T56, Quicktime Bellhousing, Clutch forks - advice please

[sspano01]

Hello,

I have a T56 Magnum originally setup for the mcleod hydraulic TOB, quicktime bellhousing, and mcleod dual RST twin clutch.

I have considered not using the mcleod HTOB, because I am little worried about these failures people talk about with them. Is this still an issue with the new HTOBs from McLeod?

I then bought a standard mechanical TOB and fork. THe TOB and fork fit in the transmission, however, i cannot get any gap between the TOB and the pressure plate fingers. THis is because the standard Ford racing fork is too tall and pushes the TOB into the fingers.

I have cut down the sides of the ford fork by nearly 50%. This makes the fork thinner and I can then get the TOB clearance I need.

What is the strength of the ford fork? Should I be worried about the fork being to weak now?

Anyone have any thoughts? I am considering going back to the McLeod HTOB, because that fits & clearances fine. I just didnt want to have a known reliabilty issue with the HTOB....However, I dont want a weak fork either.

Can anyone offer any suggestions?

Thanks

[sharkx]

I can probably help. I've been down this road myself.

You have an SN95 style fork. As you noted, this fork is way to wide for the bellhousing and it won't fit the TOB very well. If you machine it, it will fail.

What you really need is an older Fox style fork. The Fox fork is narrower by design and will fit the quicktime bellhousing perfectly.

The Fox fork does have an issue though. It's too short by about 1.5 inches. Fortes parts sells bolt on extensions to increase the length of the fork.

I'm using a mechanical linkage myself. But if I were use a hydraulic TOB again, I'll use an external slave. I will never use an internal hydraulic TOB again. If you find you have a defective internal hydraulic TOB, you get to pull the engine and tranny. If you have a defective external slave, you replace it.

Sharkx

[PANAVIA]

2nd on the Fox Fork - the later fork is too big. --

almost 4000mi on my fox forked T56 with 0 issues . - even used a fox TOB.

[sspano01]

Interesting! So...i want a clutch fork from an 79-93 Mustang 5.0L? The fox body 5.0 clutch? This will be "thinner" than my SN95 fork and that will get me the clearance I need? But it needs to be longer to get out of the bellhousing.

Does anyone have an exact part# for a fork that you have ordered?
Do you know if there is an purchaseable fork that has already been extended?

Thanks!

[sspano01]

also....what is your pedal pressue like? on your T56?

Thanks

[blykins]

Steve,

I didn't know you were a Club Cobra guy.

I got a response from Quicktime, but I haven't got a response back from my Tremec guy.

I can get a Fox body clutch fork, no problem....and I can get them an inch longer as well for big block applications (these are extended length single piece forks, not bolt on extensions). If you want to try one, let me know.

As for pedal pressure, it shouldn't be heavy at all, unless you have a HUGE master cylinder.

[blykins]

Ok, got a response from my Tremec guy who has done several of these installations in the past few weeks. Here is the only way that he could get this setup to work, including trying a Fox body clutch fork.

Here's a recap:

*The quill tube has to be shortened by 3/8".
*You can use the SN95 clutch fork
*The midplate webbing has to be clearanced for the clutch fork to clear.
*You have to use a Lakewood 15502 ball stud, which is the short one. You have to basically run it almost all the way in, but this still gives you enough room for the fork to clip on.

What we can do is offer a midplate swap. If you send your new midplate in, we will swap you a new modified midplate that has had the quill tube removed, turned down, and pressed back in, the webbing clearanced, and the Lakewood ball stud installed. The cost of the swap including the machine work is $150 + shipping.

This will eliminate your problem totally.

[sharkx]

As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words. First up is an SN95 fork. As you can see, it's wedged up against the bellhousing and it's still got an inch to go before you could even think about getting on the ball stud. If that's not bad enough, even if it did fit, the "hump" on the fork that pushed against the TOB would be shifted too far to the outside.



Next up is a Fox fork. As you can see it fits fine, the geometry is good but is a little short.



And finally is the finished product. A Fox fork with an adjustable extension installed



The orginal part number for the fork is E6ZZ-7515-A, however there are lots of aftermarket forks available with the same dimensions that may be stronger.

I'm pretty happy with the pedal pressure. It's not an old ladies clutch but it doesn't take a lot of force either. I'm using a RAM clutch, so your mileage may vary.

Sharkx

[blykins]

Sharkx,

Good pictures.

