spf w/ willwoods brake squell--help

stevewrm · #1 (**permalink**) 08-04-2002, 11:01 PM

i have 1300 miles on spf 1383 and have developed a brake squell. started around 500 miles and occured when coming to a slow stop w/ light pressure on pedal. would not happen w/ heavy pressure. now has squell when drive car cold --first mile or so --and no braking pressure--low speed.--this in addition to squell when braking. i have tried to fix w/heavy high speed braking--didnt work. any ideas?

other than brake problems i love the car--have had minor issues which the great staff at dynamic and eric at performance have talked me through.

i do have what i feel is excessive drivetrain "clunking" when rpm
under 2000 and no load. i have had rear end in air and seems to be a fair amount of play when you rotate a wheel back and forth.
I'm not a expert on this stuff and dont know what is normal.

ps this is a 418 build by by eric at PE. dyno'd at 525hp and was
hot and humid. engine runs fantastic--very streetable.

Mr.Fixit · #2 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 09:18 AM

The "clunking" is normal, there are 6 U-joints and the backlash on the ring and pinion gear all right there for you to hear. As far as the disk brake squeal, just get some of the "disk brake quiet" spray glue and attach the pads to the pistons. The willwoods don't have spring clips to keep the pads from chattering around in the calipers.

bmalone · #3 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 10:21 AM

I have heard (not tried for myself) that kevlar pads will stop the squeal. Fixit, any comment?

My pads did squeal quite a bit when I first got the car. I changed out all the brake fluid, bled the brakes, and keep the resovoir topped off; that has helped. Why, I have no idea. Fixit, any idea?

Mr.Fixit · #4 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 10:52 AM

Bill. I have no idea why that worked for you. Usually it's the pad dust that gets everywhere and lets the pads chatter in there at a high frequency (squeaking). Maybe you flushed off that dust with brake cleaner or compressed air. Changing pad material will change the composition of the offending dust, and they may not squeak with a different pad. Lots of guys run the "coldstopper tan" pads, I like the more agressive compounds that make your wheels dirty faster.

bmalone · #5 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 11:01 AM

Fixit, that could be. I remember that for both front beeders I had to remove the screw entirely--consequently brake fluid all over the inside of the wheels. The backs worked normally, just loosened them and pulled the fluid into a jar I made w/ rubber hose. Maybe just blowing the air off them from time to time will help. Thanks.

Slide · #6 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 11:44 AM

I'll jump in here. I have willwood superliteIII's in front and dynalites in back with tan cold stoppers. They squeel only near a stop not at high speed and are worse when warm. I have used the disk brake quiet spray from napa and beveled the leading edges to no avail. I can not tell for sure which wheels are makeing noise or if they all are. Willwood had no good suggestions. If your brakes quiet down after bleeding you may have had air in the line that expanded and caused exsessive drag when driveing. I am getting ready to change all my pads but I 'm not sure if that will help. I'm open to all suggestions.

bmalone · #7 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 11:51 AM

Clyde, have you heard anything about using kevlar pads?

coyled · #8 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 12:08 PM

Those are more of a race type caliper. Willwood allows some room in there for expansion and contraction under severe conditions. Hence, the pad is not ever tight. That is why they squeek under light brakeing but not on firmer brakeing. I have tried several pads to no evail plus spray etc... I think we are stuck with the squeek. scott

Roscoe · #9 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 12:56 PM

I have Wilwoods in the front and explorers in the rear. I just installed Porterfield R4-S Carbon Kevlar pads. No squeal, low dust, rotor friendly and they are nice and grabby. Used them at Pocono Raceway and performed very well.

http://www.porterfield-brakes.com/

Roscoe

bmalone · #10 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 01:01 PM

Thank you, Roscoe.

Roscoe · #11 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 01:03 PM

Just remember to follow the instructions and bed the pads properly. You have to heat cycle them starting at low speeds and working your way up faster and faster.
Roscoe

Mr.Fixit · #12 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 01:26 PM

Also,

Often the original installer doesn't get the calipers shimmed properly to keep the caliper's and rotor's axis parallel. Willwood's come with a bunch of really thin washers used to shim the caliper into proper alignment with the rotor. Not sure if this would effect squeaking or not, but one more thing for you guys to look at when you have your heads down there.

Wayne Maybury · #13 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 03:20 PM

I have read this thread with some interest since I have just purchased a Wilwood front end kit and have not yet installed them but I do have a couple of questions.

Firstly, Wilwood states about 20 times that these brakes are not for street use, racing or off road use only, etc. I figure that there are 2 possible reasons for this, either legal stuff in the case of an accident they are in the clear, or the pads that come with the kit only work after being heated up significantly, therefore not suitable for the street. Any ideas?

Secondly, there are 4 bleeders on each Dynalite II caliper but no open inlet for the fluid. Obviously it will be necessary to remove at least one bleeder (on the bottom) to attach the break line. I want to know if it is necessary to have a "T" in my brake line and therefore connect to both sides of the caliper or do I simply connect to one side and there is an internal connection to the other side. The installation instructions don't say anything about a T.

Wayne

Mr.Fixit · #14 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 04:12 PM

The calipers usually have a hardline linking the two side together, on the caliper, from the factory. "Not for street use" probubly for liability reasons, possibly not DOT approved everywhere.

Slide · #15 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 07:12 PM

Wayne. I have the billet dynalite and it has a standard 1/8-27 NTP inlet on the side of the caliper and there is a cross-over either internal or external. I am sure even with dynalite II you do not connect your brake line to to a bleeder inlet. BMalone, Willwood suggested there new Q pad to eliminate noise but I think it is ceramic not kevlar and I know nothing about it's performance, and since their tan pads squeel I may want to try a different brand. I set the calipers and brackets up myself and they are as straight as possible.

Wayne Maybury · #16 (**permalink**) 08-05-2002, 07:50 PM

Slide

I bought the Dynalite II billet calipers and there are no inlets except for the four bleeders, I just went out in the garage to check.

Anyone have an idea if I have to install a "T" in my brake line or is there an in internal connection? The instructions do not mention this point.

Wayne

Mr.Fixit · #17 (**permalink**) 08-06-2002, 08:47 AM

There is NOT ? a 1/8"npt port on the middle of the backside of the caliper between the two pistons, perhaps with a red plastic cap stuck in it? That's where I have always seen them on Willwood's. And what about the stainless hardline pre-bent to link the outside half to the inside half of the caliper? That goes on the bottom two bleeder screw ports I think. I always got new ones that already had it installed.

Bob Putnam · #18 (**permalink**) 08-06-2002, 11:24 AM

Wayne,

I think someone's playing with your head.

I'm sittin' here with a DII in my lap. It's got a crossover pipe on the bottom and a pipe-thread inlet on the bracket (in)side, midway between the pistions.

Roscoe · #19 (**permalink**) 08-06-2002, 11:29 AM

Here is a shot of a Wilwood caliper and you can see the line going in midway on the inside of the caliper.

Roscoe

Wayne Maybury · #20 (**permalink**) 08-06-2002, 04:17 PM

I am travelling on business right now so I can't look at the calipers but yesterday I did take a look and there were four bleeders on each caliper. One on each end of each side. No crossover pipe and I didn't see any other threaded inlet between the pistons. I have the billet Dynalite II calipers. I have assumed that I will have to remove one (or possibly two) of the bleeders and install the inlet line there. Roscoe's caliper appears to not be a billet model, quite different from mine.

I now wonder if I was half asleep

when looking at the calipers. I will get back to you tomorrow evening when back at home.

Wayne