The Garden State

[turnpike boy]

Y'know, was out soaking up sunshine most all day yesterday...bit brisk, but the sun made up for it.

Now, today, this sh!t again. Car is now insured, registering today in Trenton, gonna have to wait a week again till the crap goes away.

C'mon summer.

[Chaplin]

No Joke, it's freakin' April already. Will it ever end???

Turnpike Boy-
Send me an email or private message. I curious how you went about the regisration process. I'll be doing it in a month or so and am looking for insight.

Thanks,
Mike

[klayfish]

Turnpike boy,
I had the car out just the other weekend. Got Rita's water ice and all. Now this...what the hell?!?!?

All the more reason to look forward to warm weather and the Cobra Revolution. Are you coming?

Steve

[turnpike boy]

KFish, wouldn't miss your stomp for the world. But I am praying for some decent weather before then to shake out all that needs shaking out.

Really looking forward to this - got my app off the website just Friday, will mail between today and tomorrow.

Chaplin - you got mail.

- c'mon sunshine!

[turnpike boy]

Oops. Chaplin - need an email address to get to you.

[Chaplin]

sorry about that-
mchaplyn@aol.com

[klayfish]

By the way, guys, best of luck with the Jersey registration. I understand it isn't as bad as some states. I'd be curious to hear how it went. Remember, if you want some straight answers as far as insurance end, I work for an insurance company (I know a little about registration too, or at least what not to do).

Chaplin, obviously, my invitation to the Revolution was for everyone. Hope you can make it too. I bet you are counting the days to delivery, huh? I wouldn't be able to sleep.

Steve

[Chaplin]

Klayfish-
I know that was an open invite. Depending on where I am in the build process, I may make it. If the car is together and running by that time, I'll be there . . . otherwise I'm in the garage until it's finished

I picked up my motor Saturday morning and spent the better part of Saturday and Sunday in the garage staring at it making funny engine sounds. Car is at the painter right now, so hopefully another 4-6 weeks it will be in garage. Can't wait . . .

[Rob_R]

I would be happy to tell you about the NJ Titling and registartion process as i am preparing for it right now. I have been on the phone with the head of special titles and a few other folks at DMV. I can tell you that they will work with you. I will try to type up what I know tonight and add it to this thread.

Robert

[Rob_R]

Okay, here is what I know about NJ Kit Car titling & registration....
The vehicle will be titled as the year it was completed. The vehicle will have to have the "pollution equipment" required for the year and model of the engine block installed. The literature states that sidepipes require a heat shield. And of course, you need a front license plate. Here are the steps:
1) complete your car
2) send in all the paperwork, including MCO, receipts for kit, engine, and major components. They would like the VIN of the vehicle that the engine came from. Ohterwise a letter from the selling person explaining that this is a 35 year old block and can't be traced to a specific vehicle will do.
3) DMV will make an appointment to come to your house or you can make an appointment to trailer the vehicle to 1 of 3 special inspection stations for an "engineering inspection". During this inspection they will be all over your car, including under it. They will be checking casting numbers on the block and looking for the pollution equipment required for that year block. They are not interested in seeing the car run at this point.
4) Once you are issued a title, you may register your vehicle....but not as collector car! No kit cars can be registered as collector car according to the Richard Dittmar of DMV. This means the normal bi-annual inspections with a pollution requirement (sniffer test) based on the year of the block.

You can talk to these folks and ask what pollution equipment is required on the year block you are planning on using.

Titling using "other methods" will hide the fact that you are titling a kit car. Fraud, if you ask me, and you are opening yourself up to lawsuit city if an improperly inspected (no engineering inspection) kit car is involved in a serious accident.

I was unaware of the NJ DMV engine requirements when I built my car. As such, I had to pull my FMS crate 392 stroker and I just purchased a '66 428 FE motor. I hope no one else has to do this. The bottom line......the DMV folks are very helpful and they are not out to ruin your fun.

Robert

[Chaplin]

Robert-
Thanks for the info. However, as everything with DMV goes, I have heard some conflicting information.

First, I heard that they will NOT send an inspector to your house. I was told that they used to do that, but no more. I was told that you have to make an appointment to bring the car in and that either (i) you have to trailer the car to 1 of the 3 "special" inspection stations or (ii) DMV will issue you a temporary 5-day registration so that you can drive the car to one of the 3 inspection sites. If you car fails the engineering inspection and you can remedy the defect within that initial 5 day temporary registration period, you can drive it back and try again. If it can not be fixed within that first five days, it has to be trailered back to one of the 3 inspection sites.

Second, I have never heard that the collector registration is not available for kit cars (and I've talked to Rich and others is Trenton several times). I believe that there are several people who have used the collector registration for their kits. Can someone verify this?

Does your car have the rectangular lucas taillight lenses on it? If so, you may have a problem with the engineering inspection because the lucas taillight lenses do not have a DOT or SAE number on them. (In the engineering inspection they make sure that all glass and turn signal lenses must have DOT or SAE numbers). I was told by those that do the engineering inspections that they can (will?) fail the car for that. I have been looking for similarly shaped taillight lenses with SAE numbers on them to use as subsititues but haven't found anything suitable yet.

Keep me posted as you go through the process, because I'd love to see what really happens.

Thanks again for your help.

