Richmond 5 speed question

fordracer · #1 (**permalink**) 01-12-2003, 01:50 PM

Does anybody here have any experience with the Richmond ROAD RACE ( not street ) 5 speed ? I went to their web site and there are a lot of nice gear ratios available for the road race version.

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Cal Metal · #2 (**permalink**) 01-12-2003, 03:28 PM

Talk to the Weavers at Unique Motor Cars. They used a Richmond in their Ernie Elliot car but were unimpressed. The shifting gate is awkward. They claimed the balkiness of it cost them a Run and Gun victory. It has since been replaced with a Toploader, I believe.

ToyCollector · #3 (**permalink**) 01-12-2003, 04:11 PM

And they are not CHEAP!! I looked into both the 5 and 6 speed, used and new for a street rod project. They do have their quirks. We ran a 5 speed Doug Nash (aka Richmond now) back in the early 80s behind a 450-500HP Blown small block and it was a stout tranny, but a 4 speed Toploader with the right gearing is fine with me in a Cobra.

Jeff Frigo · #4 (**permalink**) 01-12-2003, 05:28 PM

Straight cut gears, probably too noisy for the street.

fordracer · #5 (**permalink**) 01-13-2003, 07:27 PM

Aren't noise and Cobras one in the same ? Jeff, are you saying that the Richmond Road Race transmission has straight cut gears ?

Cal Metal · #6 (**permalink**) 01-14-2003, 06:56 PM

Jeff:

Are they truly straight cut gears or a less narrow pitch than most transmissions? The infamous M-22 Muncie Rockcrusher (the name given for it sounds as though it is crushing rocks when operating) is a 22 degree helix, while the normal pitch on all other Warner, Muncie, Toploaders is 45 degrees.

Daren Gee · #7 (**permalink**) 01-14-2003, 08:09 PM

I have recently completed building a Cobra and have a Richmond 6 speed. I have been completely happy with the transmission and the gate mechanism. The gate was a bit stiff, but with 2000 miles break in, so far, the shifting has been lightening up nicely. The gate shifting is sharply precise and solid, the way I like it. My understanding of the Richmond is that when they bought the transmission from Doug Nash, they made several improvements to make it more race ready and easier to swap parts. Along with internal improvements, they also managed to get fit a sixth gear for those needing an overdrive. You mentioned that you have a Race model. I understand that there are no differences in the Richmond 5 and 6 speed configurations except for gear ratios. By race model, I assume you have a close ratio version. Interesting enough, I haven't noticed any gear noise from the transmission. I'm running Redline synthetic. However, my exhaust is loud, so I couldn't guarantee that there isn't gear noise either. My transmission guy is friends with his Richmond sales rep, so if you have any specific questions, may be able to find an answer for you. Let me know.

RICK LAKE · #8 (**permalink**) 02-02-2003, 07:28 PM

fordracer I know 3 guys runing the roadracing box in there cobras. I have the smallest of the 3. Darren is confused on his info. G-Force builds a racing 5 speed for drag racing or road racing. Their trans is good for 1100 hp or 1100 tork. This trans is built with all in house parts. Exterally the cases are the same, but inside is all different. The richmond (nash) box is good for 450 hp and 450 ft. of tork. The six speed mount is 2 inches back from the five. I have both trans. The six speed will not power shift under full throttle as where the five speed will. There is a hand cuff support in the racing trans to stop the main shafts from separation. Different sliders are used in these trans. I would need an hour to tell all the differents and witch trans is better for your car. Befor you buy a trans do some research and get info on them. If you want a five speed then get a 308 gear for the rear in your car for the best of both worlds. I race with 3.31 gears and the 5 speed. A good trans is not cheap. Check Kee toploader on C.C., G-Force, Tex racing, Jerico trans. You will pay from 2k to 6k for these trans. Good luck with your choice. Rick Lake

Back in Black · #9 (**permalink**) 02-02-2003, 08:37 PM

Thanks for that post.. my new Richmond 6 speed feels a bit tight going into 3rd, and so I was wondering if it is just new and needs some "marrying"

before she gets smooth.. I have only local miles on her, so have only gone to 4th gear so far...other gears feel sweet.
Have a Centerforce 2 (W/ hydraulic Throwout) clutch, that despite having a slightly leaky/bad "O" ring, is as sweet as can be for shifting. Repair coming this week, and then we can see how the linkage is adjusted, etc...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
UPDATE:
The transmission was WAAY low on fluid.. like several quarts...it came this way from West Coast cobra. Good thing I only put a few easy miles on her, short hops ! She shifts sweet as can be now, and I expect her to get better ! By the way, go with a hydraulic clutch if at all possible, it is sweet!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Daren Gee · #10 (**permalink**) 02-08-2003, 10:12 AM

Rick, thanks for clarifying my misunderstanding regarding racing Richmond racing transmissions. There may be a 5-speed racing model in my future!

