Hydraulic Clutch-Bleeding Help

[Clois Harlan]

Ok one of you guys told me how much fun I was going to have bleeding my hydraulic clutch and I just want you to know that I am having too much fun already.

Question is? Do these things ever bleed out without starting the engine?

First I bench bled the master cylinder then I started bleeding the hydraulic throwout bearing and finally I got what I think is all the air out but I still don't have any pedal. What am I doing wrong?

I don't think this matters but I have installed a 428 CJ with a toploader. As many of you know there is not much room for a conventional throwout bearing arm so I went with the Hydraulic t/o bearing but I don't know if this thing will ever pump up.

[aeroace]

Is the bleeder line on the top of the TO, not the bottom? What's the diameter and travel of the clutch master's piston? Make sure the volume of fluid is sufficient, but not too much so as to overextend the TO. Vacuum bleeders work well for hydraulic TO's. Fill the resevoir, suck it almost empty with a vacuum bleeder at the TO. do this three times, then get a helper for pressure bleeding(traditional, you pump and hold, I open the screw and close before the pedal is released). The hydraulic TO's need to be adjusted prior to install to set the clearance to the clutch fingers. .100" is perfect with the TO fully compressed.I've done a hundred of these on Cobras alone, if this doesn't answer your questions, email me.

[Clois Harlan]

Thanks Aerorace

The bleeder line is on the top and I have made all the adjustments and they are actually set at .100 but I did not use a vaccuum to bleed the bearing. Off to NAPA or O'Reilly tomorrow. If this doesn't work I will email you. This is my first experience with a hydraulic T/O bearing. Thanks for your input.

[cobralee]

Hope you figured out your pedal pressure problem. If not, I had the same problem with my hydraulic clutch. It turned out that I didn't have my throwout bearing all the way in when installing it. So, after bleeding, it had no effect on the throwout bearing.

Otherwise, check to make sure you have the correct line as the bleeder as others have advised. I have a McLeod bearing and didn't need a vacuum to bleed it out, just a helper.

[Clois Harlan]

Cobralee and Aeroace

Well I am back and have spent four hours under the car yesterday and today and still no pedal. Getting very frustrated!

Cobralee, by the way I have the successor to your LA Exotics replica, Bryan Anderson and Barrry McGill moved that operation out here about five years ago and it is now called B&B Manufacturing 417-472-3547. How did you know that you didn't have your bearing in all the way when you installed yours? I tried to compress mine as much as I could by hand when I put it in and since I had never done this before I didn't know how far it had to go. Looked as though it was in all the way. Sure don't want to pull that toploader again...!

Any advise on an easy way to try to compress the bearing with the transmission in the car?

Thanks for everyones help.

Clois Harlan

[cobralee]

Clois-

First, my symptoms were that when depressing my clutch pedal, I couldn't shift into or out of any gears, although the clutch pressure felt appropriate. We did end up having to pull the trans and I recall that the actual bearing itself was protruding out very little. We did not think it was enough, but apparently it was. I guess that the amount of space it was protruding takes away from the distance needed to depress the clutch. I think we just used our foot power to make sure it was all the way in. You can use an airhose to shoot through the line to have it come out all the way to see how far it does protrude. But that was the answer. Just make sure you follow the measurements provided, which sounds like you have. If this is a McCleod bearing, they have a tech line you can call during certain hours of the day. They're very helpful. If you need the number, let me know and I'll try to dig it up. Before pulling the trans, I would talk with them first just to make sure theres not something else you're missing.

Regarding L.A. Exotics and B&B, I purchased my Cobra from a guy that said it was 70% completed. Actually, it was so poorly done, we had to pull everything apart and put everything back together again. Thats when I met Bryan Anderson and he was extremely helpful in letting me come down to his place of business, take pictures of how things were put together, gave me alot of advise and information and he did some fitting of doors and trunk lid for me. Since budget was always focused on, Bryan had made up these wheels to look like Halibrands. They are a two piece wheel, steel with an aluminum center piece held on with a knock off. I had these polished and even though I always wanted and periodically consider Halibrands for authenticity, I love the look of these wheels.

