Overheating or bad gauge? - Page 3

madmaxx · #41 (**permalink**) 09-27-2010, 11:01 AM

Thudmaster,

Looking at your water pump and alternator, it does not apear that your bolts are polished, is it just a reflection or do they not come polished?

Quote:

Originally Posted by thudmaster

How about posting a few pictures of your engine so we can see which water lines you have or don't have............

something like this

thudmaster · #42 (**permalink**) 09-27-2010, 01:21 PM

they are all arp.......black

some on the block are chrome

madmaxx · #43 (**permalink**) 09-27-2010, 01:26 PM

Nice touch, breaks up the glow. Sweet looking engine!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by thudmaster

they are all arp.......black

some on the blovk are chrome

Voyager · #44 (**permalink**) 09-28-2010, 10:23 AM

Can't get a good picture of the engine with the hood on, so I'll try to explain the hose setup.

It's a 2010 KC 408 street crate w/ an Edelbrock Performer RPM INT MAN & Edelbrock 351W water pump in a Superformance w/ SS 351 expansion tank (no catch tank).

Water pump has a hose from the pump to the heater. The other water pump outlet is plugged (as is the corresponding outlet on the expansion tank neck). Other heater hose goes from the heater to top of the intake.

One radiator hose goes from the expansion tank to the top of the radiator. Other radiator hose from the bottom of radiator to the bottom of pump.

KCR staff said a bypass not required. Told me to verify thermostat orientation and operation, (use 180 or 160) and then drill two to three 3/32 holes in it.

Will try it this weekend.

Barnsnake · #45 (**permalink**) 09-29-2010, 12:44 AM

Ed,
I was referring to the picture that Voyager included in post #29.

Ernie,
The Cleveland has the thermostat and the bypass in the cylinder block. In the "Clevor" setups they move the thermostat and bypass back to the front of the intake manifold like a Windsor.

The elimination of the bypass does increase the maximum efficiency of the cooling system, but in situations where the thermostat is closed a significant percentage of the time, it will cause the temperature to "yo-yo".

Voyager,
The two 3/32" holes in the thermostat will allow some minimal circulation and may reduce, if not eliminate the problem. Bear in mind there are a few million Windsor-style engines running out there, virtually all with the circulation bypass. Keep it in mind.

thudmaster · #46 (**permalink**) 09-29-2010, 01:45 AM

Sorry Jim.

Voyager, if it were my engine I would pull the allen head plug out below the black rubber plug. Put a hose fitting in it and wrestle a piece of hose between them. I did it on mine and never had a heating problems. It's not my engine but it is my two cents.......

Tonkin NZ · #47 (**permalink**) 10-02-2010, 02:34 PM

Great to see you fixed it. I have SPF2828 and had to replace the thermostat end as the needle had broken off and fused closed. Only 500mls but it had the same issues as you described.

Rwillia4 · #48 (**permalink**) 10-02-2010, 06:47 PM

I have a KC engine. Mine also had a by-pass blocked. This was not installed by KC and I would put in the bypass hose ASAP. I was about at the same point of my engine break-in where you are and the rubber cap failed blowing coolant ALL OVER. There is a huge amount of PSI built up on the back side of that thing. It is suppose to allow a controlled amount of flow to so you don't get surges of water blasting by at different temps.

Excaliber · #49 (**permalink**) 10-02-2010, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Great to see you fixed it.

I missed that part of how, when it was fixed? I thought we were still waiting for an update on this issue?

Like KC, I'm not convinced the by-pass hose is the problem, nor am I convinced it is required in all cases.

Rwillia4 · #50 (**permalink**) 10-02-2010, 08:54 PM

drilling holes would be similar to installing the by-pass (read: install the by-pass).

Where is the sensor located? I assume it is on the intake just before the t-stat. Is it adapter installed "deep" enough in the hole to not allow any small bubbles to collect right at the sensor? Does the adapter have a flat bottom? this would be to minimize any bubbles collecting at the sensor?

Turning on the heater would reduce the temp spike quicker only if the t-stat is working correctly. So I don't think that is the problem.

The fact that it spikes quickly then takes time to reduce means to me there is poor flow around the temp sensor or the sensor is not in the water flow, maybe a bubble.

Some one wrote about a lose impeller on the water pump, that is something to keep in mind, we have seen that before on new and old water pumps and has similar symtoms.

Voyager · #51 (**permalink**) 10-04-2010, 11:14 AM

Not freaken fixed at all. My goal for next weekend is:

Pull the current thermostat, test it in a pot of water, drill a hole in it and put it back in. Also picked up a balanced thermostat as a backup.

