Main Menu
|
Nevada Classics
|
Advertise at CC
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
1 |
2 |
3 |
4 |
5 |
6 |
7 |
8 |
9 |
10 |
11 |
12 |
13 |
14 |
15 |
16 |
17 |
18 |
19 |
20 |
21 |
22 |
23 |
24 |
25 |
26 |
27 |
28 |
29 |
30 |
31 |
|
|
|
|
|
CC Advertisers
|
|
04-16-2008, 09:02 AM
|
|
Renegade Nuns on Wheels
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: columbus,
Oh
Cobra Make, Engine: Unique 427 roadster with 351C-4B
Posts: 5,129
|
|
Not Ranked
Zinc and the flat tappet cam
While this topic have been covered well, a nice article in the recent Circle Track had some confirmation of what I am others have been saying. I truly enjoy Circle Track for the tech articles even though I have never, and may never, set foot on a circle track. Good stuff that applies.
Anyways, the article goes on to confirm the 1200 - 1500 ppm for flat tappet cams, reminds us about phosphorus as well and talks about some specific oils such as Brad Penn. It also made me aware of a product I was not familiar with (or forgot about!) ZDDP Plus.
It also brought back up a good investment if you are running a flat tappet cam, nitriding. A number of cam manufacturer, including Comp Cams, offer the service in house for a very reasonable sum... about $150. Claims have been made as high as a near zero lobe failure rate and life spans of 10 -12 times longer. Sounds almost to good to be true doesn't it?
And, it has one of the best common sense recommendations... talk to the cam manufacturer. They know what kills their cams.
Nothing ground breaking here for those who have followed the discussion, more a confirmation.
|
04-16-2008, 11:23 AM
|
|
Half-Ass Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,004
|
|
Not Ranked
GM EOS Reinstated
And, btw, GM reinstated their EOS. I have not seen a VOA on the new stuff as I still have a case of the old stuff -- so I can't tell you that I'm 100% sure that it's the same. But I'm sure a VOA will turn up on BITOG soon. Here's a link to the new stuff: http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results...partnumber=EOS
|
04-16-2008, 11:28 AM
|
|
Renegade Nuns on Wheels
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: columbus,
Oh
Cobra Make, Engine: Unique 427 roadster with 351C-4B
Posts: 5,129
|
|
Not Ranked
I didn't know that GM brought back the EOS. Some more good info. Here is the ZDDP Plus info http://www.zddplus.com/
|
04-16-2008, 11:45 AM
|
|
CC Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Hickory,
NC
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427SC w/427so, ERA GT #2002
Posts: 1,106
|
|
Not Ranked
To ensure the oil has a sufficient percentage of ZDDP, one good way you can do it is purchase Joe Gibb's oil . . . very pricey . . . or Brad Penn, which is refinned from Pennsylvania crude. Both have sufficiently high concentrations of ZDDP to protect your flat tappet cam. Gibb's oil is expensive, but considering the cost of rebuilding your engine . . . Brad Penn can be had for a "reasonable" price. Either way, good oil costs less that a wiped cam lobe. I follow the "Pay me now or pay me later" rule.
Brad Penn web site: http://www.bradpennracing.com/News/june192007.html
__________________
Tom
"If you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough HORSEPOWER." Mark Donohue
|
04-16-2008, 11:52 AM
|
|
Renegade Nuns on Wheels
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: columbus,
Oh
Cobra Make, Engine: Unique 427 roadster with 351C-4B
Posts: 5,129
|
|
Not Ranked
Joe Gibb's oil is another they mention by name in the article.
|
04-16-2008, 02:07 PM
|
|
Senior Club Cobra Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: saratoga,
ca
Cobra Make, Engine: Kirkham #185, Shelby Alloy 482; sold
Posts: 1,190
|
|
Not Ranked
Redline is about to market a synthetic with ZDDP and other anti-wear additives soon.
__________________
Dave
|
04-16-2008, 06:41 PM
|
CC Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lakeland,
FL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427SC FMS 351W
Posts: 199
|
|
Not Ranked
Users of Zddplus
Who has used this additive? Probably difficult to know whether is works until many miles. Is the Zddplus available only from the website?
|
04-16-2008, 06:49 PM
|
|
Senior Club Cobra Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2004
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 1,226
|
|
Not Ranked
Use CJ-4 (diesel oil) and don't worry about additives. It has 1200PPM or you can still get CI-4 at truck supply stores and it has 1500PPM. The new GM EOS is the same as the old with the exception of added calcium as a detergent. It is used for assembly and the initial breaking in of new cams but not to be used regularly.
