Lakewood or Quicktime bellhousing?

[Dangerous Doug]

The Lakewood bellhousing requires some minor machining to fit into my ERA 289FIA (so it doesn't hang down below the chassis). This is due to the shape of the Lakewood bellhousing (it's circular).

Does the SB Ford Quicktime bellhousing require the same?

I'm indifferent between the two at this time. Anyone have dimensions for the Quicktime SB Ford bellhousing?

DD

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Dangerous Doug

I'm indifferent between the two at this time.

The more parts you buy directly from ERA, the easier your life will be. They will sell you a bellhousing that will fit properly and any premium on the price will be well worth it in the long run.

[Pete Munroe]

D.Doug,

I had to throw away a new Lakewood bell-housing as it was impossible to align. As I had cut off the lower-flange for clearance...that may, may not, have warped/ruined it.

The VERY EXPERIENCED race fabricator that did my side pipes recommended AGAINST cutting off the lower flange as the housing would warp and be impossible to align.

OK, I HAD to cut the lower flange cutoff and apparently the thing warped enough that the hole for the transmission was "out of round"...I spent hours with the "offset ground" alignment dowels. The bell-housing got tweaked, measured, tweaked, measured in every direction...warped...or...maybe was never right to begin with.

Anyway, I now have a McLeod, very similar in dimensions to the Lakewood and this time I DID NOT CUT OFF THE LOWER LIP.

After 13,000 miles the only thing that has scraped are side pipes and not very much at that.

In the ERA 289 FIA car with sidepipes that go under the lower body lip, the side pipes will scrape before the bell housing...even if the housing has NOT BEEN TRIMMED.

A 427" car with side pipes coming out through the side of the body the bell housing may actually be the lowest point under the car passing over a "speed bump".

I would NOT trim the bell-housing flange for the 289 car, on the 289 it is NOT an issue if you run the normal under and out exhaust.

427" with pipes that run through-the-side ? maybe be required.

Just slow down at speed bumps, I think you will be OK.

Pete

[Dangerous Doug]

Thanks for the replies.

Anybody using Quicktime?

[xlr8or]

I realize it's not quite the same but on my car the Lakewood would require trimming and the Quicktime did not.
The outer flange is a totally different shape on the Quicktime housing

[Three Peaks]

You will love the Quicktime housing. I have one on my 351/393 and it is a really neat and compact unit. I had a very tight fit and the Lakewood wouldn't even come close to fitting. I had cut out a fist sized portion at the starter location to clear the chassis, but it was just not working out.
The Quicktime is even smaller than the stock aluminum unit and VERY well built. I think it weighs in at around 16 lbs? where the Lakewood was 35 or so?
I also heard they are much more concentric to the centerline, but you'll still have to check it and adjust. Don't even think of a Lakewood if you have a chance to get the Quicktime unit.

I bought mine from ModernDriveline.com and had it in about 2 days.

Bob

[COBRANIP]

For what it's worth....Coleman Racing makes an alignment tool that should speed up alignment of the bellhousing. http://www.colemanracing.com/catalog...p?cPath=50_391

[MrMagoo]

It seems that quicktime housings are the new king in this market. I have a lakewood, and I had to use offset pins to dial it in. It was pretty far off. It weighs a pissload, and there is that big old flange on the bottom. I too have heard people say that the Quicktime's are more likely to be within tolerance as far as dialing in is concerned, they weigh less, and they have that modular construction that means that you could change trannies without having to get a whole new bellhousing.

I would go with the quicktime if I were doing it all over again, but that lakewood being so thick and heavy does make your balls feel safe.

[jshel1]

There are two different Quicktime Bellhousings that fit the Ford 351W SB and the Tremec family of transmissions. The cobra recommended bell housing does not require modification other than indexing... ie it was fabricated by Quicktime not having the lower lip or flange that cobra ground clearance can't tolerate.

I understand the 2lb weight difference between the two offered windsor bellhousings is the flange. Very strong, very light weight.

[Eric Page]

Originally Posted by Pete Munroe

The VERY EXPERIENCED race fabricator that did my side pipes recommended AGAINST cutting off the lower flange as the housing would warp and be impossible to align.

OK, I HAD to cut the lower flange cutoff and apparently the thing warped enough that the hole for the transmission was "out of round"...I spent hours with the "offset ground" alignment dowels. The bell-housing got tweaked, measured, tweaked, measured in every direction...warped...or...maybe was never right to begin with.

Just curious... Could the Lakewood first be aligned with the flange intact, then assembled with the engine/tranny and installed in the car, and finally have the flange ground off with the car on a lift? Once the alignment is done and everything is bolted in place, you should be able to take the flange off without compromising the alignment. The only problem I can see is that your first clutch replacement might require a new bellhousing, since removing all the bolts would allow the steel to move.