About 99 percent of my driving has been under-part throttle conditions, and the information about potential for main shaft separation actually explains something to me. Since I live in the San Jose metropolitan area, there aren't any open roads where I can safely test the car under full throttle near home. So, at part throttle, the transmission is a dream and can be shifted extremely fast, especially after initial break-in ..but at full throttle...hmmm. I have experienced two mis-shifts from 1st to second, under full throttle, while trying to speed shift. Those may be the only two times I have tried putting the pedal to the floor AND shifting as fast as possible (maybe without full clutch disengagement). I had previously chalked those events to user error. But now it seems like I may have tried to shift my transmission TOO fast due to the transmission shafts. It'll be interesting to see how fast I will be able to shift without mis-shifting. If I find shifting is too truck-like for my taste, a racing version may be in my purchase plans.

Regarding gear ratios, I'm running a 3.08 rear end and a 3.27 first gear. I have been thinking about going to a 3.40 rear end ratio, since my 6th gear is barely useable unless I'm going 85 MPH. I've calculated that at redline, my car is geared to go 212 MPH. I doubt 400 HP and 400 ft-lbs could push that much air, and predict a true top speed quite a bit lower. But, the 3.40 would make 1st too low, as I think 1st is too low as it is. I would have to relegate 1st for burn-outs only, and use 2nd thru 6th for everything else. I'm not a big tire spinner, so the new transmission might be coming sooner than later.

To prepare for then, are there any recommendations for an appropriate 1st gear ratio?

Daren Gee

RICK LAKE · #11 (**permalink**) 02-09-2003, 12:26 AM

Darren I have a 3.31 rear. 3.27 in the 6 spd and 3.25 in the 5 spd I have not been able to keep a blower belt on due to a wobble problem with the motor running. My motor is 340 hp and 435 tork on the dyno. A cobra doing 120 mph is quite a fast ride. This car is about has smooth through the air as a barn door. These cars will lift off at 140 mph, the front ends come up. I would like to go 200 mph once but after driving my own a gateway at 125, I need spoilers and more suspension work. I talk to Dick Smith and he said it was one scary ride, he went 198 at Daytona. I car was bouncing down the straight with the front wheels off the ground. Question, how fast does it take for an airplane to lift off? My need for speed has found a safe number. As far as gearing, I do not know what rear end you have in your car. I have a Jag in mine. If you are running the 6spd you may want 3.73 gears. With a 5spd depending on the hp.and tork of the motor, power band, size of tires, 3.08 or 3.23 would be perfect. With gear ratios the carriers are different also. Hope this helps. Rick Lake

M. Farcus · #12 (**permalink**) 02-18-2003, 03:14 PM

Been using one for years....rebuild every couple of years or about 20 events...not to noisy...shifts better with time. Useing a "Long Shifter" modified with heim joints.
Allows one to use a nice rear gear for long tracks, but have lower gears in transmission for short tracks.
Another option is a T101 from Tex Racing...any gear ratio you want (more than Richmond) .... rebuild unit about 3G...good enough for any thing but all out NASCAR....they also do Jerico's

ToyCollector · #13 (**permalink**) 12-12-2003, 02:22 PM

Sorry to rehash an old thread. But thought those that responded may know the answer to this question.

Does the T-101 use gears Jericho that can interchange with a Jericho?

MikeB · #14 (**permalink**) 10-17-2006, 10:39 AM

Sorry to dig up an old thread...

But I'm looking for a used Doug Nash 4+1 or a Richmond 5 speed. Prefer a DNE if possible. I need a 1-1/8 26 spline for a GM engine and 3.27 first gear

If you know of one, drop me a line

Thanks!