Getting ready

[PHC1]

Hey guys, new to Club Cobra. Been thinking about getting a Cobra for many years as I guess many do! I think I am closer to pulling the trigger this time than any other. So far in my limited research and a few conversations, the Superformance sounds like a great replica to go with.

Seems like a very friendly forum, hope you guys don't mind a few questions and won't tell me to go and use the search feature!

A few questions for you Superformance owners then. I'm 6'2" and being able to fit comfortable is a bit of a concern but I have been told it should not be a problem and the seat can be bolted to the floor if need be for extra room. True?

I need to decide whether I am going to settle for a roller that's already in stock or order and wait or perhaps even buy a lightly preowned example that is close to what I would have built myself. What should I be aware of if ordering? Any specific options a "must have"?

What motor do I go with? I realize there are many possibilities, power levels, builders, etc. What is popular? Do I need to have a 427 for resale value down the road or should I instead focus on the motor for drive-ability, reliability, torque and HP curve, quick revving, etc... factors instead.

I keep thinking the MK III is the one I would/should start with but I also keep eyeballing the 289 FIA MKII.... Choices, choices...

Also what are my choices for a tranny?

I'd really appreciate some input, just point me in the right direction and I will try to find the way!

Thanks in advance!

[madmaxx]

Buy used, know what the finished product looks like, drives like, runs like before you put a penny down. You also need to be somewhat of a shade tree mechanic. SPF is an excellent choice and very comfortable comparatively speaking. As far as engines drive both, linear powered big block or exponential power stroked little block.

[mattpatt]

I, like everyone else, went through all the same questions at first (and you'll have lots more from my experience). To try to answer some of your questions:

1) You're 6-2, I'm 5-6. I have the seat, still on it's track, all the way back (had to add pedal extenders to get the seat back and steering wheel a confortable distance away for how I like it). I'm not so tall that my head has too much wind over the windshield (good for keeping hats on). Given my issue with needing pedal extenders I suspect you'd be just fine in that arena. That said, I understand the taller folks do just fine also. Maybe bolting the seat to the floor is a good trick - others can answer this.

2) Regarding ordering a new roller. Mine (SP3033 - delivered about a year ago) took 5 months to get here (the ship needed repairs, etc.). Most options are listed - you can get them from your dealer. There were other options I learned about while ordering (and one AFTER I got the car!). You can get upgraded brakes (necessary if you're gonna track your car - want more resale value/pride of ownership, etc.), can get headrests, etc.. You can get an extra coat of clear-coat on the paint (saw one recently - looked very good, wish I'd known).

One option is for an additional roll-bar or a full-width roll bar. When I went for my first drive as a passenger I found it a bit "wierd" not to have something behind me: I ordered mine with the additional passenger roll-bar just so my wife would feel more comfortable in it (hope to take some ~longish drives with her).

I also got the upgraded fire extinguisher (includes better "chemistry" - not just looks).

I did not opt for the passenger sliding seat option. If the passenger seat doesn't slide you can't add spacers to tilt the seat back a bit like you can on the driver's side (something I did - but then, my wife doesn't like it tilted back like I do).

I went for the quicklifts. They are the most popular and, from a protection standpoint, aren't much worse than the other (less appealing, IMO) options. A minor bump from another car will break fiberglass no matter what you have.

An option is to go with no rivets. I chose this for cleaning ease - but I regret it now. The lines of the scoop require the rivets IMO. I'm going to add them myself to get the right look.

Wheel size options. If you want the original (lots of rubber) look go with the 15s. I went with the 18s for the wider choice of high perf tires available. I suspect handling is better, too. One thing I don't like, though, is the lower profile tires are a bit shorter (~26.5" diameter rather than ~28"). This means overall effective gearing is a bit lower - I'd rather have it a bit higher (60 mph in 1st vs 55).

I went with the larger brakes - look good, needed if I ever track the car, and maybe better resale value.

3) Motors: you'll get lots of opinions here to be sure. Since the SPF is not "authentic" I decided I had some lattitude to do some "upgrades" (I can hear the groans now) while keeping the basic package very similar in looks and performance to the original. I went with a small block (351 based) 427 - made to my "mild" suggestions by Keith Craft. Has the magic 427 ci number and has performance essentially as good as any other 427 (big block or not) - ci is ci. With this choice I also went with an aluminum block. In the end, I have 554 hp (flywheel) and >580 lb-ft torque, an engine that is lighter than the original 289s that won all the races (the BB 427s were too nose heavy). The engine is reasonably smooth for street driving and I get ~15 mph on the highway (~9 around town). The performance is downrighti fantastic! As near as I could tell getting a BB (esp FE) doesn't buy anything in resale (this is not a concourse car) and it has downsides like cost, weight, etc.. High performance (handling/corners) for street use and technical "restomod" pride of ownership were my aims.