-Eric

[Xack]

I was searching for some insight on the Lakewood bellhousing and experience of others trimming it, and I found this old posting. Also, I am looking to see if anyone has a similar frame and any problems removing it from the engine while on the frame.

When I put my BBF and tranny together, I had to trim my Lakewood somewhat around the starter in order to get it into the frame. At this point I had not considered how it hung on the frame as I was going by the manufacturers notes.

Alignment:
I have had a similar problem when installing my Lakewood bellhousing. Lakewood makes a nice scatter shield, but it needs work out-of-the-box. It was impossible to center the transmission as the hole is way too big. And the hole is not round. After some time measuring and remeasuring I went around the thing taking points of data. It had 3 major places where the radius was out of round. If you measure at different points each time you try to take distance measurements you'll go blind, or mad, or both.

I sent it to a machine shop to weld it up to "snug fit" my Tremec TKO spacer bracket. They locked it down to the CNC machine base, found what was the best "center" of the hole by the CNC measurements and then attached and machined a small reference hole in a bar bolted diagonally across 2 of the mount holes. This is for alignment later only. They welded up the hole in order to provide enough material to remove and machine the hole to proper size.

Needless to say alignment was a first time breeze. The hole was round and it did not matter anywhere on the housing where I took measurements, all data points measured by the dial guage were within .004". The transmission fits in the bellhousing like a glove.

Now, about this business of warping. The points where the bellhousing mounted to the engine block are where the stress will be. The bottom bolt holes do nothing except hold the foreward scatter plate in position. That's all.

If you grind the bellhousing warping shouldn't be an issue. If you heat it up in order to remove metal, then you'll probably want to check alignment again. However, in that area, warping should not affect anything unless the whole scatter shield is warped across the transmission mount hole. You should check to see that the bellhousing still fits the block. If there is not a problem and the bolts tighten the shield flat against the block, your back in business.

Warping will be your biggest problem. Warping of the relationship from the engine to the transmission shaft will cause all kinds of transmission wear and shifting problems. However, the installation I have is well within misalignment numbers. And if I keep the engine revs down to say 3K, there should not be much a problem. If you get yours machined, just check the transmission deck to see if it's flat against the engine block mount deck. That's easily done on a CNC.

If you have a Lakewood, you'll probably have alignment problems unless your lucky. If I had to do it again, I'd look for another bellhousing manufacturer and also check dimensions and roundness of the transmission coupling FIRST.

Xack

[Dangerous Doug]

For the record: I decided to buy a Quicktime from Fortes, from whom I sourced my TKO-600. I had no issues with the installation whatsoever, and it does not hang down too low on my ERA 289FIA.

Cheers!
DD

[Steve Cassani]

I equipped SPO 1872 with a Lakewood bellhousing, fit to a 351 Windsor, a TKO 3550 and a Centerforce clutch. As delivered, the transmission resisted going from first to second, at first slightly, then gradually becoming more of a factor. I excused the lag as normal until the transmission had some wear. At roughly 18,000 miles the throwout bearing exploded.

The clutch was serviced by a well-respected shop in town. The owner has worked with Lakewood and Quicktime bellhousings for many years, mostly with off-road competition vehicles. He took his time and gave the customary careful attention to refitting the Lakewood. He had it dialed in perfectly.

The clutch worked beautifully, the transmission shifted well. The throwout bearing exploded after fifty miles. Here is the lesson I took from this surprise: Let whomever you trust to maintain the car select the bellhousing he judges best fits the engine and transmission you want. If you do your own work, problem solved. Otherwise, you risk being burdened by a combination that resists solution, even in the best of hands.

[tkb289]

Originally Posted by Dangerous Doug

For the record: I decided to buy a Quicktime from Fortes, from whom I sourced my TKO-600. I had no issues with the installation whatsoever, and it does not hang down too low on my ERA 289FIA.

Cheers!
DD

Doug,

I went with a Quicktime from Mike Forte for my ERA FIA (with 302 SBF) and had no problems with fitment of any kind. Also bought all the clutch parts, fasteners and TKO-600 from Mike as well. The clutch has a nice progressive take up, is not too stiff and the TKO shifts very nicely indeed.

The only mods I made were to the clutch slave cylinder bracket to optimize the alignment of the rod to the fork, and I removed the big Quicktime decal from the bell housing.

[Caprimaniac]

I'm not fully aware what trans you are matin to your 289. I know that if you use the T5, there are 2 Quicktime housings to choose from; SFI and non-SFI.

The SFI (which I have) does hang down low- unfortunately-, while the non- SFI are more shallow. There are some threads in the trans forum you might like to check out.

Also, the QT are lighter and less voluminous than the others, as I understand.

RS

[csx4017]

Talk to the pros at ModernDriveline.com.........They source the whole package. ERA and Kirkham have a good knowledge base to tap. My Roush 351W is running a Quicktime and TKO600 with Hydraulic Throw-Out Bearing......Zero grinding required....Smooth shifting through all gears......Cheers