No Oil Pressure

[Frank Coppola]

Here is the deal. I just installed an oil cooler and now I don't have any oil pressure. I put plenty of oil in the system, filled the filter and the radiatior. There was oil pressure before (70-80psi) but now ZERO. I can hear pressure release if I detach a line from the cooler.

Here are my questions.

1- How much damage did I do by running the motor for exactly 2 minutes without oil pressure, but plenty of oil in the motor.

2- Could it be that I have the lines coming off the block adapter reveresed? I am 90% sure I have them on the correct way.

3- How do I fix this?

Thanking you in advance,

Frank "I feel stupid" C.

[ERA535]

Make sure that the cooler is not plugged. If it has been sitting in your garage for a while without caps it could have some critter homes in it.

Running your engine for a few (very few) minutes without oil pressure PROBABLY won't cause a problem - after all it was not under load - right?

The fact that you can hear pressure release means to me that the cooler is plugged with something.

Next time shut it off sooner when you don't see any pressure. You should see movement of the needle within 2 or 3 seconds of startup.

Good luck!

[Bill Wells]

are the cooler lines reversed ? B

[ERA535]

I don't think that oil coolers really care which way the flow goes - at least I have never seen one that was marked in or out.

[Jeff Frigo]

Frank:


It sounds like you have the lines reversed. As far as damage goes by running the engine with no pressure for 2 minutes, I would pull the pan off and check the number 1, 3, and 5 main bearnings, and a couple of the rod bearings. My buddy did the same thing and his bearings were showing copper instead of babbit.

[poorboy]

Frank;
It shouldn't make any differance which way you run the oil threw the cooler. Did you install a remote oil filter at the same time, or change the lines? The filter has a check valve in it. Did you change from a standard filter to a hi-performance one. The standard filter usualy has just a flap for a check valve that most oil pumps can overcome. Some filters have a steel check ball that the pump cannot unseat during reverse flow.

Poorboy

[Bob Putnam]

In case you've got a remote oil filter...

[RACER X #99]

You probably reversed the lines on the remote filter.which means for 2 minutes you ran without pressure. Not good. Probably ought to drop pan and check as Jeff suggests. Next time prelube engine before starting.
Cranky

[Frank Coppola]

and the answer is.......


The lines were reversed. The check valve on an HP-1 filter completely stops reverse flow. I have no idea how I messed this up. I thought for sure the cooler, or the lines were plugged as I thought I had installed it correctly.

I haven't removed the pan or the valve covers yet, but will get to that next weekend before I start the motor. I'll let you know.

thanks for the help!

[ERA535]

Before you pull the pan! Drain the oil out and check it for any bearing material. If it is clear you should be ok.

[Bill Wells]

ERA 535...read your prior post...you sure your answer is right ? just checking. Bill.

[ERA535]

Bill:

About oil coolers - they don't care about flow direction

About draining the oil and checking for bearing material - that is what I would do - or you could start it up and listen very carefully for any kind of knocking.....but I would bet money that it is OK. If you do hear any knocking, running it briefly isn't going to cause much more damage than you already have.

You could also cut the oil filter apart and look for bearing material after you run it for a bit.

Bill - this is my opinion based on years of building race engines for myself.

If I had an engine building business I would take the pan off and look. I guess all it is going to cost to do that is time and a few pan gaskets.

Good luck.

[Mark IV]

A friend with a Caterham 7 did the same thing, he was prepared to pull the pan and look at the bearings however in one of my rare lucid moments during his frantic "how bad have I screwed it up" phone call, I suggested he send a sample of the oil out for anaylsis. The results....NO bearing material in the oil. Worth the time and money if you really don't want to pull the pan and go that route.

Might be worth a try.

Rick

[Lubrecon]

Oil anlysis is a good idea. Do a spectrographic analysis and look for iron, copper, lead, and tin. They will all be there, but if everythig is ok, the ppm levels should be low. Ask the lab for allowable levels and go from there. Be aware however, a spectro only sees particles below about 8 microns and soluble metals. If you really damaged the bearings or journals(crank, rod, main, cam, etc), spectro will not see that and you could do more damage. In short, if it was mine, I would do an analysis and pull the pan and a couple of bearing caps. Don't forget the cam, it is the last to get pressured lubricaton, and could have been damage the most. If the analysis shows high wear metals and the bearngs are ok, then the cam has taken a hit.

My $.02

[427Aggie]

Just a warning for those that do say that coolers and adapters don't care what way the oil flows.

Thats correct but there are a few (and the ford motorsport filters are one) that do have a check valve in the filter and if you don't have the lines correct then no oily oily...we just found this out with an ERA here in Dallas that some guys were working on.

Matt

[Frank Coppola]

The cooler can flow both ways, the filter does not.

The eternal optomist that I am, I am going for the notion that the motor isn't screwed up after running it for exactly 2 minutes under no load, with a full oil pan but no pressure. I'm going to change the oil, and remove the valve cover gaskets before I make a decision on dropping the pan.

Any of you other optomists please feel free to chime in as I am still in a mild state of panic.

[CobraEd]

Didn't the Model-T use splash oiling only back in the old days? If thats the way they drove those cars all over, you might be ok considering you were only ideling for a couiple of munutes. The oils now and days have extremely strong film strength. At idle, you dont develop too much pressure. What is your oil pressure now thst you corrected the flow? Is it ok?

Ed

[poorboy]

Frank;
I know another cobra owner that did the same thing on a brand new engine. He then drove it over 50 miles before he even hooked up the oil pressure guage, then no oil pressure. After he changed the lines he has driven it around 1000 miles with no trouble. I know of another one that was driven at a track event, turned up to tight, bent 13 push rods. This one had Motocraft oil filters on it, they let the oil back flow though them. after I repaired the push rods & rocker arms, changed oil used Hi performance Motocraft, NO OIL Pressure, the lines had been reverested by the builder from the start. Changed lines, everything has been fine sence.
I would drain the oil and look. If everything looked ok I would drive it.

Poorboy

[ERA535]

Here's the best one of all!!!!

Did it knock before you shut it off??

If it did, it isn't going to fix itself-----if it didn't, Lady Luck may smile on you yet!

Good luck!

[Frank Coppola]

CobraEd- I won't know about the pressure until Saturday when I get a chance to work on it again. (This trying to make a living stuff gets in the way during the week)

Poorboy & ERA535, The motor ran perfectly for those now infamous 2 minutes. As soon as I change the lines, change the oil, start it up, check the pressure, down the celebratory-everythings-ok beer, I'll let you know what happened.

Nice to know I am not the only dummy to have done this. I still can't figure out how I did it, I must have looked at the billet fitting for the block a half dozen times before I connected the lines.

Lesson learned: Physically test EVERTHING before running it.