[Rob_R]

Hi Chaplin,

Thanks for the heads up on the tail lights and turn signals. Yes, I do have the rectangular tail lights. I will have to look at mine tonight.

As you say, there are conflicting reports coming out of DMV. I spoke with Richard Dittmar about 1 month ago. I do not believe I misunderstood Richard when he told me that kit cars could not be registered under collector car status. I specifically told him that was my intention and he responded that I would not be allowed to do that. We do need further clarification on that if anyone has experience there.

Richard when on to tell me the requirements for an engineering inspection at your home - concrete floor and good lighting. Richard also said that a special inspection station visit could be scheduled within 2 weeks where as a home visit by the inspector would take a month to schedule. He gave me the name of Mr Peterson and his number. Mr Peterson is the guy in charge at the Asbury Park station. This is one of the three special stations in the state. I was able to ask Mr Peterson some very specific questions about what pollution equipment would be required for a '69 351 block. It turns out that Mr Peterson would be the guy coming to my house if that is the route I take.

I have not heard of the 5 day registration but that sounds like the way to go.

I will initiate this process in about 1 month. I will keep you guys posted on my progress.

Robert

[Chaplin]

Robert-
Just for curiousity sake, what pollution equipment did he say would be required for your '69 351? Is is subject to the tail pipe probe and sniff test? If so, did he tell you what the requirements (limits) are for hydro-carbons, etc?

As far as I know I think the only thing that is required is a pcv, but I could be wrong.

Thanks,
Mike

[Rob_R]

Chaplin,
I became aware of the engineering inspection and that 1 area they focus on is installed pollution equipment for the year of the motor. When I found that out, I looked at my alternatives. I had a new 351 based 392 stroker that had to be replaced. The oldest 351 is '69. In order to play by their rules, I asked what equipment was required for that motor. The first response was to see what Ford said was required. I would not accept that answer. I stated that I merely wanted to abide the rules and I wanted to know what was their source of information for the rules they enforce. I was told to call back a day later. The answer was a PCV valve only. I did not ask for the acceptable levels of various pollutants. I have been told by several sources that there is a significant jump in requirements from 67 to 68 model years. There is another nasty jump from, I believe, 71 to 72. I am not positive exactly where that early 70's jump is.

I chose to abandon the 351 based motors only to rid my car of any significant pollution requirements. I think a '69 351 would be fairly easy to keep on track during inpections. Be careful, the early 351 motors had a different deck height than the later years. I purchased a '66 428 so as to avoid worrying about sniffer tests. With the '66, your eyes may tear from the exhaust, but it will still pass.

I do believe that with regular inspections, just about any year vehicle is subject to the sniffer. Only the target levels change. Some Diesel trucks are exempt.

Let me know if you have any more insight on the process.

Robert

[JWheaton]

This is a good thread.

Please continue to post your learnings. I will probably be living in the Garden State by the time I complete my car.

Jamie

[Chaplin]

Rob-
I too am using a 66 428 for just the reasons you described. However, I was doing some research this afternoon and from what I have been able to ascertain, I do not think there are any emissions requirements pre-1968, someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
In 1967, Congress passed the Air Quality Act which gave the fed. government the authority to set certain clean air standards for all states. The federally mandated emissions requirements became effective in 1968. Therefore, if what I have found is right, pre-1968 NJ did not have any established standards for the sniff test and, therefore, a pre-68 engine may not even be subject to the sniff test. A PCV may be all you need. Passage of the Air Quality Acit may explain the significant jump in 67 to 68 that you were referring to. As for the early 70's, I know there was a significant change in requirements from 74 to 75 with the advent of catalytic converters.

I am going to try and contact someone at DMV to find out what the emissions requirements are, if any, for pre-68 cars. I'll let you know what I find out.

Also, let me know if your SPF taillights have an SAE or DOT number. If they do, I'll buy a set from SPF.

Mike

[Roscoe]

I believe kit cars CAN be registered as collector. I know many who have this registration. You may want to contact the NJ Replicar Club who was instrumental in getting the classification. They have many contacts at DMV and know the regulation.

http://www.njreplicar.org/

Roscoe

[Rob_R]

Mike,
I looked at my SPF tail lights and there are no DOT or SAE markings that I can see. These are Lucas lenses, if that means anything. I spoke with someone who put 2 ERA Cobras and 1 ERA GT40 through the engineering inspection. He said the only comment about lenses that he got were that the GT40 tail lights were a bit too low to the ground. He still passed. Perhaps individual inspectors are different in what they look at. I guess a call to ERA is in order to ask if their tail lights are DOT approved. (I visited there about 2 months ago...impressive folks)

Roscoe,
Thanks for the link. I will contact these guys to see what their experience has been with NJ registrations.

Robert

[Rob_R]

Hmmm. This is interesting - from the website that Roscoe posted.

http://www.njreplicar.org/back/back_art.cfm?ID=128

The article supports the fact the kit cars CAN be registered as collector cars.

I don't know why the DMV guy told me that this was not possible with kit cars. Oh well, as said earlier, there is a lot of conflicting information coming out of NJ DMV.

[Roscoe]

Sometimes one is too smart by half and screws up the process by asking too many questions and, literally, talking themselves out of a successful conclusion to a problem.

Roscoe