4) 427 vs FIA - your choice, buddy. Whatever turns you on the most. Both are fantastic machines.

5) Trannys. Most typical is the TKO. I got the TKO600 5-speed to add strength margin for the engine I choose (wanted max reliability). This tranny has either a .65 or .83 overdrive. Folks doing lots of long highway trips seem to like the .65. The .83 is better for track use. I chose the .83 because I didn't want a noticeably large RPM drop between 4th and 5th vs. the other gears, and I drive mostly on city streets anyway so I can use 5th at 40 mph (nice and smooth with my engine choice). Finally - if I ever sell it I'm guessing the .83 (and big brakes and aluminum SB will fetch a higher price) - but who knows? A final word - I very seriously planned on putting the Tremec 6 speed in (to get both the .83 and .65 advantage). In the end why do it when, with the 5 speed, you really don't even need 1st gear. Also, besides major headaches with frame mods, etc. it turns out you may void any warrantee if the frame is cut (necessary to put the 6-speed in). The 5-speed is plenty for this car. FYI - I also went with a Mcleod street twin that should last a really long time, has light pedal pressure and can handle 800 hp. Replacing a clutch is a pain. Went with a steel flywheel since I wouldn't be racing and less revs on pull-out are better for clutch life. Works just great for my application.

Hope some of this helps - but you'll get a lot of great info from the folks on this site - they REALLY helped me make the right choices for me. Just keep asking the questions.

Good luck - and have fun!!

Sorry this took so long!!

Matt

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by madmaxx

Buy used, know what the finished product looks like, drives like, runs like before you put a penny down. You also need to be somewhat of a shade tree mechanic. SPF is an excellent choice and very comfortable comparatively speaking. As far as engines drive both, linear powered big block or exponential power stroked little block.

Buying used can obviously be less painful on the wallet especially when the purchase is "right". Sometimes a used purchase is just buying someone else's headache. I will certainly keep the option of finding a good preowned car an option!

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by mattpatt

I, like everyone else, went through all the same questions at first (and you'll have lots more from my experience). To try to answer some of your questions:

1) You're 6-2, I'm 5-6. I have the seat, still on it's track, all the way back (had to add pedal extenders to get the seat back and steering wheel a confortable distance away for how I like it). I'm not so tall that my head has too much wind over the windshield (good for keeping hats on). Given my issue with needing pedal extenders I suspect you'd be just fine in that arena. That said, I understand the taller folks do just fine also. Maybe bolting the seat to the floor is a good trick - others can answer this.

2) Regarding ordering a new roller. Mine (SP3033 - delivered about a year ago) took 5 months to get here (ship needed repairs, etc.). Most options are listed - you can get them from your dealer. There were other options I learned about while ordering (and one AFTER I got the car!). You can get upgraded brakes (necessary if you're gonna track your car - want more resale value/pride of ownership, etc.), can get headrests, etc.. You can get an extra coat of clear-coat on the paint (saw one recently - looked very good, wish I'd known).

One option is for an additional roll-bar or a full-width roll bar. When I went for my first drive as a passenger I found it a bit "wierd" not to have something behind me: I ordered mine with the additional passenger roll-bar just so my wife would feel more comfortable in it (hope to take some ~longish drives with her).

I also got the upgraded fire extinguisher (includes better "chemistry" - not just looks).

I did not opt for the passenger sliding seat option. If the passenger seat doesn't slide you can't add spacers to tilt the seat back a bit like you can on the driver's side (something I did - but then, my wife doesn't like it tilted back like I do).

I went for the quicklifts. They are the most popular and, from a protection standpoint, aren't much worse than the other (less appealing, IMO) options. A minor bump from another car will break fiberglass no matter what you have.

An option is to go with no rivets. I chose this for cleaning ease - but I regret it now. The lines of the scoop require the rivets IMO. I'm going to add them myself to get the right look.

Wheel size options. If you want the original (lots of rubber0 look go with the 15s. I went witht eh 18s for the wider choice of high perf tires available. I suspect handling is better, too. One thing I don't like, though, is the lower profile tires are a bit shorter (~26.5" diameter rather than ~28"). This means overall effective gearing is a bit lower - I'd rather have it abit higher (60 mph in 1st vs 55).

I went with the larger brakes - looik good, needed if I ever track the car, maybe better resale.

