Help me build the engine for my 289FIA Kirkham

[RestoCreations]

My 289 Kirkham will be ready sometime this spring and it is time to start thinking about the motor.
A few initial thoughts!
-This will be a street car, not a race car. I enjoy going fast from 0-70, but I am not willing to sacrifice drivability to have a car that is .01 seconds faster in the quarter mile. However, I do like to have enough cam to pull out of a turn and still have good acceleration in 3rd gear.
-While the Shelby block would be nice, the extra 3,500 could go towards a stack injection system or something that is more noticeable up top. Injection options are at bottom.

1. Engine Block
I've put a good bit of thought into this and I've decided for the long term value of the car that I would like to use an aluminum 351 block, either from Ford Racing or Shelby.
-Ford Racing 351 Aluminum Block is around $3,300(lowest I can find it) Anybody know if this block comes honed and ready to assemble or is it just prepped for final hone?
-Shelby 351 Block is $7,000. (OUCH)

2. Cylinder Heads
-AFR 205 CC aluminum heads assembled $1,700.00. That is the lowest price I have found and I dont expect to find them any lower.
-Shelby signature AFR 205CC Heads: $2,100.00

3. Rotating Assembly I haven't put much thought into this, but thanks to today's gas, which is bound to get worse thanks to the overreach of the EPA and ethanol subsidies, I'm going to assume i need to stick with a compression ratio between 9.8:1-10.5:1. I have used DSS in the past for short blocks, but I haven't used them in a long time and I have never purchased one of their rotating assemblies. However, it would be nice to have a complete rotating assembly show up balanced and ready to be assembled! Thoughts?
What brands for a 427 Stroker?
-Pistons
-Rods
-Pistons
-Bearings
- Balancer
- Flywheel.

4. Camshaft, lifters, timing chain and sprockets
-I think a roller is probably the only way to go, but since I have heard bad things about mechanical roller lifters, I'd like to stick to a hydraulic roller camshaft. However, i've had issues with hydraulic roller lifters bleeding down too quickly in one case and in three cases, not pumping up quickly enough upon initial start up...tons of chatter and slight engine misfires until the oil warms up. Im thinking in the 230-240 duration range with around 600 lift, and a 112 lobe separation, 108 on center. I like a nice choppy idle, but not to the point where the car sounds like it is going to stall every other rotation. For some reason, every cam i have ever used that has had a 110 lobe separation on a 108 center always sounds smoother than the cams i have used with a 112 lobe separation.

5. Oil Pan
I'm not so sure i am up for paying 700.00 for an aviad or shelby pan. the last aviad pan i purchased leaked around the bung welds. Pretty annoying after dropping 800.00 on an oil pan!

6. Flywheel, balancer, and bellhousing
-How lightweight is too lightweight when it comes to a flywheel? I'm thinking about something in-between the weight of a steel and aluminum unit?
-Balancer-Recommended brands and size? engine will be internally balanced
- I'm not going to race this car, so i really don't think a ultra heavy Quicktime bellhousing will be necessary. It looks like I can purchase an aluminum unit that will work with the TKO600 from modern driveline for about 195.00. I guess if i sell the car down the road and the new owner wants to race the car, they can always add a quicktime without issue.

7. Clutch
-I'm starting to think this is an area where people go way overboard. I don't want a clutch that is so heavy duty it makes the clutch difficult to push in or grabs so hard that it makes cruising around town with a lot of stop and go unpleasant. I've used centerforce and ram units in the past with good luck, but i am open to suggestions for other brands.

8. Head Gaskets
- Cometic, felpro, or? Cometic waste of money or necessary for aluminum block?

9. Pulley system
-I like a nice serpentine pulley system. No accessories will be used. I used a march system for a build a few years ago and all of the spacers were wrong. I ended up fabricating all of my own and it took quite some time to get everything spaced out correctly. Id rather not spend a bunch of money again on a system that does not bolt on out of the box. Recommended brands that actually bolt on and are spaced out correctly?

10. Injection system
-Option 1: I recently purchased a Mass-Flo EFI system that was never installed. However, it did not come with the distributor, computer, or wiring. I used two of these systems on small block fords many years ago and they worked very well, but those engines had somewhat mild hydraulic roller camshafts. I read on the website that the computer for the new systems is no longer the A9L, but is now a programmable system. So, i suppose using a more radical cam might not be an issue, as some have stated it to be with the older A9L computer.
-Option 2: Stack injection system with a FAST XFI engine management system. After reading multiple accounts of issues with the FAST Easy EFI system, i refuse to use it. Im not interested in using a DC&O System. I like the looks of the fuel rails on the middle of the intake. I've never installed a stack injection system, but have ready many a horror stories. From the ones i have seen in action, it appears they either work perfectly, or they don't seem to work very well at all. I am sure most of this is due to the engine management system and the capability of the person tuning the system.


Any help is much appreciated! I find it is always good to get others opinions before purchasing engine parts! T

Thanks

[LMH]

My first thought, which doesn't mean anything except to me, is to use a 302 block and not the 351 block. The taller block just looks wrong to me in a 289 model.
It could be stroked to 347 too.
Larry

[AL427SBF]

Ford Racing or Shelby for blocks, no consideration for DART?

[gsharapa]

Have Keith Craft build it! He is extremely reasonable and you will have an engine that will last as he know all the right combinations and will dial it in!