Jim
|
04-17-2008, 03:19 AM
|
|
Senior Club Cobra Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Covington,
wa
Cobra Make, Engine: Superformance # 532, 466 BB, 560HP
Posts: 3,027
|
|
Not Ranked
High zinc oil is also good for roller cams if you are running a steel gear on your distributor.
|
04-17-2008, 06:33 AM
|
Senior Club Cobra Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: VALLEY FORGE,
PA
Cobra Make, Engine: SUPERFORMANCE w DOUG MEYER ENGINE
Posts: 1,958
|
|
Not Ranked
Does Valvoline VR1 conventional oil have enough zinc?
|
04-17-2008, 06:53 AM
|
|
Renegade Nuns on Wheels
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: columbus,
Oh
Cobra Make, Engine: Unique 427 roadster with 351C-4B
Posts: 5,129
|
|
Not Ranked
According to the data sheet: http://www.valvoline.com/products/VR...otor%20Oil.pdf
Yep, but at the very bottom end.
For those of you looking to see if what your favorite oil contains, Google it. ZDDP is a widely discussed topic and part of virtually any oils data sheet.
|
10-30-2008, 06:11 PM
|
CC Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rolla,
MO
Cobra Make, Engine: Shell Valley, '67 Cobra, 1966 427 sideoiler, 2x4s, w/NASCAR toploader
Posts: 126
|
|
Not Ranked
ZDDP Plus
I have been using ZDDP Plus for the past few years. The last time I ordered from the website I ordered a case. This way I always have some on hand when I decide to freshen up the oil and filters.
As to wear...I have no idea how well it works. But considering the investment in a 427 sideoiler with a flat tappet solid lifter motor. why would you not run it? Besides, there is too much information on the web that documents the need for it. If Comp Cams says it is needed, I'll use it.
Bob
|
10-30-2008, 06:54 PM
|
|
Senior Club Cobra Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Southern Connecticut,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF - 351W, 944 non-turbo
Posts: 2,105
|
|
Not Ranked
I recently spoke with a tech guy at Mobil1. He told me the ZDDP level in their 5W-30 was not enough for my flat tappet Windsor. He told me the ZDDP level in Mobil1 5W-30 was 800 PPM or less (thus the starburst).
I then bought a case of 5W-30 synthetic from another producer and dumped 9 quarts of it into my engine. I did this because their tech guy assured me that the ZDDP level in their product was around 1200 PPM ZDDP. I also took a sample of the new oil and sent it out to be analyzed. When I get the results I will post them on this thread. Last year I sent a sample of the Mobil1 5W-30 and the ZDDP level came in under 800 PPM.
BTW, according to both the Mobil1 guy and the other guy it's not so much the zinc but rather the phosphorous that prevents the wear.
Bob
|
10-30-2008, 07:15 PM
|
|
Backdraft Racing Dealer
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Haven,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft Racing
Posts: 5,119
|
|
Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobra 29
Who has used this additive? Probably difficult to know whether is works until many miles. Is the Zddplus available only from the website?
|
We sell it and use it: http://www.vintage-motorsports.com/s...cat=264&page=1
|
10-30-2008, 07:22 PM
|
|
Half-Ass Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,004
|
|
Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cashburn
|
Your web page says: "The chart below compares the amount of ZDDP in ZddPlus to GM EOS, an additive which claims to provide ZDDP based wear protection." But there's no chart?
|
10-30-2008, 08:00 PM
|
|
Backdraft Racing Dealer
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Haven,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft Racing
Posts: 5,119
|
|
Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt
Your web page says: "The chart below compares the amount of ZDDP in ZddPlus to GM EOS, an additive which claims to provide ZDDP based wear protection." But there's no chart?
|
This one?
|
10-30-2008, 08:03 PM
|
|
Half-Ass Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2005
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum
Posts: 22,004
|
|
Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cashburn
This one?
|
Yes, I bought a case of the old EOS before it changed. I use it along with Brad Penn with my solid, flat tappet FE. Aside from the additive, what oil do you fancy?
|
10-30-2008, 08:08 PM
|
|
Backdraft Racing Dealer
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Haven,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft Racing
Posts: 5,119
|
|
Not Ranked
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt
Yes, I bought a case of the old EOS before it changed. I use it along with Brad Penn with my solid, flat tappet FE. Aside from the additive, what oil do you fancy?
|
Actually, planning on moving to a new offering:
http://www.roushoil.com/10w-30.html
|
10-30-2008, 08:10 PM
|
|
Backdraft Racing Dealer
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Haven,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft Racing
Posts: 5,119
|
|
Not Ranked
And they have a specific formula for break-in:
http://www.roushoil.com/sae-40.html
|
10-30-2008, 08:13 PM
|
|
Backdraft Racing Dealer
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Haven,
CT
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft Racing
Posts: 5,119
|
|
Not Ranked
And another chart for ya:
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is On
|
|
|
All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:42 PM.
Links monetized by VigLink
|