3) Motors: you'll get lots of opinions here to be sure. Since the SPF is not "authentic" I decided I had some lattitude to do some "upgrades" (I can hear the groans now) while keeping the basic package very similar in looks and performance to the original. I went with a small block (351 based) 427 - made to my "mild" suggestions by Keith Craft. Has the magic 427 ci number and has performance essentially as good as any other 427 (big block or not) - ci is ci. With this choice I also went with an aluminum block. In the end, I have 554 hp (flywheel) and >580 lb-ft torque), an engine that is lighter than the original 289s that won all the races (the BB 427s were too nose heavy). The engine is reasonably smooth for street driving and I get ~15 mph on the highway (~9 around town). The performance is downrighti fantastic! As near as I could tell getting a BB (esp FE) doesn't buy anything in resale (this is not a concourse car) and it has downside like cost, weight, etc.. High performance (handling/corners) for street use and technical "restrmod" pride of ownership were my aims.

4) 427 vs FIA - your choice, buddy. Whatever turns you on the most. Both are fantastic machines.

5) Trannys. Most typical is the TKO. I got the TKO600 5-speed to add strength margin for the engine I choose (wanted max reliability). This tranny has either a .65 or .83 overdrive. Folks doing lots of long highway trips like the .65. The .83 is better for track use. I chose the .83 because I didn't want a noticeably large RPM drop between 4th and 5th vs. the other gears, and I drive mostly on city streets anyway so I can use 5th at 40 mph (nice and smooth with my engine choice). Finally - if I ever sell it I'm guessing the .83 (and big brakes, and aluminum SB will fetch a higher price) - but who knows? A final word - I very seriously planned on putting the Tremec 6 speed in (to get both the .83 and .65 advantage). In the end why do it when, with the 5 speed, you really don't even need 1st gear. Also, besides major headaches with frame mods, etc. it turns out you may void any warrantee if the frame is cut (necessary to put the 6-speed in). The 5-speed is plenty for this car. FYI - I also went with a Mcleod street twin that should last a really long time, has light pedal pressure and can handle 800 hp (?). Replacing a clutch is a pain. Went with a steel flywheel since I wouldn't be racing and less revs on pull-out are better for clutch life. Works just great for my application.

Hope some of this helps - but you'll get a lot of great info from the folks on this site - they REALLY helped me make the right choices for me. Just keep asking the questions.

Good luck - and have fun!!

Sorry this took so long!!

Matt

Matt, thank you for all the information and taking your time out to respond to my complete noob questions! I will look into Keith Craft engines as well! The clutch and flywheel as well as gearing and 5 sp vs 6 sp are excellent points to research some more! Thanks for heads up on the upgrades on brakes and other items! I also need to give the 15" vs 18" tire selection some thought...

[madmaxx]

Remember these are very simple cars, no ac, no anti-lock brakes, no computers, no, traction control, problems are limited to paint, body, engine, transmission are robust and cheap to repair and replace. I think you will find more issues with a new one, there is alot of sorting. Remember paint and body cost the most, engines are easily repaired / replaced. Most new SPF with stroked small block (Roush, KC) run in the low to mid $70's if you get the opitions which used to be standard like top and tonneau. You buy used from 53k to 60k, take the 12-17k saved to make any upgrades you may like (brakes, wheels etc)

Originally Posted by PHC1

Buying used can obviously be less painful on the wallet especially when the purchase is "right". Sometimes a used purchase is just buying someone else's headache. I will certainly keep the option of finding a good preowned car an option!

[madmaxx]

When i say used I am talking less than 3K miles and flawless condition, if you are willing for some minor wear and more mileage you can get one for high 40's low 50's.

[GEE TEE]

Going used on a Superformance is a good bet. You can save a ton of money and there are many cars out there with very low miles and lots of options.

A couple of things I would look for:

Chassis number 2000 and higher gets you the much improved top and some other improvements.

If a car is titled as a 1965 rather than a 20XX it can save you lots of problems with registering and insuring, depending on what state you live in.

Big Block cars tend to have fewer miles than small block cars. This may be because people put a BB in a car for show rather than driving, or SB cars are just more driveable.

Don't go overboard on HP unless your PRIMARY use will be the track. The same goes for clutches and brakes. Trying to use a race car on the street isn't all that much fun. However, taking your street car on the track once or twice can be lots of fun.

Don't worry about the cockpit size. I'm 6'2" and very comfortable, although I do have the driver seat tipped back using Dennis Olthoff's 2" spacers.

Wheel size is a personal choice, but I have 17" and 15" and there is a huge difference in comfort when you have more sidewall to absorb bumps. I wouldn't even consider 18" for anything other than racing.

[Got the Bug]

I'm 6' 2" as well. My seat is bolted to the floor all the way back and I have about 1" of leeway between my knee and the dash. It's a close fit, but very comfortable.

I drove a standard SPF with the adjustable seat rails in place and I felt like my head was almost above the windshield and was pretty cramped. You don't want to look like a Shriner.

Good luck with SPF build!

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by GEE TEE

Going used on a Superformance is a good bet. You can save a ton of money and there are many cars out there with very low miles and lots of options.