[Three Peaks]

I've checked into this and found the aluminum block saves less than 100 lbs in weight in the front.

A couple suggestions- I would seriously consider talking to a couple of the engine builders on this site- Mike Forte comes to mind as well as several others that have great references on this site. They should be able to steer you in the right direction so you get the right parts that will work together to make a great, well mannered engine for your purposes.

This is only my recipe, but I liked it-

Seasoned 351W block- 74 casting.
Vic Jr. heads- cheaper than the AFP and come with better hardware.
Comp Pro Magnum roller rockers
Rotating assembly from Brian at AD Performance in Seattle. Great service and very knowledgeable. Easy to work with and good prices. If it were me, I would go with a 408 instead of the 427, given all of the back and forth on the pros and cons of the 427 in a 351W block. Or go with a big bore Dart block and do whatever turns your crank.

Cam- I went with a Comp XE 294, which has a very lumpy sound and great response. I would have to find the cam card to see if it fits your profile. Timing chain can be ordered with the cam from Comp Cams as a kit with everything you need- lifters, chains, gears, cam, lube, etc....

I used a Canton road race pan on my car and very happy with it. It sealed up perfectly with the mounting instructions I got from Gordon Levy.

Clutch- for your purposes, I'm not sure I see any gain in going with a lightweight clutch set up. A nice Ram would probably work great and be easier to live with for street driving. Same with the flywheel- any good SFI flywheel will work fine for your purposes and save you money for other things.

Pulley set ups are a crap shoot. I went this route on my 393 and it took me quite a while to find all the right parts to make the pulleys all work and line up. Again, someone like Mike Forte can help you with this and recommend the right pieces to make it all work.

Can't help you with the injection system- I'm pretty much a carb guy. I may be getting too old to start learning new systems now.....

One last note- if it were me I would be sorely tempted to find an old 289 and build that up to put in the Kirkham. Performance parts are still available pretty readily and they still make great horsepower.

Good luck with the build.

Bob

[acindrich]

You should look into the Kirkham billet 302.

[Dimis]

WELCOME BACK RESTO!!!

I for one have missed your talents around here.

New toy to mess with? Nice!
I'm hoping we see that develop as well as your ironman build did.

Vote +1 on the Kirkhim billet block for a Kirkham.

I wonder how far you could bore it out?
I'd go a slightly shorter stroke and spin it as fast you possibly can.
Old school webers on the SBF or Eightstack if you want EFI, but that's just me.

Best of luck with it...

[RestoCreations]

I forgot how particular, yet diverse everyone is when it comes to cobra replicas and their opinion of what engine belongs vs what doesn't. Always good to hear lots of opinions.

[tkb289]

Resto …

Glad you are back and congrats on your Krikham FIA !

For a motor, I can highly recommend Tom Lucas at FE Specialties. He built a wonderful 302 for my ERA FIA. The right balance for me of power, performance, looks and drivability.

Take a look at entry #263 in my build log for details ...
ERA 2136 Build Log





tkb

[mickmate]

Hi Chris welcome back. Exciting news for another build from you. I'm sending you the April 2012 Hot Rod it has a great article on building a small block stroker. They used a SHP short block from Dart for a lot of reasons they list.

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by acindrich

You should look into the Kirkham billet 302.

Hmm... Will that be announced at the Kirkham Open House next month???

[Ron61]

I would talk to Kieth Craft, Tom Lucas and Brent Lykins. They are all top notch engine builders and will be able to answer all of your questions. If you aren't going to race it, I am not sure I would spend the extra money on an aluminum block, but they do dissipate heat better than the iron blocks. Good luck on the build and I hope you will post pictures when you get it ready.

Ron

[Dwight]

The suggestion to build a 331 with a 289 block is a good one.

For a street motor you have to be careful not to buy all the "speed parts" so you can have bragging rights.


Dwight

[blykins]

You assembling or are you going to hire an engine builder?

[Dwight]

Eight Stack in a 289 FIA would be the best of everything

Dwight

pics of my Eight Stack system for my GT 40. I'm building a 347 to put under this injection setup

[RestoCreations]

Originally Posted by blykins

You assembling or are you going to hire an engine builder?

Brent, Ill probably pay my local engine builder to assemble at least the bottom end. I finally found somebody local that cares about and takes pride in their work.

[RestoCreations]

Originally Posted by mickmate

Hi Chris welcome back. Exciting news for another build from you. I'm sending you the April 2012 Hot Rod it has a great article on building a small block stroker. They used a SHP short block from Dart for a lot of reasons they list.

Thanks! Ill keep an eye out for it!

[Wbulk]

I think I would go with a 302 made with a 331 kit for that car. For the cam you don't say what the rear end ratio is going to be, or the trans and overdrive ratios. Without considering those cam choice is difficult.

[RodKnock]

I also be in the camp of building a 302-based 331. There are several reasons, but mainly whether it's a GT40 MK1 or a 289 Cobra, I would install the physically smaller engine to look proper. If you're not after max HP and simply a cruiser, then I think the 331 is great solution.

As for all the individual parts, I'd consult the engine building folks here (Keith, Barry, Brent, etc.) for the latest and greatest stuff.

[blykins]

I'd do a 363 based off of a 4.125 bore dart 302 block. TFS heads, hydraulic roller.

If you're not in a huge hurry, I'd be happy to earn your business.