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Kirkham Motorsports

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Old 10-03-2009, 03:29 PM
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Default Broken Lifter

I have a hydraulic roller lifter setup in my windsor block. This morning while pulling the oil pan my wife noticed a piece of a lifter in the pan. It is the very bottom part that wraps around the pin that holds the roller in place. Has anyone ever seen this? Possible causes? I am going to start tearing the top end off probably in a couple of hours.
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Old 10-03-2009, 03:58 PM
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You have a very observant wife-keep her.

What make is the lifter? Things to check when torn down are pushrod length and valve spring tension/shimming. Think you just got bad metallurgy possibly on that whole set.
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Old 10-03-2009, 04:57 PM
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WOW....thats not a good thing to have happen.....hope its not to serious and you can do an east fix.
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Old 10-03-2009, 05:31 PM
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Well there was only the tiny little piece in the pan so I assume the rest is still intact. Could be just a bad lifter. They were ford lifters I got from Keith Craft. I will post a picture once I have it out.
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Old 10-03-2009, 06:43 PM
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How did you get your wife to pull the oil pan? hopefully she is not parting out your car!! LOL

I'm guessing it was part of the intake valve. It could be cause by to much advance or detonation slamming that valve closed. KC likes to set 35 BTDC (most like around 32ish)

If it was the exhaust side I think you wolud have felt a major problem.

You might want to take a look at the piston head to make sure no damage has been done. Home Depot rents a sewer camera that fits in a spark plug hole. Sounds funny putting sh!t into your delicate combustion chamber but it works and you don't have to take the head, intake, exhaust off.

Last edited by Rwillia4; 10-03-2009 at 06:51 PM..
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Old 10-04-2009, 06:46 PM
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My wife pulled the motor apart for me and pulled the lifters. Several of them have cracks on the front of the motor side of the lifter. Here is a picture of the broken one and a cracked one.. Bad set? issue with my motor? Thoughts? I am going to send an email to Keith as well.

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Old 10-04-2009, 07:08 PM
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Darn Mike, If it wasn't for bad luck you would not have any at all.
Glad you found this before it turned into something worse.

Oh yea, Why were you pulling the pan in the first place?

Terry
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Old 10-04-2009, 07:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onefastmustang View Post
My wife pulled the motor apart for me and pulled the lifters...


I'm having a hard time believing this... This thread is worthless without pictures of this wife...
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Old 10-04-2009, 07:22 PM
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Two reasons.. I wanted to put the Milodon gasket and some oil pan studs. When we pulled the pan we noticed that the bolt holes were dimpled so she used a hammer and dolly to flatten them out and noticed the shrapnel sitting in the pan when she was cleaning up.

As far as luck. The COO of my company thinks I have great luck because I keep surviving all of the **** that has been thrown at me over the last 18 months. For those not following along..

1. Wife had ovarian cancer
2. I had a brain tumor (resected and cranioplasty). I have a titanium skull now.
3. My mom died of brain cancer.
4. My sister-in-law suddenly passed.
5. I had a major motorcycle accident, broken vertabrae, titanium in my back.

All of that and other small tramaus in 18 months.. ouch..

Now my biggest fun is medical bills. But not for much longer..
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Old 10-04-2009, 07:24 PM
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I'm having a hard time believing this... This thread is worthless without pictures of this wife...
You want her greasy or clean.. LOL
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Old 10-04-2009, 09:23 PM
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That had to just be a bad set or a bad design, i have never seen a roller lifter break like that, glad you and the wife found it whan you did or that would have been some major distruction...........OH and i agree with the boss you are lucky to have a wife that will pull your stuff.......pan i ment pan......
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Old 10-04-2009, 09:30 PM
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She loves me.. She actually has an interest in my hobbies which I think is very cool.

And for you picture requesters.. Yeah those are DD's under there..

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Old 10-04-2009, 10:27 PM
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Default Conjecture....

Considering that the major load is forcing the roller up into the body, I would guess that the press fit of the shaft into the body was excessive, and as a result left a microscopic crack at the time of assembly. The crack propagated under stress (vertical vibration).
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:37 PM
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Considering that the major load is forcing the roller up into the body, I would guess that the press fit of the shaft into the body was excessive, and as a result left a microscopic crack at the time of assembly. The crack propagated under stress (vertical vibration).

So you are thinking they were just a defective set?

I checked my valve springs and they are the X302 set that Ford states is compatible with roller camshafts so I don't think there is an issue there. I am wondering if the spider is creating an issue. One of the dogbones was a little loose. However the lifter under that dogbone was actually fine. I guess I will wait and see what KC has to say.
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Old 10-05-2009, 12:16 AM
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could have been tight rocker geometery at high revs. -- >?
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Old 10-05-2009, 12:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onefastmustang View Post
She loves me.. She actually has an interest in my hobbies which I think is very cool.

And for you picture requesters.. Yeah those are DD's under there..

I nominate her "Cobra-Club Wife of the Month" ; October 2009 .


--Steve
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Old 10-05-2009, 01:13 PM
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So I corresponded with KC and he said he has never seen this happen before. He was concerned that it was either a preload issue or my spring pressure. I have the ford racing X302 valve train kit installed on my heads. I am not sure what the spring pressure for that is nor what it should be. Anyone have that information?
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Old 10-05-2009, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by onefastmustang View Post
So I corresponded with KC and he said he has never seen this happen before. He was concerned that it was either a preload issue or my spring pressure. I have the ford racing X302 valve train kit installed on my heads. I am not sure what the spring pressure for that is nor what it should be. Anyone have that information?
Funny, that's what post #2 said.
Keith will have that spring pressure info.
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Old 10-05-2009, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
I have the ford racing X302 valve train kit installed on my heads. I am not sure what the spring pressure for that is nor what it should be. Anyone have that information
I'm assuming you have the Ford Racing X cam to go with this spring kit????????? I know a number of guys running this cam and similar cams in Mustangs with the factory roller lifters, same as in your pics, and they race them hard and I've never heard of any lifter failures from them.........

Your cam card/cam specs should have the instaled spring height as well as recommend spring pressure.........First thing I would do is find the cam card/cam specs and then find out exactly what the installed spring height is as well as the spring pressure on your heads.........my guess is it is way too much and putting excess pressure on the lifters/cam and valve train........

Your cam/specs determine the spring height needed as well as the spring pressure needed.......

Just my 2 cents....

David
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Old 10-05-2009, 04:22 PM
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Unless I have gone blind I am not seeing any specs on my cam card about springs. I sent the parts list to KC. I will see what he has to say about them.
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