A couple of things I would look for:

Chassis number 2000 and higher gets you the much improved top and some other improvements.

If a car is titled as a 1965 rather than a 20XX it can save you lots of problems with registering and insuring, depending on what state you live in.

Big Block cars tend to have fewer miles than small block cars. This may be because people put a BB in a car for show rather than driving, or SB cars are just more driveable.

Don't go overboard on HP unless your PRIMARY use will be the track. The same goes for clutches and brakes. Trying to use a race car on the street isn't all that much fun. However, taking your street car on the track once or twice can be lots of fun.

Don't worry about the cockpit size. I'm 6'2" and very comfortable, although I do have the driver seat tipped back using Dennis Olthoff's 2" spacers.

Wheel size is a personal choice, but I have 17" and 15" and there is a huge difference in comfort when you have more sidewall to absorb bumps. I wouldn't even consider 18" for anything other than racing.

Thanks for the info GEE TEE!

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by Got the Bug

I'm 6' 2" as well. My seat is bolted to the floor all the way back and I have about 1" of leeway between my knee and the dash. It's a close fit, but very comfortable.

I drove a standard SPF with the adjustable seat rails in place and I felt like my head was almost above the windshield and was pretty cramped. You don't want to look like a Shriner.

Good luck with SPF build!

I just had to look that up Doug, for visual reference. Shriner that is... that's funny!

Sounds like there are at least a few "vertically endowed" members here enjoying their Cobras. Good to know that at least I have hope of fitting into a Cobra unlike the vintage Italian cars.

[Mark IV]

My take:

• The six speed is wasted in most applications, the T56 has two overdrives ratios and unless you are cruising at high speeds you will be too low in the RPM range on most engines
  
  The TKO600 with the .65 OD is also geared rather high for most uses. Search here and you will find some threads on people who regret the .65 and are looking to change to the .82
  
  Remember that ultra high HP may make for great bragging rights, but unless you can put the to the ground, it is wasted. Anything over 550 is probably not usable on most cars in my opinion, your results may vary.

[crASH]

Originally Posted by PHC1

I just had to look that up Doug, for visual reference. Shriner that is... that's funny!

Shriners in Go Karts? - YouTube

Lest everyone else not get to enjoy the "Shriners" reference. They can be pretty hilarious.

And for all their nuttiness, they do a wonderful work with their crippled children's hospital in Greenville SC. I have seen miracle kids come out of that hospital. Kids who couldn't walk when they went in. The Shriners charge nothing for this wonderful work.

[Got the Bug]

Or you might look like this....



Trying this again...wrong link.

[PHC1]

I think I found the ultimate example for the Shriner reference!

Shriners mini-cobra | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

[Got the Bug]

Originally Posted by PHC1

I think I found the ultimate example for the Shriner reference!

Shriners mini-cobra | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Nice!!

[Silverback51]

Originally Posted by Mark IV

My take:

• The six speed is wasted in most applications, the T56 has two overdrives ratios and unless you are cruising at high speeds you will be too low in the RPM range on most engines
  
  The TKO600 with the .65 OD is also geared rather high for most uses. Search here and you will find some threads on people who regret the .65 and are looking to change to the .82
  
  Remember that ultra high HP may make for great bragging rights, but unless you can put the to the ground, it is wasted. Anything over 550 is probably not usable on most cars in my opinion, your results may vary.

I agree. The .65 OD is a waste at anything below 70 MPH, and I have 3.73 gears in the rear.

[D-CEL]

Im almost 6’3” and 285 and no problem fitting. The bigger problem for me is the size 13 shoe. Narrow driving shoe makes it a lot easier to work the pedals.
On the HP issue: Big or small, if it makes an honest 500+ hp it will be a fast car and plenty for your first stint in a Cobra. Note: Tires are critical! Run as big and sticky as you can fit with whatever wheel you choose.
Small blocks are 100+ lbs lighter and are easier to work around because of their size.
Big blocks can make that amount of power a little cheaper and with a longer useable torque band.

Durability is a wash give the same build quality.
Gears: Really depends on the set-up. Motor, tire, desired usage. A .65 5th and 3.73 seems to be common and acceptable to most. I like a little more RPM in high gear so I run 4.10s

Resale: Who cares! Buy Build it for you today.


Jason

[Got the Bug]

Jason.

Same thing. My shoe size is also 13 and there's no way I can wear anything bulky like a cross trainer. I have to wear driving shoes or Puma's.

[Intouch]

Roush 427 IR fuel injected is as good as it gets performance and sound wise....
There are some installers/dealers that will do some extra mods to the brake setup and suspension. i would recommend having a look into these options if you want the car to behave a little better than the stock superformance does.