428 purchased in 70's from ford dealer

fordspool · #1 (**permalink**) 04-16-2005, 08:40 AM

A friend of mine bought a 428 motor from a for dealer in 1972
He has the recepit still. He put it in his vehicle in the 70's and removed it last year. It has never been worked on. He then sold the motor as a 428. The person who bought it is now coming back (2 months later) and saying the motor is a 390 bored 40 over. Can anyone help with this ? Did ford use 390 and 428 interchangeable somehow ? We are trying to figure this out.
It was purchased from a ford dealer as a 428 motor. Can anyone point the new owner in a direction to get answers. He is thinking
my friend screwed him so to speak. As far as my friend is concerned he sold the 428 ford had sold him. HELP ...

decooney · #2 (**permalink**) 04-16-2005, 08:48 AM

What are the numbers on the block?

What are the numbers on the crank?

fordspool · #3 (**permalink**) 04-16-2005, 11:51 AM

We saw a ua on the crank , the new owner says he sees a 2 in front of the ua.
some other numbers we saw 2e31 on the oil filter housing,
352a on the back of motor. 53 back of motor, 252618 back of motor, c6ae on the connecting rod bearing caps.
did ford use 390/428 parts together in 428 crate motors in the 70's ? The motor was bought as a 428 FROM FORD !!! any help
would be great . Thanks

decooney · #4 (**permalink**) 04-16-2005, 12:23 PM

From the Big-Block Ford Engines Yellow Book -

2UA crank: Engine, 390. Stroke: 3.784, Mains 2.7488, Rod 2.4384. Says from a 1973-1976 ser. Q80,001 truck

C6AE-? rods: C6 is 1966 connecting rod. Need the ? to know from what is was from, like -A,-B,-D etc.

No match on the other 252618 number? Sounds like a 390 with misc parts, but who knows.
______________________________________________

What is the actual bore size of the cylinders?

Are any numbers on the reciept that match the block, and is the receipt an original or copy of the original? One might conclude the receipt is from something else, or maybe they were sold a 390 instead of a 428. Hard to say how it happened, but seems like its a 390 or built like one at this point. Maybe someone else here can help you more.

I had a 428 block in my last car. It was an actual 427 block machined as a 428. Had cross-bolt bosses, side oiler bosses, numbers, and bored/internals were all 428, and with the less important 66-427 cast on back. Was later informed it was a 66 police interceptor block. I was told twice (after researching it) by Detroit/Ford they did some strange things back then, and not all clear at times. Good Luck.

DAVID GAGNARD · #5 (**permalink**) 04-16-2005, 03:45 PM

I'm no FE expert,actually know very little about them,but back in the 70s and 80s I remember a local machine shop that did buy some Ford remanufactered short and long blocks for some customers and he said he had gotten some "punched out" 390 blocks assembled with 428 internals and sold as a 428!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It certainly could happen,could also be they thought if was a 428 when it actually was a 390,could have been an honest mistake.........

David

Woodz428 · #6 (**permalink**) 04-16-2005, 06:56 PM

Unfortunately,too much time has gone by for any resolution with the dealer, it sounds from the crank # it is a 390 overbored, a Ford re-manufactured engine. From my perspective,your friend should have checked what he had prior to selling it. I think that he should probably refund the guys money, if that's what he wants and sell it as the 390 it appears to be.The current owner bought it from your friend who represented incorrectly, regardless of whether he bought a "428" from a dealer or not. I feel your friend is the one that portrayed the engine to the buyer and is the one that is accountable for the mistake. He should suck it up and make it right, there is quite a difference in price between a 428 and a 390. I would want my money back and go elsewhere and think that a judgement would be easy to get if not made right out of good will and embarrassment.

RICK LAKE · #7 (**permalink**) 04-17-2005, 05:29 AM

fordspool As far as the dealership, unless there is a warranty on the motor, he's beat. He could go to court and said the motor was wrong that they sold was not what he ordered. He would maybe win the case. As far as the second sale. KNOW what you are BUYING!!! Most sales are AS IS

, unless you agreed on something. I thought that is you removed the water jacket freeze out plug the cubie size was stamped in the block. Pull the head and measure the stroke and bore, you will know what you have. I got screwed the same way, I have a 4.05 bore block with a 3.98 crank in my FE that I was going to use in my cobra. Was told it was a 428, turned out to be a 410. No refund or return was put on the reciept. $700.00 dollars for the wrong motor.

I didn't do my homework before I went to buy, I was stupid. Thought everyone is fair and honest, wrong again. I have the SO caps for the mains and can convert over one day. May sale one day with the info of cylinder thickness for boring and what block it is. If the guy pulled the motor apart there may be something wrong with it now. The only way to make good on this is to sue the dealership and see what happens, other wise, everybody got hosed.

Rick Lake

decooney · #8 (**permalink**) 04-17-2005, 09:00 AM

fordspool,

390s are great motors too, as long as they've not been overbored too much and don't overheat. If its apart, maybe someone can do a sonic check on the cylinders to see what the real value is. If its good, its also possible the seller/buyer can settle on the delta between a 390 and a 428 if the guy has already installed the motor.