Will also install a bypass hose. Any idea what size hose fitting I will need to screw into the Edelbrock 351W based water pump? Trying to make only 1 run to the store.

The sensor is on a short extension on the intake. I like the idea that it may be getting a steam pocket built up under the tip. But we had temp fluctuations before the dealer installed the extension. But I do think I will take the extension out anyway.

Bob

madmaxx · #52 (**permalink**) 10-04-2010, 11:41 AM

You are sure the water pump is the correct rotation? bleed the coolant system via the temp sending unit, back out a couple threads until coolant comes out, retighten. It really pays off when filling. Loosen sending unit and fill system with coolant

Voyager · #53 (**permalink**) 10-04-2010, 12:10 PM

We purged air/coolant from the senor on the intake multiple times. The dealer also used a coolant vacuum pump device.

Have not verified the water pump direction. The crate engine came preassembled by Keith Craft’s team in Arkansas.

Voyager · #54 (**permalink**) 10-18-2010, 04:26 PM

Thanks to the counsel of this forum, I believe that I have fixed my overheating issue.

Replaced the thermostat with a Mr. Gasket 180 Balanced thermostat (drilled 2 holes).

Added a bypass hose.

Two hour test run had temps at a steady 70-80 C at cruise.

Thanks.

Blas · #55 (**permalink**) 10-18-2010, 04:59 PM

Excellent.....One less thing to worry about...Enjoy the car...

madmaxx · #56 (**permalink**) 10-18-2010, 05:43 PM

Excellent feedback. A couple years ago I noticed in our frigid Texas winters (LOL) I could not get my coolant temp past 70C and it would take forever to warm up!!!!! Ambient was 55F!!! What I determined was a 180F thermostat was installed. After testing in a pot of water I realized the thermostat did not open until 180F but would not CLOSE until 170F and would alway bypass some. The coolant system is so efficient on a SPF any coolant circulation kept the engine temp under control.

I changed to an el cheapo 195F with hole drilled in the top. Now my temp gets to 95CF thermostat opens and settles around 80C, warms up much quicker. Even in our scorcher summers (not laughing this time) my temp stays at 90C and rarely the fans kick on.

On a side note the smith gauges are very very accurate for mechanical gauges. Both oil and temp were within 1 degree F against calibrated gauges. The oil pressure gauge was off 3 psig. I have not checked the amp, my speedo is dead on at 60mph but about 3mph off at 30.

Voyager · #57 (**permalink**) 10-20-2010, 05:39 AM

This weekend’s project is to swap out the oem motormounts for the Olthoff mounts (pipes are centered, but still occassionally hitting the body).

While the mounts are off, going to try to find & tightned the minor oil leak by the remote oil filter adapter/fittings on the block. Hopefully I can get a wrench on them when I pull the engine mount. Not much space.

Reached 1000 miles on the odometer this past weekend. Loving it.

CBattaglia · #58 (**permalink**) 10-20-2010, 06:13 AM

I switched to the poly mounts from Olthoff's aswell. But, after i cracked the fiberglass in the pipe cut out

. Good move to get that done.

Since your car is brand new, I recommend checking anything with threads regularly. If you see something loose, use a little blue loc tight to prevent loosening again. I had a throttle linkage, negative battery terminal, driveshaft bolt and maybe one or two others vibrate loose. As you can imagine the linkage and battery terminal left me dead on the side of the road. Luckily I found the nut on the linkage, dont know how. I was lucky enough to quickly fix the problems and get going again.

These cars are like helicopters, lots of vibration and maintenance. Its dangerous enough with out something falling off....

Enjoy your car, congrats!

madmaxx · #59 (**permalink**) 10-20-2010, 12:49 PM

As far as your oil filter adapter fitting YOU HAVE TO GET THE AN wrench and yes you will be able to tighten. Anything else and you will not be able to get to it. They sell for about $12 at summit, i believe it is 12 an but may be 10an, my wrench is blue if that helps.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voyager

This weekend’s project is to swap out the oem motormounts for the Olthoff mounts (pipes are centered, but still occassionally hitting the body).

While the mounts are off, going to try to find & tightned the minor oil leak by the remote oil filter adapter/fittings on the block. Hopefully I can get a wrench on them when I pull the engine mount. Not much space.

Reached 1000 miles on the odometer this past weekend. Loving it.

madmaxx · #60 (**permalink**) 10-20-2010, 12:51 PM

Oh, I agree with the motormounts, no brainer, the rubber sheet that comes with it is pathetic for anything over 200 hp. You may have to do some grinding on the bottom half to make it fit up right. This is where a 4 post lift really shines.