for taking care of his customers. He called fuel safe, shipped them the tank and they rebuilt it. It took two months to get it back and I just got the car. I love it, except the brakes. Lol

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by CSXBill

I see the three black round fluid containers. They aren’t labeled, but I will open and see which one is different color than the other two.

It was built in 2004 in Vegas. I’m not sure if brakes have ever been serviced, so I’ll start by bleeding the system and putting new fluid in.

Yes, sorry, there are three.

They will likely have the same fluid. Or at least mine did. DOT 3 as I recall for both brakes and clutch. It sort of doesn't matter - if it hasn't been serviced all of them need changing. (No matter what the fluid is contributing to the problem). Not knowing the service history you should just change everything that runs. If it's liquid, change it.

[t walgamuth]

softer pads will likely do the trick....finding some is a problem though.

[twobjshelbys]

Brake pads don't wear out because they've sat on the car. It's likely the pads that are there were never properly bedded... A good hot run would probably make a world of difference. Change the brake (and clutch, and coolant and rear end and ...) fluids and then bed the brakes you have. You've got nothing to lose and will probably save your self some money and time. I had to run mine because they squeaked and made grinding noises like gravel.