TKO/Toploader Dimension Differences

blykins · #1 (**permalink**) 01-19-2007, 05:25 PM

Getting ready to swap my Toploader out for a TKO500. The TKO has a short shaft, so I won't need a spacer.

What should I expect to have to change and by how much? Trans crossmember? Shifter hole location? Unfortunately I sold my Toploader, so I can't compare the two.

I see the shifter location dimension (from the trans flange) is 19.5" on the TKO. If I remember correctly, the Toploader is 20". So I shouldn't have to worry about that, right?

If I'm thinking correctly, I'll have to move the crossmember a little bit, the shifter location should pretty much stay the same, and the driveshaft length should stay the same.

Can anyone confirm?

Jerry Clayton · #2 (**permalink**) 01-19-2007, 06:48 PM

Thats about it except you will probably need to change the front u-joint yoke on the drive shaft. That might entail cutting off the front of the shaft for a different end, but its a simple deal. when you move the crossmember/mount you may have to adjust the height also
When we changed Bob Browns Shell Valley we make a fixture to drill the frame rails so the cross member bolts were 90* frame material was hard, an angle drill is handy to have and use

Jerry
Jerry

blykins · #3 (**permalink**) 01-19-2007, 07:02 PM

How far off was the tranny mount front to rear?

I should be good on the driveshaft yoke....I'm running big u-joints and I should only have to swap out the slip yoke.

Jerry Clayton · #4 (**permalink**) 01-19-2007, 07:51 PM

I didn't record the difference--we removed a T10 and installed a 500, similar to what you are doing,they didn't have the short input shaft available at that time, so we had to use the adapter plate which you aren't using so it would be different\The frame rails are straight there in the Shell Valley so it is just bolt the cross member to to trans and position for height and most favorable driveshaft angle, transfer the hole location and drill 8 holes and bolt in
You will love the 500 and the OD fifth. Hurst has a short curved stick that mounted backwards works nice and you can get a black or white knob for it with the shift pattern on it for the 5 speed. I'll see if I can find the number or maybe Bob will come on here with it and his comments

Jerry

iva bigan · #5 (**permalink**) 03-22-2007, 01:58 AM

blykins

The tremec is longer by 2 5/16" , mounting flange to centre of trans mount.

82ACAUTOCRAFT · #6 (**permalink**) 04-04-2007, 08:11 AM

Why on earth would anyone swap a toploader for a TKO500? silly! Think about it first! the TKO500 has a rock crawler first gear! unuseable unless you run like a 2.88 rear! and the shifting is horrible!

blykins · #7 (**permalink**) 04-04-2007, 09:08 AM

I'm glad you found the exclamation point key.

I swapped it because the shifting is a lot better compared to a Toploader with the 427 Cobra handle offset. Also, I would imagine the TKO500 has a larger torque capacity than a small input Toploader.

Plus it has an OD. I'm running a 3.70 rearend. It would be nice to cruise on the interstate at a reasonable engine speed.

I'm so sorry I let you down. Please forgive me.

Jerry Clayton · #8 (**permalink**) 04-04-2007, 10:04 AM

yes but with the od you don't get the oil temp that you can get buzzing that big motor to a constant 4500-5000 while out on a drive!!!!!and with the od trans and underdrive pulleys you can save wear and tear on your alternator and water pump

Jerry

82ACAUTOCRAFT · #9 (**permalink**) 04-04-2007, 03:58 PM

With a 3.70 rear and such a short first gear, first is useless I bet you start in second most of the time! First is 3.27, fine for a jeep going up the Rubicon but hardly usefull for a road car! You basically now have a 3 speeds with overdrive! Just my 2 cents!

blykins · #10 (**permalink**) 04-04-2007, 04:02 PM

It doesn't matter what gear ratio you have with 550hp and 500 lb-ft of torque. First is gonna be useless no matter what trans you're using.

My 428 makes peak hp at 6500 and peak torque at 5400. With the lower gear, I can really get things moving quickly, and if I choose to cruise, I can cruise at 70mph at a low rpm.

I bought a brand new in the box TKO 500 for $1350. Do you think it's worth the extra $600 to get a TKO RR trans with a higher first gear?

If I have to take off in 2nd, then so be it.

Anthony · #11 (**permalink**) 04-04-2007, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blykins

My 428 makes peak hp at 6500 and peak torque at 5400.

To me, it seems that your rpm's for max torque are a little high, and because of that, you may not have alot low end grunt. My engine made max torque at 3800 rpm's. I'm guessing that your engine will need the extra rpms to get going, and in that case, I would think that a 3.27 first with a 3.7 rear might be the best for your engine characteristics, although I wouldn't recommend your driveline combo for most bigblocks, like 82AC eluded to.

82ACAUTOCRAFT · #12 (**permalink**) 04-09-2007, 01:00 AM

I now have a TKO600 (.82 5th) and a 3.31 rear end (with a Quaife diff) behind a 427 SO, I love it! Before, with the same motor, I had a 3550 with a 3.54 rear end, first gear was useless, because it was way too short and second was a bit too long to launch the car properly without riding the clutch too much! My motor is quite strong, I forgot the exact RPM numbers from the dyno sheet but it was 550Lbs of torque at around 3900rpm.

ModernDriveline · #13 (**permalink**) 05-01-2007, 04:02 PM

3550 and TKO/TKO500 have a 3.27 first with a .68od
TKOII have a 3.27 first with a .82od
TKO600 have 2.87 first with a .64od
TKO600RR have 2.87 first with a .82od.