Good Luck on your T/O bearing. I've had mine on for about 9 years with no maintenance and it works just fine.

I replied to your email, but AOL says no known member.

Thanks,

Ron

[Bob Putnam]

Clois,

Any luck yet? If not, a few questions.

Is your clutch fluid reservoir above the level of the master and slave cylinder?

Does the hose from the master to the slave make a loop up (above the level of the master and slave)?

Have you actually checked whether the slave is extending or not?

[renaissance man]

If your transmission is out of the car, measure from the outer edge of the bell housing to the tips of the fingers on the pressure plate. This is the measurement that must coorespond to within .125" or 1/8" of the measurement from "the face of your transmission to the face of the hydraulic piston as the piston is completely closed or pushed in". You may need to push it in by hand. You will need to add 1" to this measurement to determine the length of the hydraulic piston as it is fully extended. This is what will engage the fingers on the pressure plate.

There is only one line that hangs off of the car for bleeding the clutch. Have someone sit in the car, pump the clutch 4-5 times then hold it in. While they are holding the clutch down, crack the fitting on the bleeder and it will sputter for a second or two then it will have a bit of fluid come out of it. Catch it in a small cup or bowl. The clutch pedal will go to mush for the person operating it. Quickly close the bleeder. Repeat this 5-10 times perhaps until all of the air is out of the line. You'll only lose about 1/4 cup of fluid. As long as the fluid in the master cylinder remains above the lines that it is feeding you'll be ok. You can then top it off when you are done.

Most important is the measurement from the fingers of the pressure plate to the bell housing and compare it to the measurement from the face of the tranny to the face of the closed hydraulic cylinder. You Do Not have to start the engine to do this.

I just went through this myself and had David Kee come up and give me the crash course on Hydraulic clutches. If you need to, you are welcome to drop me an email and I'll send you my phone number and perhaps I can help you out here.


renaissance.man@cox-internet.com

Regards,

[Clois Harlan]

I have bleed the brg in fact it will gravity bleed if left open from the top hose. My thoughts are that I may have it adjusted back too far, preventing it from engaging the fingers. I tried to rotate the brg fwd w/o removing the tranny but it would not turn in enough. I am going to first try to move the fingers w/ air pressure to see if it is engaging or moving in and out before I remove the transmission.

I had planned to finish everything this weekend but I don't believe it will happen with family demands and all.

Thanks for everyones help! I know I will get there I just hope I haven't made it more difficult than it should be by second guessing some of my earlier assembly decisions.

[Ratsnake]

Clois,
In case you're still not having any luck with your clutch problem, I had the same problem with mine after I pulled the trans for some work. The only way I could get mine fully bled was to gently pressurize the reservoir with air from my compressor and opening the bleed screw. Be sure to monitor the fluid level in the reservoir and not let it run dry.
Good luck!

Tom

[Clois Harlan]

Finally resolved my problem. I spoke to Red Roberts at McLeod and he believes my bearing may have been setting on the shelve at PAW for some time causing the bearing O-Ring seals to dry out. Sure enough when I actuated the bearing with air and lubricated the o-rings everything began to work properly. I hooked up the hose from the master cylinder to the T/O Brg and tested it with my foot clutch. I Works!!

Tomorrow I will put everything back in the car and hopefully I will have my hot rod back on the road this weekend. The weather has been so nice here the last few weeks (70 +) and the Cobra and me have been hosed up in the garage. Today we got snow. Go figure.

Thanks for everyones continued help. You know what they say? Sometimes the best laid plans will fall through too.

Talk to everyone when I get it going this weekend.

[cobralee]

Clois-

Great news. Hope that was the problem.

Ron