Cleveland / Windsor

[ERA Chas]

Would anyone mind sharing the specifics of installing Cleveland heads, water pump and intake on Windsor 9.200 deck blocks.
Bolt patterns, water passages, any modifications needed - the more detailed the better.
Any input greatly appreciated.

[COBRA406]

Clevor's are cool!!
As you probably know a W has a wet intake manifold and a Cleveland is
dry. You will need a Clevor style manifold or Street or Track Boss intake
made for Clevors. Unfortunately, unless you already have access to one,
no one that I know of still makes them. The other route is to use a 302W
intake with spacers. Price Motorsports makes them for this conversion.
The heads bolt right up (either 2V,4V or Aussie 2V) You will have to use
the conversion water inlet and crossover by Price, I believe with the
W style intake. Plug the head water passages used in the Cleveland
routing also. Simplify by finding a Clevor intake somewhere before you start.
They are occasionally on Ebay. These were cast in either aluminum or iron.
If you want to use the Cleveland heads, its easier to find a good Cleveland
shortblock. The "dreaded oiling issues" are mostly myth.
Try the Cleveland Engine Forum. www.network54/Forum/119419/
Bob T.

[COBRA406]

Sorry,
I forgot to mention you will need custom pistons because of the
C canted valve angles will not match the W valve reliefs. Either
KB or Probe or Ross still makes them.
Bob T.

[Jac Mac]

You guys have missed ERA Chas point. He is going to use the 9.200" block which will allow all the Cleveland stuff from the Block UP along with any piston /rod combo available for cleveland's. Only mod will be to take the coolant out of the front of the cyl heads as per the dwg's in any older SVO catalogs. I will have a look later tonite & see how you are doing to post more details if needed.

Jac Mac

[ERA Chas]

Bob T.
Just to clarify: by "wet manifold", you mean the water crossover is on the Cleveland block and the W. transfers water side to side by the manifold?
To be clear - have complete CLEVELAND engine and want to substitute just a Windsor block, using as much C. stuff as possible.
Would a Cleveland crank work in a 9.200 deck, 2.750 main Windsor? Is a C. internally balanced?
Not familiar with oil probs you refer to, but the W. block under consideration has no such issues. It's a premium, race quality piece, not a boneyard core.
Excellent tip about about the pistons, however, might the Cleveland pistons work in the W. block at 4.000 bore?
Thank you for your time and effort. Appreciate your patience.

[ERA Chas]

Jac,
Just as I clicked "Reply" to Bob, your post jumped between!
Yes, you have it right, as I attempted to clarify to Bob. If you guys could clarify the coolant / front of heads stuff I might see the light.
Sorry to be such a dimbulb, I'm an FE guy and am "Clevor" addled.
Thanks to you both!

[COBRA406]

Chas,
Try this link, it should explain better than my warblings:
www.darkhorseracing.net/clevor_head_mod.htm
Bob T.

[autoxmike]

My Cobra has a 408 Clevor that my brother built in 1993. I like it - it perfroms well and looks more like a big block.

The Cleveland forum mention earlier is a great place for Clevor info. This thread talks about the head coolant mods as gaskets:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/11941...5269/IMPORTANT

I just uploaded a magazine article from 1992 on building a Clevor, which my brother used for this motor.







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[hssss]

The Clevland is 9.2 deck if I remember correctly so an intake for a clevland should work just fine. This url has Info and Edlebrock aluminum heads and manifold toward the bottom of the page. http://www.strokerengine.com/ClevelandHeads.html

These guys appear to have everything you need look at heads/manifold/accessories. http://www.chiheads.com/

[Jac Mac]

Chas; Along with the 9.200" Windsor Block you will require the following:

351 W , Oil pan , Oil pump& pickup, Timing chain/gears, Camshaft, Timing cover, Cam thrust plate, Fuel pump, Distributor gear, Waterpump, & possibly the Damper.[ The 351c Damper may work but check clearance between rear damper face & timing cover] (351w has shorter crank to cam center distance than 351c, this is why 351w parts reqd )

You will need to machine the shoulder or step that is just in front of #1 main journal on your 351c crankshaft to allow the Windsor timing gears to line up and extend the keyway towards the rear. A similar amount will need to be turned of the front of the crank snout to allow the retaining washer/bolt to do it's job. Cleveland cranks are externally balanced like early Windsors in std form.

CYLINDER HEADS: Block off the transfer holes in the deck surface @ each end of the heads (Square holes nearest intake side about 5/8x5/8 )

Drill and Tap 3/4-14 NPTF @ the front of the LH & RH heads to take the coolant out of the motor ( Dont get it wrong like I did once and end up with two RH heads ). Find someone with an old SVO catalog (circa 1993) if you can , these had dwg's for this mod. Be careful not to overtighten these fittings due to the close proximity to the original hole's on the deck face that we have just blocked off. This is your chance to make your motor look like an FE with these coolant lines running into a header tank or swirl pot before going to the radiator.

Now your cleveland intake manifold while matching the heads & ports will not be a total match in the valley end seal's and may need some buildup with a Tig or epoxy particularly at the rear. You will also need some longer pushrods due to the camshafts lower position in the block.

Also if your 351c reqd flow notches in the bore for valve clearance you will need to duplicate these on your new block, along with checking your 351c head gasket matchs the coolant passages.

From memory thats about it!!

Regards Jac Mac

[hssss]

FFR current catalog Page 226 http://www.fordracingparts.com/download/catalogs.asp

[ERA Chas]

All of you guys have been truly great in your response.
Thanks so much.