I take it that since the Fox fork was too short that you are working on a BBF application as well, correct? And it's a twin disc as well, right?

I'll talk to my Tremec supplier again, but he said that there was no way that a Fox fork would work with the ones that he's been doing....must be a different variable somewhere.

If the fork is all it takes to make it work, I can get the extended length Fox forks.

[blykins]

Also, yours is not a Magnum T-56 either is it? Yours is a 10 spline....

[sspano01]

Hello

My particular is a T56 Magnum, 26 spline input, 31 output
The issue I am having does not appear to be a problem with the bellhousing, i have plenty of bellhousing clearance.

The problem I have is that the fork itself is too thick to get the TOB down far enough on the retainer sleeve. My fork contacts the face of the transmission itself. I have shaved about 0.200" off the entire length of the SN95 fork I was using for measuring/testing and now I can get maybe 0.020" of gap between the pressure plate fingers and the TOB surface. I think I need to get to about 0.100" gap to be safe. However, that would require taking a total of 0.300" of the entire length of the SN95 fork which I am sure will make it too weak and then it will bend on me at some point.

If the fox fork is in fact "thinner" than the SN95, then that may work for me.

If not, then that's probably why the tremec guy says use an SN95 fork but then he machined down his transmission to get it all to fit together.

I was hoping to find a part that would work in here a little nicer. I dont really want to take the front of my transmission off to have it machined.

Maybe I should just use the Hydraulic MCLEOD TOB and see how it goes? But if it leaks....i have to take everything apart.

Decisions....Decisions.....

[sspano01]

also, part of my other issue is that I have a McLeod dual disc clutch, which probably sits closer to the TOB than a single disc clutch would. I would think if I had a single disc clutch, the SN95 fork probably would have worked for me, or been alot closer perhaps

I have about 1.730" from the mouting face of the belhousing (plane that the transmission bolts to) down to the pressure plate fingers.

So I have to get the TOB surface no more than about 1.630 down from the mounting face of the bellhousing.

Using the stock SN95, it was sitting at about 2.050, depressing the clutch. This again was because the fork winds up resting against the face of the transmission. So that's how i started cutting material off the sides of the SN95 fork to see if I can even get it to play properly.

Maybe I can use it as a template when I am done and have a billet solid fork machined as a custom part?

[blykins]

If you want to try an extended length Fox fork, they are $70 + shipping. They are zinc dichromated. If it doesn't work, you can return it.

[sharkx]

blykins - The T56 is an older T56. The quill tube advice is spot on though. Mine was too long as well.

[sspano01]

just an update here.
I tried a fox fork......issue still remains in that the fork contacts the transmission surface and I cannot get the TOB back far enough from the pressure plate. That's probably why blykin's tremec guy says he used an SN95 fork and then machined down the front of the transmission to get the required clearance.

What I really need is a clutch fork that is "flat", like if it was made out of 3/8 plywood. That would get me the right setup for my TOB.

So....I have sent my bellhousing up to Mike Forte. He makes those billet flat forks and can setup a whole external slave. I took a bunch of pictures, dimensions, and overnighted my bellhousing up to him...so he has it today.

Hopefully in a week or so I will get it back and everything will setup properly.

Thanks for the pictures and tips though!

[Caprimaniac]

Hello, Sspan.

Does your T56 Magnum sit beheind a small block Ford 302 or 351?

If so, I would like to hear what gearbox, clutch housing, pilot bearing and throw-out bearing and part number you use, and if the gearbox ingoing axle had to be machined and modified.

Hope you'll pass on this information.

RS

[blykins]

Capri,

If you're interested, I can provide all the correct part numbers for this kind of installation, without having to go to a special billet fork and slave cylinder.

[sspano01]

my t56 sits behind a 429/460
I think Blykins there says that he has a tremec guy who can alter the face of the T56 transmission for the right clearances.

Since I ultimately decided to go with an external slave cylinder, instead of an internal hydraulic TOB, I sent my bellhousing to Forte to see if he can mount the slave cylinder and make a fork as well. That way, ideally, I get back a bolt-on-item that gets me the right clearances

[Caprimaniac]

Brent,

Why not post it here so all can see... Maybe more people want to do this installation?

RS

[mikeforte]

Hi Guys,
I make an external slave/billet fork setup for the T-56 Magnum. I made one for a Hemi/T-56 Magnum, and now just sent one to sspano01.
I'll post some pictures tomorrow.